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March 5th, 2008 at 2:09 am
Tell me why high prices are a good thing for society!! In the long term!!!
Translation: Is inflation good for the economy? We know the answer.
Are some people pissed off they can’t afford place to live? Well they have every right to be. Part of what made Vancouver one of the best places to live was the relatively high quality of life the middle class could live. That is rapidly being taken from us,
So, the homeless from Hastings/Carrall/Columbia can riot too? Get real, dude. There are no free lunches anymore. And why refer to only the middle class? Most of us have to work exceedingly hard for a living and for only mediocre pay.
Tell me seriously what you would do if you had several million dollars (your very own cash)? Like that Burnaby woman who won the lottery. First stop – buy a property or upgrade, no? Next stop, invest in some stocks etc. Don’t think you’ll put all of the money into the bank for a few % p.a.
The bottom line is that the rich gets richer and the poor gets poorer – and statistics show that this happens annually in all developed countries (check Forbes’ richest people).
Not only that, the rich are encouraged by governments to invest. In many countries of the world, most of the income tax gathered comes from only a few hundred people (the richest). So they are considered real assets to their economies and other economies (Sultan of Brunei responded to Thatcher’s request for billions of investment dollars for Britain).
Does it matter whether RE crashes or not? Not to the rich. It’s a fact of life that cycles of boom and bust occur and usually, the very well-heeled not only survive but become much richer because they have the resources to hold onto their investments in busts and add on cheaper investments. Prime example: Li Ka Shing (Expo land) had ‘bad’ buys in many places in Asia in the 80s. Now, he’s a billionaire.
Do you think these rich people care whether we are able to own homes or not? Do you care whether the homeless in Hastings/Carrall get housing (maybe, only Tony Danza does)?
March 5th, 2008 at 1:21 am
sunsetgrove.ca:
We have detected that your web browser does not meet the minimum requirements to enter this site.
Well aren’t we exclusive? Firefox 2.0 under Linux is not good enough for their website!
Can’t get a competent web designer by the look of it. Or maybe they’re just pre-screening for buyers with the least analytical skills.
March 5th, 2008 at 12:16 am
We’re all familiar with the howmuchamonth crowd. Now the condo marketers are turning it up a notch, advertising this condo project as starting at $37/day.
http://sunsetgrove.ca/
Yeeesh
March 4th, 2008 at 11:35 pm
DoDo1975,
You are right on the money. A health economy is an economy with deflation. Isn’t great, save now to buy more later.
Bubbled R/E is bad for society. Why would anyone take on a $400,000 mortgage for a condo? Are they F*cken crazy? Have they thought about how long that will take to pay it off??
March 4th, 2008 at 11:28 pm
andrew,
pop open yahoo finance. all you see is negative news. what else do you expect. the market is crashing. people is losing their jobs. do you really expect real estate to go up. by the end of 2008, you will see yoy loss.
March 4th, 2008 at 11:10 pm
“We will see that five-year posted rate start to edge down as worries around the financial markets here in Canada start, too,” Muir said Tuesday.
sorry… too lazy to link right now…
i don’t get it. why would posted rates go down when worries around the financial market starts in canada? wouldn’t they go up instead?
March 4th, 2008 at 10:55 pm
WOW, I wonder if those last few anonmous comments are a subconscious cry for help.
Anyway, looks like the party’s over in Victoria….prices DOWN 5.95% year to date.
Fasten your seat belts.
March 4th, 2008 at 10:44 pm
Andrew,
You want negativity. Here it is.
Vancouver real estate will never crash. Instead, in 20 years, 90% of the population will be slaves to the bank, still hardly making a dent in their 40 year mortgages.
The moderate inflation and increasing wages have now brought their payments into the 45% of gross income range. Only 10 more years until the last 10 years of their mortgage is finally actually affordable. They are 70 when they pay it off.
The Vancouver economy has stagnated the whole time because no-one had any money left over after their mortgage payment to buy new cars, fuel, food out or really anything. The only people that use any of the services are the tourists, and not many of these come due to the gloomy attitude of the residents.
Whats interesting is these events would be forced to happen if real estate does not crash, but if they happen people will move and prices will crash.
Bottom line is, unless you are a bank, realtor or house flipper; high housing prices are not good for you. They only make you feel wealthy and cause you to borrow. Actually, they are really only good for house flippers and realtors while prices are rising quickly, which any sane person would admit has to stop very soon.
So it comes down to the banks owning pretty much everyone but the rich; or a crash.
I think any positive person, who cares about society in general and not their own selfish hopes and desires and profit potential(obviously not bankers) will actually want and hope for the impending crash.
So really; who is negative and who is positive????????????????
I challenge you or any bull, not to worry about whether or not a price crash will occur, and not to try to justify the prices either. Just do this. Tell me why high prices are a good thing for society!! In the long term!!!
Are some people pissed off they can’t afford place to live? Well they have every right to be. Part of what made Vancouver one of the best places to live was the relatively high quality of life the middle class could live. That is rapidly being taken from us, and most of you damn sheeple are applauding it because you can’t see past your noses.
March 4th, 2008 at 10:20 pm
you mean to say you don’t know anything personally and you are unable to present any argument but CBC will explain that for you is that right?
you are such a joker!
March 4th, 2008 at 10:06 pm
Well I was born and raised here and I’ll be the first say Vancouver is going down the toilet, wrecked by profiteering scumbags.
A story about 40 year mortgages is coming up on the CBC National.
March 4th, 2008 at 9:59 pm
scullboy,
you are such a dweeb!you remind me of a drunken hooker at fourty playing with 23 year old toy. you are not even from vancouver you are from toronto and that idiot above,I mean that mohican’s whore is also from prairies,both of you idiots don’t know anything about my city,you don’t know, I will throw all of your vibrators with remote control in the gutter you fucking fringing idiot. I won’t utter a bad word for vancouver and won’t let the hookers spit their filth on my city.
March 4th, 2008 at 9:18 pm
hey anon,
You sound an awful lot like an angry version of Krrish. Kind of reminds me of a monkey baring fangs and flinging lots of poo at his screen. What’s the matter? Seeing the day when all that money mommy and daddy paid for your home goes down the drain? Don’t worry, you can sell your kids organs to pay the mortgage. He’ll, I’ll buy them all just to keep your ‘tard genes out of the pool…
March 4th, 2008 at 8:03 pm
who are sub marginal morons,
too #$@$%$# funny!!
March 4th, 2008 at 7:56 pm
What kind of survey is this when there is no bull here?”a scary face of bears”….???
“you get the usual platitudes about the booming economy, running out of land, or everyone wanting to live here.”
what else would make you happy?you idiot when your own place doesn’t seem best place to you on earth what else place would like to accomodate your worthless body?
are you entertaining the idea that you are a personal bit#h of vhb and mohican who present old data with their own made headlines?
March 4th, 2008 at 7:50 pm
oh come on anony, at least get the grammar correct…
is.. arguments
March 4th, 2008 at 7:37 pm
where is your arguments?
March 4th, 2008 at 7:22 pm
There is no argument for the RE price appreciation here that has not been demolished several times over and it has been that way since VHB-though Mohican did pretty well and fleshing things out further. In addition, none of the bull arguments (if you even call them that) bears any relationship to any sort of rational economic or financial analysis. Instead, you get the usual platitudes about the booming economy, running out of land, or everyone wanting to live here.
We do not have any bulls here. We have Krish/Satv, and Dosh who are sub marginal morons, but neither of them has presented any sort of convincing counter explanation to what is happening in the GVRD RE market. I do not respond to them because I think they are just trolling to try and incite flamings.
If you wander over to Chipman’s blog, the resident bulls cannot put together any rational argument either.
March 4th, 2008 at 5:37 pm
dosh,
If you dared to pull your head out of the sand, and stood on your tippy toes, you might just be able to see Edmonton, Calgary and Seattle, who were all convinced they were different last year at this time.
March 4th, 2008 at 5:18 pm
Along with Ted I am truly interested in finding a well constructed, logical, intelligent and compelling argument that is Bullish on Vancouver Real Estate from any source.
March 4th, 2008 at 5:15 pm
-A-
Well that’s accurate as long as your definition of “past performance” only includes the last 10-20 years and only the Vancouver market.
March 4th, 2008 at 5:02 pm
Andrew, I didn’t mean that to come across as rude, I really would like to see something that supports an argument against a US style bubble market crash. I hope you understand why I feel that the Vancouver market is not a good investment right now. Its not that I can’t afford anything, its that from an investment standpoint why would I buy? What long-term fundamentals are keeping prices high?
When I look around I see a lot of short term projects putting a squeeze on construction costs, but I don’t see local wages or rents rising to match. Personally I’m doing fine, but none of the statscan numbers have shown any dramatic wage increases, rent or immigration increases. I’m also astounded by the thin margin some of my friends and neighbors are operating on.
I truly would like to see some varied opinions posted, because perhaps I am being too negative, but I see a lot of storm clouds on the horizon (credit contraction, US recession, forestry shutdown, etc). So far I haven’t seen anything other than vague feelgood stuff and speculation propping up prices. If there is something I’m not considering I’d really like to be made aware of it.
March 4th, 2008 at 4:52 pm
Drachen, speaking of IQ, I think anyone with any IQ better log on to Rob’s Blog. and better draw the conclusion that they better put down the keyboard and speedial your Realtor because the charts clearly point to further price appreciation for ever-well at least that’s what the past performance would suggest.
March 4th, 2008 at 4:49 pm
REBGV stats are out:
Looks like sales declined 6.4% this year compared to Feb 07 and 9% from Feb 06.
Listings on the other hand rose 26.2 % compared to Feb 07 and 21% over Feb 06. Hmmm can you spot the trend?
Prices are up .5% from last month
I will put the detailed monthly stats up tonight on my site.
http://www.northshoreproperties.ca
Look forward to your analysis Pope!
March 4th, 2008 at 4:45 pm
“I’d love to see anything that supports an argument for prices never going down.”
Andrew, you were invited to submit anything that’d support the argument for prices never going down.
Just as I assumed you can’t..
March 4th, 2008 at 4:41 pm
Well… as I assumed the kind of response I would get.
I guess I will just stay as a reader then. Thanks for your all’s feedback.
March 4th, 2008 at 4:40 pm
dosh:
here’s a perma bull:
http://tinyurl.com/26ay5v
guaranteed to buy something real soon.
this will the high end market for the next 25 years……
March 4th, 2008 at 4:35 pm
rentals in newly completed buildings??? Check this simple query on craigslist:
http://vancouver.craigslist.ca.....;bedrooms=
March 4th, 2008 at 4:25 pm
Constantly hoping the market is going to crash. The truth is anything could happen.
anything? Thats very open minded of you, but I think its important to keep an open mind so I’d love to see anything that supports an argument for prices never going down.
March 4th, 2008 at 4:16 pm
Nah, give him some benefit of the doubt, most people below 65 IQ can’t tie their own shoe, he can type and he even gets most of the words right (unlike some (well only one really) people around here).
March 4th, 2008 at 3:54 pm
“Honestly Dosh, I’ve never seen a worse display of wilful ignorance. At least Krrish is just genuinely slow, you seem to have at least an 80s range IQ or so. You CAN figure it out if you choose to.”
Drachen, you’re way off, it’s in the low 60′s max!
March 4th, 2008 at 3:40 pm
Andrew:
“Constantly hoping the market is going to crash.”
I think you’re missing the point. We don’t HOPE the market will crash we KNOW the market will crash. The debate here is mostly about when and how much. Any rudimentary analysis from a moderately intelligent spectator quickly arrives at the same conclusion. Markets don’t climb like they have in Vancouver without a following crash unless there is a fundamental change in the market. This is Economic law, it is not cheatable, adjustable or malleable.
March 4th, 2008 at 3:30 pm
Why is this website so negative on the economy in Vancouver. Constantly hoping the market is going to crash. The truth is anything could happen.
Looking at the result of the votes, it totally shows the negativity of the people coming to this website. Is it because you guys can’t really “afford” so you guys get angry?
Well, hope to see more of different views here.
Thanks everyone
March 4th, 2008 at 3:19 pm
The slide in the market came as the Bank of Canada cut its key rate half a point to 3.5 per cent, however the rate relief came with a warning that the U.S. economy is likely to experience a deeper and more prolonged slowdown than previously projected.
And Canada’s central bank said this “can be expected to have significant spillover effects on the global economy.”
**** Global Economy EXCEPT Vancouver!****
HAHHAHHAHAHAHA
March 4th, 2008 at 2:27 pm
Dosh:
“but others like us have markets that are up.”
As usual you are lacking any factual foundation.
Where other than Vancouver and Victoria are markets up? You can’t just make stuff up and expect us to buy your crap, back it up man, provide sources other than your fevered imagination.
“its not ignorance its a different opinion”
One is just a symptom of the other.
March 4th, 2008 at 2:26 pm
Perhaps Krissh and Dosh are in a special needs home together and they take turns posting dumb comments together and then spank each other off?
Both of them display a glaring lack of intelligence.
March 4th, 2008 at 2:19 pm
BC second in job creation 2001-2006. a quarter of the jobs added were in construction. it only shows a loss of 2,200 jobs in forestry/pulp although earlier there was another piece quoting 10,000 jobs lost in forestry for 2007.
i wonder if construction will still be going strong after the olympics and all the condos are done. a co-worker of mine mentioned that at bcit there are 47 (or was it 67?) classes of electricians. okay, i mangled that. that is, there’s a heck of a lot of people taking up electrician courses, due to the demand in construction.
March 4th, 2008 at 1:04 pm
Very mature tony.
Drachen its not ignorance its a different opinion. you see doom and gloom everywhere, sure some cities have markets that are down, but others like us have markets that are up.
March 4th, 2008 at 12:44 pm
Have you ever considered that Dosh just posts these stupid comments to get “spanked” by the regulars here while he sits at home “spanking” himself? I know…gross but it is highly probable.
March 4th, 2008 at 12:39 pm
It might, but other Olympic cities have had varied experience on the matter.
That’s a polite way of saying that the Olympics mean squat. If you’d like some experimental evidence, RE in Calgary and Edmonton have always tracked each other closely although only Calgary had the Olympics. The Olympics did nothing for RE in either city. RE prices, which had crashed in the early 80′s like in BC, did not recover until well after the Olympics, when oil prices (surprise) began to rise again.
March 4th, 2008 at 12:32 pm
Dosh:
“Your stretching for bad news in other countries while real estate here continues to be a rock solid investment.”
Your blind ignorance is what stretches the imagination. All American boom cities collapsing Dosh: “Yeah but we’re different, they have economic problems.” International boom cities collapsing, “Yeah but they’re overseas!” All Canadian boom cities except Vancouver and Victoria collapsing, “We’re DIFFERENT here! Really really! I have absolutely no factual information to back up my rhetoric but I just KNOW we’re different here! La la la, I’m not listening to you, see I’m covering my ears!”
Honestly Dosh, I’ve never seen a worse display of wilful ignorance. At least Krrish is just genuinely slow, you seem to have at least an 80s range IQ or so. You CAN figure it out if you choose to.
March 4th, 2008 at 12:30 pm
anyone see this comment from Rob Chipman? doubter posted “I am beginning really to believe that if I ever want to own a home, I will simply have to leave Vancouver.” and rob replied with this gem:
Is he really comparing the current market to the early eighties?!? 40% price crash and something like 20 YEARS before prices recovered? He’s starting to sound more pessimistic than Alan Angel.
March 4th, 2008 at 12:18 pm
Dosh”Your stretching for bad news in other countries while real estate here continues to be a rock solid investment” Hah think your foolin me? No body is as stupid as you pretend to be. Nice try!
March 4th, 2008 at 12:09 pm
“Your stretching for bad news in other countries while real estate here continues to be a rock solid investment.”
True. Just don’t think the 2010 Olympics will definitely cause future appreciation of Vancouver real estate. It might, but other Olympic cities have had varied experience on the matter.
March 4th, 2008 at 12:09 pm
Maybe Dosh is right, after all, we are different here.
Huge population, every rich Asian, Indian, Middle Eastern billionaire will mover here soon, small land mass, great weather, international IT center, extensive world trade-no dependence on the Americans, world class city, no crime, no traffic gridlock, manufacturing center, world class stock exchange, young workforce AND THE OLYMPICS,
Did I mention we ran out of land before Expo 86?
March 4th, 2008 at 12:09 pm
Dosh, I apologize for darkening your morning with bad news – you are of course correct. this article is not about Vancouver, I thought I made that clear by spelling it “Sydney Australia”.
I personally find it interesting to see whats happening in previous host cities. Of course Sydney is on the other side of the world, if this story makes you uncomfortable all you have to do is make the standard hemispere adjustment.
March 4th, 2008 at 12:09 pm
Prime Minister Kevin Rudd is today expected to unveil a plan to help families battling housing stress
In plainer language, a plan to keep house prices from falling.
You can’t have it both ways. If house prices are unaffordable, that means they are too high, period. The solution is lower prices, not schemes to make it easier for people to buy at high prices.
Get out of the way and let Mr. Market do his job.
March 4th, 2008 at 12:02 pm
LOVE this reader comment on that story
You know – I bought a couple of investment properties a couple years ago. And it is difficult to make the mortgage payments – but i’m am scrimping and saving to make sure i can, for the benefit of my longer term financial well being. I am going to be seriously unimpressed if the state governments undertake strategies to make houses even more affordable for ‘low income earners’. My properties are my future – whos going to pay for my future when realestate prices are artificially lowered?
Ever think maybe you just bought at a time when prices were artificially pumped up? Ever heard of ‘speculation’?
March 4th, 2008 at 11:56 am
This one should be relatively easy to spin.
The RE pumpers could say it doesn’t matter what the survey says because it polled locals and our market attracts international buyers.
BTW has anybody else noticed the make belief bears on Chipman’s site?
Sure seems like the same crowd but with new names, they seem to be posing as regretful bears who wish they had bought, and now are warning others to buy before they miss the boat.
March 4th, 2008 at 11:54 am
Keep on dreaming. If you can buy real estate now but are afraid you should get in while you can. Every time you post one of these stories its like you dont notice the really obvious fact that this news is not about Vancouver and not about Canada. Your stretching for bad news in other countries while real estate here continues to be a rock solid investment.
March 4th, 2008 at 11:35 am
It looks like fewer and fewer people are planning on buying in the next two years.
http://www.cknw.com/news/news_....._local.cfm
Could affordability be an issue here in the best hype on earth?