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January 5th, 2009 at 4:19 am
“I paid approx 1150/month for a junior 1 bedroom rental located at yonge and davisvile. 2001 yes, its not a mistake.”
There should be little doubt which city, Toronto or Vancouver, has a better yield. It’s a wonder why prices in Toronto aren’t higher. Or is your argument that Vancouver rents are bound to increase?
January 5th, 2009 at 3:45 am
“I told you to go check out Chinese restaurants in Richmond for yourself. Make sure it’s on Monday when everyone’s snowed in, we should expect the restaurants to be dead empty. You’ll be surprised when you have to wait in line for a table.”
How does this prove anything? That now is a great time to invest in a restaurant, given the lineups and all? Try this for an experiment: poll the people in the lineups and find out how many are planning to buy real estate in the next 4-6 months.
January 5th, 2009 at 3:30 am
“but again, the problem is: If those so called ‘people’ need to sell come out of the woodwork.”
Again, it doesn’t matter because potential buyers always have alternatives — renting or staying put in their existing property. It only complicates matters by trying to guess motives of sellers. Even if every property for sale lowered its price by 10% it wouldn’t matter. Without capital gains “in the bag” the fair price is still way lower.
Show a decent return on equity from cash flows and you’ll find a buyer lickety split.
January 5th, 2009 at 1:27 am
#242
I am not sure what the current rate is for your case, but hell I would love this price and accommodation 2001 toronto.
I paid approx 1150/month for a junior 1 bedroom rental located at yonge and davisvile. 2001 yes, its not a mistake.
January 5th, 2009 at 12:47 am
MrBear,
This site has been a good resource for education. Anyone has got benefit from it would have responsibility to feedback. What I am try to do is to provide more helps as I have got from the site, to young people with less experience in the society – it’s our role as being a well-behaved citizen, on either the virtual web or the real life.
January 5th, 2009 at 12:37 am
scullboy,
You are more than welcome to use my words. But be careful, I am an ESL student.
I like the “Bitter is a complex taste”. In Chinese proverb, it says: “良药苦口利于病,衷言逆耳利于行” (my interpretation: good medication is bitter, but it resolves the illness; good advice is harsh to hear, but it helps in life).
January 5th, 2009 at 12:23 am
Hey CZ, the 0 down 40% thing is ridiculous, I can’t understand why people would go zero down. Do you think they would end up walking away from their house? If housing prices is worth less than the mortgage, I think the right thing to do is default.
Not that easy. Canadian law is different from the US, which is recourse in most provinces (including BC, Alberta is different). This means the creditor has the rights to go after the debtor’s other assets, not only the collateral (aka the house).
My dad was saying to me that the only idiots going zero down for 40 yrs are those buying cheap 200k-400k condos. He said those are rookies and fools that are afraid of “missing out.”
True – they are called “greater fools”. MSM and CHMC have great contribution to this, IMHO. But remember, the housing market is like a pyramid – in general, only those 1st time home buyers are the pushing force to escalate the ladders up. When the entrance condo getting cheaper, the others will follow the suit.
I think the Canadian government should just let companies fail, isn’t that the goal of capitalism? Bad companies that are badly run should fail while good companies with good credit and balance sheets should be the survivors. Instead, the government is feeding money to those who failed. Greed is rewarded while those who save get punished by paying more taxes.
100% agree. Good thought. But unfortunately, this country is not built as pure capitalism – the governments will act upon the crisis hitting on their faces and call those bailout for the society – that is life, and life is tough, especially for those prudent people.
Whether prices come down in Vancouver remains to be seen. Most of the Vancouverites that I talk to who owns a house sound overly confident.
No need to wait, it is already down a lot. The question is how much more of the haircut in the coming years. I agree a lot of vancouver home owners are still in their cozy dream of the paper wealth on their house.
January 5th, 2009 at 12:17 am
That would almost make a good contest ^
January 5th, 2009 at 12:14 am
Often when looking arround for rental pricing in subareas of a city I’ll look for one well rounded posting and then search by phone number to get all listings by that person to see how reasonable the price is. I found this good for rent vs own equivalencies.
I found this very interesting. I think its the same posting over and over again. The asker has dropped price by ~10%. I don’t know what yaletown should rent for just a room though. Any ideas?
http://vancouver.en.craigslist.....maxAsk=max
I’m sure there’s far worse examples of distress but craiglist cuts off at the end of november
January 5th, 2009 at 12:11 am
Oh, sure. Now there has to be a bit of reasonable discussion involving Supraboy, including solid replies by scullboy and CZ. Do you guys live to make me eat my words?
January 5th, 2009 at 12:08 am
realpaul: Thanks.
My conclusion from your explanation is that it is near impossible to buy a foreclosure but one can quite successfully buy a court ordered property.
Am I close?
January 5th, 2009 at 12:03 am
Weary: I’ve achieved peace regarding Supraboy by ignoring all his posts and those posts that reply to him. It makes these threads much quicker and more insightful reading, I highly recommend it.
#225, ulsterman: Please post here more often. A little sanity is a wonderful thing.
#219, Patiently Waiting: Thanks for pointing out the vacancies on that Hollyburn site! I currently live in one of their buildings, and they definitely did not have anywhere near that number of openings when I was last looking at it a year ago or so. Wow, nice to see them suffer a bit. Couldn’t happen to a better company.
Everyone else: Happy New Year, and take it easy on the “Rich Asian” crap. That’s really getting tired as a stereotype/slur.
January 5th, 2009 at 12:02 am
Hey CZ:
With your permission, I think I’m going to steal your phrase when I talk to bulls:
“My advice is good, but the words are not that sweet”
Perhaps I’ll even come up with a recipe around it. Bitter is a complex taste, but used correctly it’s just as useful as sweet.
January 5th, 2009 at 12:01 am
Supraboy,
Just had a search of MLS on van west for properties less than 1 mil – I got 28 matches, such as this one:
http://www.realtor.ca/property.....Id=7502401
highlights: 2150 ft old timer, 4575 ft land, asking 799,000. By paul’s stats, the sale price is off the asking between 0-20%.
The REBGV benchmarking price already dropped 15.7% from May $771,250 to Nov $666,525 in 2008 (Dec data is not out yet). Is that what you have expected?
January 4th, 2009 at 11:58 pm
Hey CZ, the 0 down 40% thing is ridiculous, I can’t understand why people would go zero down. Do you think they would end up walking away from their house? If housing prices is worth less than the mortgage, I think the right thing to do is default.
My dad was saying to me that the only idiots going zero down for 40 yrs are those buying cheap 200k-400k condos. He said those are rookies and fools that are afraid of “missing out.”
I think the Canadian government should just let companies fail, isn’t that the goal of capitalism? Bad companies that are badly run should fail while good companies with good credit and balance sheets should be the survivors. Instead, the government is feeding money to those who failed. Greed is rewarded while those who save get punished by paying more taxes.
Whether prices come down in Vancouver remains to be seen. Most of the Vancouverites that I talk to who owns a house sound overly confident.
January 4th, 2009 at 11:56 pm
” Prices are still sky high. Stats are for losers.”
Perfect. Almost haiku like in its simplicity, really.
“Stats are for losers”
said the greatest fool, before
real estate nosedived.
Ah Supra, you are in for such a education.
Prices are determined by what they buyer will pay, not the price the seller wants. If the seller wants (x) and the buyer will pay (X-Y) AND the seller can afford not to sell, then there is no sale.
However, if the seller wants (x) and the buyer offers (X-Y) and the seller MUST sell, then the seller accepts (X-Y). Culture doesn’t enter into it. Psychology will, but only in the form of depression on the part of the seller and elation of the buyer after the sale.
They buyer can approach all sellers and offer (x-y) until he finds a seller who will agree to the sale. The more sellers on the market, the greater the probability that the buy will connect with a willing seller.
The more sellers in the market and the fewer buyers, the greater the chance of the second scenario occurring.
The current crisis playing out has both a high speed and low speed component. The high speed is the light-speed spreading of information, which both allowed for the current bubble and fuells the panic that is currently deflating the credit markets.
The low speed component is how this affects people’s daily lives.
The available supply of money (or more accurately, credit) is disappearing. With less money to go around, there are fewer people who can afford 1 million plus homes. At the same time, many businesses are collapsing because there isn’t enough money to fuel commerce.
First money dried up in America (logical since in many ways it is the source of the world’s money). This is now spreading rapidly to Asia (because the Asian economies depended on American consumers to exchange goods for cash) . ALso, as the value of the USD drops, the value of the money China holds in things like American bonds and T bills decreases.
Assuming there really are loads of Rich Asians out there, they will become severely impacted by the shortage of available money and the decreased demand from American consumers. They will, in turn, need to hedge their bets. This means they will eventually sell. THey aren’t selling yet because not enough of them are desperate. But they will.
I recall hearing about China’s stock market bubble, and how old people and students were investing money they couldn’t afford to lose into the market. I also hear the stock market is tanking. Presumably some of those people have wealthy relatives. Will their relatives desert them, or will they sell assets in order to keep the family going?
Soon enough we will see desprate sellers.
You checked the last three months of data, son. Given your age I can’t say I’m surprised. The Millennial kids aren’t what I would call long term strategic thinkers. You need to go back fifty YEARS and look at the patterns that emerge to get it. And actually if you really wanted to get it you’d google “tulipmania” and just replace “tulip” with “west Van SFH”.
Nobody parts with a fortune willingly, son. Whether the asset is a tulip, cochineal (look it up since you’re a South American buff), a share in a company or a home, its value lies ONLY IN WHAT A BUYER WILL PAY, AND NEVER IN THE SELLER’S PERCEIVED VALUE.
Bear this in mind son: in a war between stats and psychology, stats ALWAYS win.
Always.
January 4th, 2009 at 11:43 pm
True, in long run, real estate will go up. But for how long? Some stats shows in long run, for 50 to 100 years, the real estate only catches the inflation rate, and the curve is broken only in recent “boom” years. By the law of economics, the price fluctuates up and down around the real value, just like the sea waves – the higher it goes, the lower it falls, and vice-versa. As for government’s job, it should be maintained relatively stabler – none of the governments did it right. In Canada, the CHMC was formed for affordable housing, by our tax dollars. But the result has been to push the housing high and un-affordable – just ridiculous.
The most recent 20 years are abnormal, in the senses of financial disorder, globalization, peak oil, terrorist,… The next 20 years will be mush more different – see the crash course from http://www.chrismartenson.com.
Supraboy, you claimed you are not a bull, and you would like to see the house price drop. Please check the definition – a bull is predicting market going up, well a bear predicting market going down, regardless of his willingness and hopes. A guys can be bull on one market and a bear on a different market, and a guy can be a bull for long term and a bear for short term. A bull may be converted to a bear when s/he feels market has turned, like these days. Since you have deducted the rich Asian will hold up the YVR RE from the observation in local restaurants and shopping malls (and possibly from you dad’s influence), you are a bull on YVR RE.
I won’t agree with your dad on “no subprime in Canada”. The 0-down/40-year-arms is exactly the Canadian subprime. I remember some stats shows that close to 50% of mortgages in 2006-2008 are more than 30 years with less than 5% down.
I think scullboy gives a good advice though the words are not that sweet: “gain wisdom and awareness that comes from living through the difficult times ahead”.
January 4th, 2009 at 11:17 pm
“None of your assertions about Vancouver housing are backed up by data.”
I’ve looked at those MLS data the past 3 months. I compare it with the listings in the market, I haven’t seen any crashing yet. Prices are still sky high. Stats are for losers.
Have you actually seen any houses in the west side sold for under a million? I’m talking about a lot size of at least 40×120. The stats can show Vancouver RE dropping by 50% if it wants, the problem is nobody’s willing to sell cheap.
Scully, I don’t know what your problem is, I’m here with a neutral perspective and presenting valid questions, on the other hand, you just want to shoot every single one of my questions down.
“spoiling their number one son”
You’re wrong again, I’m the second son. My older brother is the one who’s spoiled. He’s got two houses and everynight, when I talk about real estate with him, he says, “see the real estate papers? There’s no crashing so STFU.”
January 4th, 2009 at 11:10 pm
“Those people don’t matter if they don’t want to sell, the only thing that matters are people that want/need to sell and people that want/are able to buy.”
I agree with that statement, but again, the problem is: If those so called ‘people’ need to sell come out of the woodwork. I haven’t seen that materialize. Only a few massive layoffs from big tech companies would put the jolt on things. As long as you’ve got companies like MDA, Mckesson, Business Objects holding up dead weights, it’ll be hard to take down the housing market.
“Canadian subprime will be start to burst. Delinquencies and defaults are increased to a historic high level, as Vancouerities already over-stretched too much over their financial balance.”
I told my dad about that and a few of his other friends, they think I’m on crack. My dad said I’m too young and haven’t seen shiiet in life. He said properties will always rise in the long run and there’s no such thing as “subprime” in Canada.
“Since you’ve shown up all you do is make unfounded claims about Vancouver housing based completely on your own tiny little world. None of your assertions about Vancouver housing are backed up by data and obviously all of your assumptions about me are based on your assumption that I’m “Canadian”.”
What is unfound? I told you to go check out Chinese restaurants in Richmond for yourself. Make sure it’s on Monday when everyone’s snowed in, we should expect the restaurants to be dead empty. You’ll be surprised when you have to wait in line for a table.
“I’m not sure how much you’ve travelled but it’s pretty apparent that even if you have travelled the world, you absorbed no wisdom in your journeys. I suppose you can take the boy out of Richmond, but you can’t take Richmond out of the boy.”
What’s that about people in South America getting kidnapped and extorted? I think you’re on crack. You hear a couple of news about a few people getting robbed and you go ahead and stereotype on an entire continent. You are definitely living in a rotten hell hole. Vancouver East side could be worse than Caracas and the slums of Rio De Janeiro. Every other week, you hear about Vietnamese people gunning each other down like mofos.
“A tidal wave is coming to Vancouver and soon hard decisions will have to be made. ”
Is that a prediction?
January 4th, 2009 at 10:41 pm
#230 Great rant, but the fact is, supersilly is an avatar , it doesn’t exist. One long sentence is too much time wasted.
January 4th, 2009 at 10:24 pm
Jesus Supra you’re a dolt. You seem to lack basic reading comprehension skills.
Let’s try this again:
MY EX AND HIS FAMILY ARE FROM COLOMBIA. I LEARNED HOW TO SPEAK SPANISH TRAVELING TO MANIZALES. I HELPED THEM GET INTO THIS COUNTRY.
You say “I”m trying not to make assumptions about your travels” then spend the rest of your post doing exactly that. I’d be stunned by your total lack of self awareness but … well I’ve read your posts.
You really are a racist git. You’re one of those idiot Richmond kids that look down on Canadians with deeper roots in this country.
Your pretentious talk about buying another property and deciding which cigar to smoke (based entirely on price) gives you away. You’re one of those stupid Chinese kids one encounters so often in Vancouver. Let me guess, your poor parents (and here I mean to use “poor” as “unfortunate” , because only really bad fortune would deliver them a son like you) were immigrants who worked REALLY hard but ended up spoiling their number one son. They knew difficulty and adversity, but they made sure you didn’t. They did you no favors, however. Only through struggle do we come to know ourselves, and I suspect you have never had to struggle much. You remind me a great deal of my brother in that regard.
Like so many kids your age and from your culture (and here I mean Richmond kids), you have both a superiority and an inferiority complex at the same time. You tell yourself and anyone who’ll listen that “Canadians” (and but Canadians you mean gwai lo) are stupid, and you laugh.
Making fun of “Canadians” makes you feel better. You feel excluded and you resent feeling like the “other”, so to make up for it you belittle the group you feel excludes you.
Deep down, you resent the fact that you’re part of a subculture, and not the dominant culture as you perceive it. You have a foot in both worlds, but it’s very difficult to keep the balance.
I’d feel sorry for you but let’s face it, you’re kind of a dick. I could make fun of you for so plainly being a banana, but that would be cheap.
You mistake flash and money for face. You think if you talk about how much money you’re making and how much smarter you are then your older co workers, it gains you face, which in your generation has been blended with the idea of “respect” from black American culture. You lack the experience that would allow you to understand the difference between real respect and the appearance of respect.
Dude I’ve been across this country, and lived in all of its large cities along with some of the smaller regional ones. One of my rowing crew was from a traditional Chinese family and we hung out all the time. We had a *LOT* of very frank talks about race and culture in Canada, and how Chinese Canadians view “Canadians”.
I’ve seen your type before, and frankly I know what you say about “Canadians” (which is really code for “white people”) behind our backs when you think we are not listening or are too stupid to understand. We get it all right. We just have too much respect for ourselves to turn around and point out that you’re being a dick.
Since you’ve shown up all you do is make unfounded claims about Vancouver housing based completely on your own tiny little world. None of your assertions about Vancouver housing are backed up by data and obviously all of your assumptions about me are based on your assumption that I’m “Canadian”.
I’m not sure how much you’ve travelled but it’s pretty apparent that even if you have travelled the world, you absorbed no wisdom in your journeys. I suppose you can take the boy out of Richmond, but you can’t take Richmond out of the boy.
In the end, no matter how much energy you put into appearing wealthy it’ll all come crashing down around you. I’m fairly sure you’ve salted away a lot of money living at home and hey… good for you. I’m sure you’re a clever little devil at work and hey, good for you there too.
Don’t think your colleagues are blind to your contempt for them however. They know. A tidal wave is coming to Vancouver and soon hard decisions will have to be made. You plainly aren’t good at playing the game and you’re going to lose.
Soon enough, you and your friends will discover the difference between the appearance of wealth and real wealth. I’d wish you good luck but somehow it seems more appropriate to tell you I hope you gain wisdom and awareness that comes from living through the difficult times ahead. You may or may not be wealthy but you plainly lack those.
January 4th, 2009 at 10:11 pm
Re: Lowball Offers
My understanding is that listing realtors have a fiduciary obligation to present their clients (sellers) with any/all written offers no matter how ridiculous.
However, in this current economic malaise, no one knows what the current market price is.
It is simply a stab in the dark.
I have still not observed any ” SOLD ” signs amongst the ever increasing number of ” FOR SALE ” signs.
=================================================
Also:
VCI strives for 100% accuracy !!!!
Errata
POST # 218 The asian myth Says:
January 4th, 2009 at 7:40 pm
“Did you see the crazed look in her eyes. It was if she’d spent the night with a dildo down her pants.”
Please some decorum, it is called a personal vibrator.
Dildo:
DEFINITION: (Wikipedia)
A non-vibrating device, resembling the penis/Supraboy? in shape, size, and overall appearance, is a dildo.
So Realpaul was spot on re: the dildo(= not a personal vibrator) , or certainly not in error.
However, a Vibrator with no batteries ( or dead batteries) may technically qualify to be a dildo.
PS
Who cares if that Asian lady who bought (6) condos sold them or is stuck with them ? (They want dill – DOUGH !!!)
Either way, those types are part of the problem , not the solution.
January 4th, 2009 at 9:32 pm
#216 no lympics, That should be “more Careful ” around the dinner hour. sorry again
January 4th, 2009 at 9:30 pm
#209 Jesse , good point
#218 I stand corrected
#220 Lily pad, a court ordered sale can be anything from a divorce proceeding,estate sale, proceeds of crime sale , foreclosure etc or any resulting decision of the legal processes. A court ordered sale in a foreclosure proceeding is the end result of that process.
#216 No-lympics , I’ll try to be more around the dinner hour. Sorry.
#226, I’m not going to talk to someone who doesn’t exist. BTW dream on.
January 4th, 2009 at 9:10 pm
Supraboy doesn’t come accross as a troll, actually pretty sharp. Like Dave he scares some people here. The bottom will arrive about the same for all north american markets, sometime this year. Cue helicopter Ben and company.
January 4th, 2009 at 9:04 pm
If what blueskies says is correct and the lady and her husband bought 6 condos in 2004 then they certainly are not retards or whatever else they have been referred to by some here. Maybe they sold in 2006 or 07 and made a killing. Maybe they still have them, who knows? Either way the knee-jerk “retard” comment is just thoughtless and gives the impression that some here are foaming at the mouth in their zealotry.
January 4th, 2009 at 8:57 pm
You’re all a bunch of freaks. Go out and play in snow.
January 4th, 2009 at 8:36 pm
Supraboy Rules !
He fulfills a great Devil’s Advocate role, troll or no troll.
BTW Just got back from an Asian mall …..got 6 piping hot dishes (No MSG !!!) for $ 26 (or 4 for $17 ) .
No Tsingtao beer…I drank domestic microbrewery product .
Sorry , Forgot to ask the Asian owner how many Condos, Mercedes and Jackie Chan DVD’s they own.
===========================
Post # 216 Realpaul:
Please !!!Have pre -warning next time re: the Dildo comment!!!!
QUOTE:
” I take tree, my huzba take tree I so crazy woman !!!!!! I rich nowwwwww.
Did you see the crazed look in her eyes. It was if she’d spent the night with a dildo down her pants.”
Dude….I laughed so frikkin hard I almost upchucked my sweet and sour pork and stabbed myself with a chopstick !
January 4th, 2009 at 8:31 pm
and everyone can sense that the bottom is a long way from where we are today.
in the US they have been seeking a
bottom for some time…. a few false calls so far but alas no bottom in sight yet and this is almost 2 years into the downturn
we.are.so.screwed.
January 4th, 2009 at 8:25 pm
Yes, the vacancy rate is clearly rising in Vancouver. Someone previously noted on this forum that the data from CMHC is useless so it’s hard to say what the vacancy rate is but it is clearly rising.
On a different note… You gotta love when real estate agents put “NEW PRICE” on their street signage. Why are they afraid to tell the truth… like simply putting “Price Reduced” on the sign?
Better yet, for full “truth in advertising” might I suggest… “price still declining”… “but not yet bottoming.” Let’s face it, Vancouver real estate is one big Dutch auction right now. The buyers will stay on the sidelines until they gain some confidence that the market is bottoming… and everyone can sense that the bottom is a long way from where we are today.
January 4th, 2009 at 8:20 pm
realpaul: I have a further question for you because I didn’t quite understand your answer to my last one.
Is there a difference between a foreclosure and a court-ordered sale?
January 4th, 2009 at 8:07 pm
http://www.rentersguide.com/building.php?ID=112
Look at all these West End vacancies. Hollyburn’s “evict and renovate” strategy might not be as effective as they thought.
January 4th, 2009 at 7:40 pm
“Did you see the crazed look in her eyes. It was if she’d spent the night with a dildo down her pants.”
Please some decorum, it is called a personal vibrator.
January 4th, 2009 at 7:32 pm
“I buy three, and my husband buy three”
Please refer to Rob Chipman, he help you find mo’ good buys fo you, maybe Italiana Villetta close to Casino.
January 4th, 2009 at 7:29 pm
The real China is in deep shit
http://www.prudentbear.com/ind.....commentary
#211 Alexcanuck I just loved that clip, what a bunch of retards. That woman was just an example of what happens to your real estate brain when you spend all night standing in the rain with a bunch of real estate retards juicing up on never never juice.
I take tree, my huzba take tree I so crazy woman !!!!!! I rich nowwwwww.
Did you see the crazed look in her eyes. It was if she’d spent the night with a dildo down her pants.
These retards are all getting to sweat possesion now, along with the newbies who just took possesion in the past year and promptly lost six figures. Multiply that by thousands over the past 3 years who are deep underwater and we have one big loser community.
Our multi cultural real estate boom just proves that every culture has a huge supply of idiots to sucker.
I built and sold plenty of million dollar homes to ‘rich asians’ and everyone else in the eighties and nineties in every sub area of the GVRD, the market crashed in ‘92 and didn’t break water again for 12 years. Dummies are everywhere. This is just a new generation. The thing you can count on is that every few years we get to fleece a whole new crop of suckers.
I’ve dealt with bozo’s from every race, color and creed. No one group has a lock on smarts. So……. why don’t you all leave the race question alone, it’s totally irrelavant.
The biggest laugh I ever got in buisness is when I was in charge of estate arbitration at a very large investment firm. The sons sueing mothers, the daughters sueing brothers, the kids living in the basement drooling over moms goodies upstairs. My job was to sort out these peoples problems via negotiation before everything went for a shit and ended up in litigation. I had clients of every race fighting like dogs over the family scraps.
Thats a much more interesting story than which asian has what. I get the distinct impression that no one who has posted has a realtime understanding of the issue anyway. No offense to anyone.
Whats really happening in the world should hopefully generate a higher level of discussion.
January 4th, 2009 at 7:26 pm
Jesse post #207… you’re so correct!
January 4th, 2009 at 7:23 pm
“I buy three, and my husband buy three”
that clip was from 2004 when Bob Rennie was flogging the Yaletown Park development from Peter Wall.
This closed in 2006 and this couple probably made out like bandits and
long gone …. not so much for the sheeple who bought in to the “W”
project (Rennie) and the lemmings
who bought into TV Towers (Concord Pacific)both of which are yet to complete…..
that bleating sound you hear are the sheeple who are about to have their gonads crushed into oblivion on these two projects and others…..
January 4th, 2009 at 7:02 pm
“I buy three, and my husband buy three”
I saw that clip, if that is a personification of sophisticated rich Asian money keeping Vancouver on the world stage, I’m afraid we are in a world of hurt
January 4th, 2009 at 6:59 pm
“You are right and wrong. If you talk to the Chinese people who have immigrated here recently, they want nothing to do with China. They’d rather live in a hell hole than go back to China. “
That is irrelevant to my point. The fact remains, the so illusive super rich Asians did not create enough demand to put pressure on entry level homes.
The bubble was created by several factors, the rich Chinese buying up cheap particle board boxes is not one of them.
January 4th, 2009 at 6:58 pm
“I buy three, and my husband buy three”
Yah, sophisticated and wealthy asians all right! Those are the typical investors in recent years. Now sitting on SIX condo’s due to complete soon.
Can’t be bothered to look up link, but that’s from a fairly recent CTV news clip on presale walk-aways. Featured here about a month ago. Anyone got it handy?
January 4th, 2009 at 6:57 pm
Supraboy,
I think I understand what you meant. Some illusion in the shopping centers and restaurants may hide the real facts in the economy, local and global.
While I am writing this, the CBC news “Sunday Night” is broadcasting the “wall street spindle”, to describe what happened, what are happening and what are going to happen. Some smart economists foresee all those craps, which will eventually affect our daily life. Some reference points may give you more insights – such as ilargi of the automatic earth, chirs martenson and peter schiff. You can google them to find more resources.
In short, I don’t think the government bailout will work (refer to the resources mentioned above), and I would guess what going to happen in 2009 in YVR:
1. Economy getting worse, as local industry suffers from the export decline and construction shrinkage. There is no real supporting industry for local economy.
2. Layoff will flood the street news. Jobless rate in lower mainland may hit to between 8% and 10% by the end of the year.
3. Canadian subprime will be start to burst. Delinquencies and defaults are increased to a historic high level, as Vancouerities already over-stretched too much over their financial balance.
4. One or two Canadian banks may suffer the result of bad economy and the subprime intensively – government will have to bailout those stupidity with our tax dollars.
5. Government can only do firefighting for saving their political life, not for common Joe, like you and me.
6. Local people investment mood will go down earth as confidence ruined totally.
7. Funny enough, the rich people are still relatively rich, they are the least affected people by the economic down-turn from life style point of view. Especially some of them has combination of investment from different markets and different fields. So they will still enjoy regular life style as before – driving BMW, dining fancy Dimsum, shopping brand clothes.
8. By the middle of 2009, we’ll start talking more layoffs, rental decrease in this blog. Buying a home is a too luxury topic for common salary people for a while.
Anyway, we’ll see. It’s good to be young and energetic – you can afford to make mistakes. But it cost…
January 4th, 2009 at 6:53 pm
“making conditions worse for real sellers.”
Actually, I’d argue it makes conditions worse for everybody. Potential buyers have to rummage through these “unrealistic” listings and may even go to the trouble of making an offer that has no chance of being accepted. Realtors effectively waste their time showing these places since the chances of a sale are next to nil. Other sellers, as you say, have no way of differentiating except by way of list price. The actual seller has to go through the hassle of stagings and showings with close to zero chance of success.
Certainly it’s a secondary reason why potential buyers aren’t wasting their time looking right now. It takes to frigging long to weed through and second-guess the unrealistic listings.
January 4th, 2009 at 6:50 pm
meanwhile ho hum
http://www.prudentbear.com/ind.....lebulletin
January 4th, 2009 at 6:44 pm
“Those people don’t matter if they don’t want to sell, the only thing that matters are people that want/need to sell and people that want/are able to buy.”
I don’t see patriotz around so I’ll fill in. The buyer is the only one who sets the price. The seller is at the mercy of the highest offer.
January 4th, 2009 at 6:29 pm
the problem is the asians in Vancouver are not willing to lower the listing prices and they are going to hold on to their property no matter what
Those people don’t matter if they don’t want to sell, the only thing that matters are people that want/need to sell and people that want/are able to buy.
People that want to see if there’s a sucker out there who will give them twice the market price on a house but don’t care to sell are just wasting everyones time and have no impact on the market except to make the total number of listing higher, making conditions worse for real sellers.
January 4th, 2009 at 6:29 pm
Weary,
Depending on your browser configuration, and your choice of fonts, you might be seeing the “n” and the “ri” similarly.
One poster is “ant”, the other is “arit”. Not the same, with all due respect to “ant”.
Best regards,
a-r-i-t
January 4th, 2009 at 6:26 pm
I’ve registered as a user, will that stop jackasses from posting under my name?
The last several posts have NOT been by me, I thought about changing my ID, but screw that. Trolls buzz off. Weary and all other posters that choose to post on topic, you are welcome here. This is no private club, but your contribution is better appreciated when its on topic and true.
Someone posing as me has been trying to stir people up, its ironic that they are painting bears us ‘unhappy’ or easily offended. I couldn’t be happier about the market state, except that its entirely unnecessary. If people paid what a house was actually worth instead of following a herd into a get-rich-quick scheme that property values would remain reasonable instead of shooting up and then crashing down.
Think about how much paper wealth has evaporated over the last six months and how much that sucks for our economy. Hope you are all ready for 2009!
January 4th, 2009 at 6:22 pm
“The idea of rich Chinese fleeing China in fear of the communist taking away their money is so stupid only Vancouverites could believe.
Get this straight people. If you are Chinese and you have a lot of money, you are in one way or another closely aligned or related or you own a few bureaucrats. ”
You are right and wrong. If you talk to the Chinese people who have immigrated here recently, they want nothing to do with China. They’d rather live in a hell hole than go back to China. On the other hand, there are those who have businesses in China and they are willing to liquidate their overseas assets just to save their own hide.
There is also the diversification scenario where they own properties in China, Canada, Singapore and Australia. They will try to hang on to their properties and will pick and choose the weakest link to liquidate when push comes to shove.
January 4th, 2009 at 6:18 pm
“Trolls intentionally drag blogs off topic by pretending to be naive (like supraboy) and they get a kick out of it.
It will go away if we all ignore it.”
You know why you guys are so offended by me and now you call me a troll? Because you guys are very one-sided.
I’m not a full-fledged bull. I already stated earlier that I expect more downside on real estate, but the problem is the asians in Vancouver are not willing to lower the listing prices and they are going to hold on to their property no matter what since they can afford the mortgage payments.
If they can hang on to their property while all the coordinated efforts by world governments propping up the markets take effect, their property prices will rise and you will see a new cycle of stagflation.
January 4th, 2009 at 6:06 pm
I guess if you repeat a lie often enough it becomes accepted as truth.
The idea of rich Chinese fleeing China in fear of the communist taking away their money is so stupid only Vancouverites could believe.
Get this straight people. If you are Chinese and you have a lot of money, you are in one way or another closely aligned or related or you own a few bureaucrats.