My money is in trust so we wil see what happens. Where is sympathy in the dictionary?

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Here is the receiver report on the Sophia project. Makes for very good reading. Tonnes of insight into Vancouver real estate with complete frankness. I enjoyed reading it.

The points that I picked up out of it was that the Eden developer was inexperienced and got a bit panicky during the marketing stage and sold a lot of the units at a discount, and that as usual the best units went to his friends, and the consultants working on the project.

This whole pre-sale thing is so corrupt. The architects, consultants and others get first crack at the best units.

Reminds me of my telecom boom days when the pre-ipo pricing was given to ‘friends/family’ and john q public had to pay the market price.

We all know how that ended…

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But, I just can’t help thinking about who would be buying those multi-million dollar homes everyday for weeks that I see on Paul’s numbers? I don’t think they are the wannabees and poseurs (maybe, some who have pooled their resources). And, maybe, like your family scullboy, (regarding buying those works of art) they don’t see the property to be under-or over-valued, just valuable, or even just what they fancy. Money is a non issue to them and they don’t buy for the express purpose of making money. But, it’s no coincidence they buy into assets that at worse will protect their money.

Maybe, if you can shed light on these buyers, I’ll have a better insight into what’s driving this market.

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This is how hard it is for me and I am relatively privileged given that I did well in school, I have a decent job, and I’m good at saving money. I can only imagine how hopeless it is for people less fortunate than me.

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Thanks for the head’s up. I was born in Antigonish, Nova Scotia…. went to Jr. high with Ashley MacIsaac and senior high with Julian from the Trailor Park Boys. Seriously.

I know about the pitfalls of life in NS but may because to get around it. My family still own a couple of oil companies there, which means both a source of employment, and free home heating as a benefit :).

You don’t really get anywhere unless you’re related to the right person, vote for the right person or sleep with the right person…. and sometimes (brrrrr!) all three…

That being said there are pockets of work to be had that are fairly reliable and the cost of living is sooooo much cheaper out there, it certainly makes a move worth considering.

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In his book, Shiller mentions that we have come to depend on rising asset prices to increase our standard of living. First it was two earners per family and when that couldn’t cut it, we became a bubble society. If we did not have asset bubbles we would experience a declining standard of living. For those of us who have missed out on the bubbles, that is exactly what we are experiencing - as our income and savings buy less and less.

This is part of the free market ideology that has dominated North America (perhaps the world) and was translated into political policy in the USA by Bush’s “ownership society.” If this is the economic model of today and the future, what does it mean? Do we have to get on the bus or be left behind?

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Obviously, the rich are,nt rich because they’re stupid.

Unfortunately, such simple logic appears to be far beyond the reach of some of the mental midgets on realestatetalks and Chipmans blog.

That “rich foreigners” shit is getting ever more difficult to cope with.

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A few weeks later my wife and I were shopping and we ran into this same woman and she was working in a dollar store!
For some reason she wanted us peasants to think she didn’t work????

Arrogance or Ignorance? I’m not too bright myself but I can’t see what she’s thinking looking down her nose at other people for.
No one is better than another. We’re just lucky we weren’t born in a country where our parents sold us into prostitution when we were 12 or a town where you are woken up in the middle of the night to see your entire family slaughtered.

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We lived in Halifax from 1996-2006 and had a lot of good times. We sold our two unit house when we left despite it being possibly cash flow positive. It was an old house and needed too much work to manage from afar. Bring in manager fees and regular repairs, and it was no longer cash flow positive.

A couple of things to keep in mind about Halifax. Heating costs are very high, especially for older homes, so that takes a bite into the otherwise affordable real estate. Taxes will tend to be higher than BC too.

Also, have some longterm work lined up before you go. There are many, many over-educated, underemployed people in Halifax. There are lots of jobs, but nothing good unless you have certain highly demanded skills. Think about your career before you move there, particularly if you believe we are about to have a worldwide recession.

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I’m starting to think the same thing. Anywhere is “the best place on earth” if you have the money to enjoy it. I could buy a really nice home in a really nice part of town. Because so many people left for the West, they’re dying for talented people. It’s looking pretty tempting. Then again, so is Miami. Hell at this point NYC is looking pretty good, it’s expensive but at least you can make money there!

I was hanging out at a friend’s place in Burnaby by Renfew yesterday trying to cheer myself up. Honestly, I’m not sure where all the hype in Van comes from. Except for Yaletown, Coal Harbour and the West End, the city’s kind of shabby. I’m not exactly sure where the whole “livabaility” thing coems from….

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Friends just sold their overpriced house in the burbs and are heading back to Halifax. They will be buying a beautiful house cash and buying a boat. As well throwing a few hundred K in the bank. With price differences that big it just makes no sense. I don’t care how beautiful Vancouver is, Halifax is no slouch. Hmmm no mortgage, boat and a wad of cash in the bank all for the price of a crummy house in the burbs over here ( that still had a mortgage).

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AMEN! The rich do NOT get richer pay laying out a lot of cash. My dad is in the top… ooooo maybe 0.5% of earners in this country. The man’s got piles of money and life the rest of his family, by and large he’s *CHEAP*. I mean mind bogglingly cheap! I was talking to him the other day, and he mentioned he wanted to visit Vancouver for a week. He pretty much invited himself to stay at my place.

“Uhhhhh, Dad” I said “I don’t think you understand how I’m living out here. I”m with someone now, and we’re splitting a 400 square foot apartment. There really isn’t any room”

“Oh don’t worry, I’ll just sleep on the floor.” (!!!!!!)

“Uh, Dad, I don’t have that much floor space available”.

Seriously.

The rich don’t get rich or stay rich buy purchasing overpriced assets. They find things that are expensive yet undervalued,and buy those up. I would think after it’s all said and done, there will be bargains in places like London and New York for instance.

My folks got into art a while back and made some purchases they felt were valuable. Sure enough the value of those particular artists skyrocketed and now they’re sitting on assets worth double what they paid a while back.

No, me dear evergreen, it isn’t the rich who made this place unaffordable. It’s the ordinary people who stampeded in, propelled by a mixture of greed and fear.

And yes, it’s my misfortune that I must wait. I chose to come out here, so I have to live with the consequences. Still, having come from a place where the real estate is pricey but within reach, and having been born in a party of the country where real estate is seriously undervalued, I’m a bit stunned by Vancouver.

You know which part of the country is being bough up by wealthy foreigners? Atlantic Canada. Nobody reports on this but Europeans have been snapping up that part of the country. You can get a house on the ocean there for 100K. It’s changing the nature of Nova Scotia. Building signs are in English French and German!

If I were to choose real estate to purchase as an investment, it would be there. Outstanding infrastructure, good neighborhoods, quiet place…. in 20 years it will be the place to be. And if you’re “investing”, it seems like the way to go…

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You couldn’t be more wrong. The rich get that way by buying low and selling high. Is Li Ka-Shing buying Vancouver condos or selling them? Is he driving prices up or pushing them down?

The people buying today are the wannabees and poseurs, who are going to be the nouveau poor.

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Talk about spin. The article uses February YOY figures to give the impression that prices in Calgary are still going up. In fact they peaked summer 2007 and have fallen 10% since. Note that they report an insignificant fractional % gain from December to January to continue the deception. Prices always start falling months before YOY declines, typically around 6 months.

If you know anything at all about math you can see that the author of the article knows this and is trying to tap dance around it.

In fact Calgary seems to be shaping up for a major condo debacle, with SFH surely to follow. See Alberta Bubble for details.

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I found something all of us can afford!!! This is it everyone!!! V686341 Check it out.

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“That’s your misfortune”. And mine. Sorry scullboy to foist Rhett Butler onto you, but then you’re the resident English Prof.

I have long since given up hopes of buying a property. Remember, the rich gets richer. I believe that they have made Vancouver RE truly unaffordable. This is something, with time, more people will accept. The only real challenge left now is to predict the direction of the market.

And DaMann, I can relate to your story. I couldn’t even afford that $230K property in 2004. Don’t feel too bad towards your ‘friend’, I’ve been told the same (many times). Those “fundamentals” exist only in classrooms. This is the real world of Canada. And yes, the US is not Canada. Don’t believe? Here are real Numbers for Saskatoon, Regina, Edmonton, and Winnipeg:

Calgary housing prices

Don’t look like a quick rush for the exits anytime soon.

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5:00 p.m. to 8:00 p.m.
Best Western Sands Hotel, Capilano Room,
1755 Davie Street

http://www.wera.bc.ca/index.php?itemid=424

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I think there is some hidden truth in the last few posts. In Vancouver, there is no lower, middle or upper class. There are no blue or whete collar workers. There are no levels of education.

There are only renters and owners. Whether we like it or not, that is the line that divides us.

My ex from Toronto is Colombian. He and his family worked like hell to make it in Canada. They purchased a small business and worked VERY hard to make it float. They weren’t too proud to work at jobs you or I might not want. I was really impressed with their desire to make it in Canada.

I compare that with a lot of the people in Vancouver who landed here at the right time, lucked into a property and now think they’re Donald Trump.

It certainly explains people like Krrish. I refuse to believe the man was born here, or grew up here. His English is simply too bad. He strikes me as one of these newcomers who managed to scrape up enough money in 2000 - 2001 to manage a downpayment. He can probably barely afford the payments on his place but that’s ok because on paper, he’s made 200,000 dollars.

I expect he parades around like he’s Bob Rennie’s younger brother. He completely buys into the whole “best place on earth” horse shit because he landed here, and now he’s “rich”.

That also explains why people like him flip out when you say “real estate is overvalued”. What they hear is “I’m jealous of your success and I hate this city” when what you’re really saying is “prices are on an unsustainable tragectory and it’ll all come back to earth sooner or later”.

The funny thing is when it all comes back to earth these new “real estate moguls” will expect the rest of us to feel sorry for them… and you KNOW they’ll have their greedy little hands out looking for a bail out. When the market’s up they are believers in the values of capitalism, but when it’s down they are suddenly socalist.

Anyway I had a 10 minute nap which seems to have worked miracles on my mood.

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What gets me is how these new “real estate moguls” do the following:
1) Never account for mortgage or interest payments when reporting their profit (it’s simply “I paid X and sold for X+Y) never seem to mention the time between purchase and sale where interst payments would have depleted their overall net gain, not to mention their property taxes, maintenance/strata fees and insurance premiums;
2) They never mention capital gains tax, obviously not on principle residences, see #4;
3) They don’t seem to understand realized gain vs. unrealized gain, they just assume the money is theirs without a sale;
4) And last but certainly not least - those that sell their principle residences with profits only to realize that they need to live somewhere and guess what? All other properties have also gone up, the same as yours. So, what’s the net gain? Square footage and more debt? Brilliant! What happened to sell high and buy low? Doesn’t work so well with your home, does it?;

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At this moment I know the rent I pay him is fair, and to buy this place would cost me twice as much a month. P/E out of whack…nothing else matters.

And for what it’s worth, I work with blue-collar types that make >$100k with overtime, and I have friends with PhDs who make less than 30k a year, and doctor friends who are renters.

In Vancouver, what’s more important is when you bought, not how much you make, nor your level of education.

In an rapidly appreciating market everyone is a genius, and in a depreciating market as someone else said before we’ll see who is swimming naked.

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Bloody hell BDK. Spot on. The friends I refered to in the above post buying second places fall into the Iran/ Korea category. You said it so well.
They have a nose in the air attitude now. They talk about their tenants like they’re scum. What makes me laugh is one of them only just arrived in 2001 and bought 2002 and have never ever known anything but up up up. Yet they precieve themselves as brilliant rather than it being dumb luck and probably some family cash.

It pisses me off to no end. What’s worse is when I express my views using educated economic fundamentals that there will be a crash they laugh and call me a crack pot. What made it even more comedic gold was he was laughing at the firesale of houses down south and attributed it soley to Bush and co and nothing to do with fundamentals. When I flat out asked how he could possibly think that won’t affect us he answered with a straight face that it wasn’t possible here cause we aren’t the USA. The stupidity is stunning.

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