Regional Growth Strategy Meetings
Greg wrote in to let everyone know that Metro Vancouver is holding regional growth strategy meetings over the course of the next month. The first one is TODAY in Vancouver:
The Metro Vancouver region could grow by over 1.2 million people and 600,000 jobs by 2040. Metro Vancouver’s draft Regional Growth Strategy proposes actions and strategies to accommodate this growth while continuing to advance the region’s livability and sustainability. A spring series of consultations are being held around the region to hear from citizens. Please join the discussion, and help spread the word about this opportunity to help shape our region’s future!
REGIONAL GROWTH STRATEGY Meetings
Public Evening Meetings: 7 – 9 pm (registration 6:30 pm)April 22 Vancouver Pan Pacific Hotel, Ocean View Suites, 999 Canada Place, Vancouver
April 29 Pitt Meadows/Maple Ridge Ridge Meadows Seniors Society, 12150 –
224th Street, Maple Ridge
For the dates of all other meetings through May, please see the Metro Vancouver public consultation web page.
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April 22nd, 2009 at 8:15 am
Those 1.2 million people have to live somewhere bears! My guess is it’ll be in condos. Buy now or regret it later.
April 22nd, 2009 at 8:37 am
bearbuster: Yeah, because a condo you buy now is going to be in great shape by 2040. Why, just look at all the lovely, coveted 30 year old buildings today. Give me a minute while I try to think of an example…
April 22nd, 2009 at 10:26 am
The operating word here is could. It could grow and by the same token, I could be a billionaire too by 2040. Are you kidding me??? It’s no secret that Canada has had negative natural population growth for years and had to rely on immigration to offset the decline. Do you think that those immigrants (mostly Asian) will continue coming here in 2040 when their homeland is prosperous with plenty of jobs? Do you think an educated Chinese couple with good paying jobs will pack up their bags and come to Canada with their child so they can wait tables at a dim sum restaurant collecting dirty dishes and pocket change? How many Wall Street investment bankers quit their million$-bonus job in the past decade so they can become a rice farmer in China?
When you talk about population in Canada, you’re talking about immigration. Period. High living costs, especially in Greater Vancouver, discourage current population to procreate, no matter how much CCTB the government offers.
So here’s how immigration is played in Canada. Immigrants come, stay for 5 years, get citizenship and go home for good. Canadian citizenship is a cheap insurance in case something violent happens in their home country in the future. And the federal government is happy to collect about $1,200 in fees per immigrant. Multiply that by 250,000 per year and you get the idea. And not surprisingly, all immigration and citizenship processing centers are located in Sydney, Nova Scotia, an EI recipient province. To make things worse, with recent economic growth in Asia, more immigrants would rather fly here every 183 days to maintain their permanent residency status and keep their good job at home than sticking around here for 5 years with no income. Statcan also reported that 1/3 of newcomers returned to their country of origin within 1 year of arrival in Canada. If we can’t retain immigrants today, how can we grow by 1.2M by 2040? Also, according to a demographic expert out at U. of Toronto, we will be an elderly population by then. He showed a population-by-age chart that looked like an inverted triangle. More importantly, how can this be bullish for home prices? If people buy a house now to live in until they’re old, by the time they want to sell and retire, there won’t be many young buyers around. It’s all about supply and demand.
April 22nd, 2009 at 10:49 am
#3 Anon
re: demographics, I have had that opinion for quite some time. It seems logical to me that demographics will dominate RE over the next 20-30 years, as more baby boomers retire and downsize/sell their RE than there are younger folks to buy it. Just like baby boomers created generational bubbles in RE and stocks during their adult working lives in the 80s and 90s, they will create falling asset prices in their wake as they retire. Sure, this is a high level simplistic view, but it all boils down to supply and demand. I’m sure some people will claim that immigration will offset these factors, but I doubt it will be enough.
April 22nd, 2009 at 11:22 am
Yes, but just how long ago were these meetings planned. They might have been planned last year by the same people that said “real estate never goes down”, “Vancouver is the best place on earth” etc. High housing costs, gangs, murders and the economic forecasts puts a little doubt on the population explosion.
These meetings may have been in the works for a year and no one wanted to cancel. Anyways, it is keeping a lot of consultants employed!
April 22nd, 2009 at 12:45 pm
I call bullshit on this dummied up trial ballon aka “meeting’.
1) excuse to raise taxes for supposed hypotheticals
2) bureaucrats form a committe and then hire thier in laws for phony positions
3)phony up support for the idiotic planners who OK’ed concrete coffins.
4) phony up support for the stalled real estate market by making people think there will allways be a market to flip antique condos into
5)misdirect public opinion away from the current economic reality ( the phony information will spill into the headlines like it’s truth or something
6)Busy work for city staff who realise public opinion is turning against the bloated jobs numbers of the civil service.
7)More ‘happy talk’ about how special and differant we are here.
Did anyone read the RCMP announcement this AM about the Robert Djikanski murder. The RCMP says ” We didn’t lie, we mis stated the facts and we’re sorry”.
Bwahahahahahahahaha , what fools we are if any one of us believes thier bullshit.
April 22nd, 2009 at 2:25 pm
realpaul: Are you doing anything to address the problems you see around you, or is it easier to just complain about everything and not actually do anything?
April 22nd, 2009 at 2:48 pm
snark:
#7 you mean as opposed to making quasi retarded counter point and totally clueless comments like you, yes. If you have something to offer in terms of a POV why don’t you write it down and publicly expose yourself for judgement. Otherwise , you just come off as a disgruntled moron.
Meanwhile, back on Planet Earth…..Big Bad news for Auto Workers. What a smack in the ass for the Feds. This will mean another retreat after the line drawn only yesterday by the now recognizable idiocy of the BOC governor. The entertainment factor is hotting up, just in time for the “summer of discontent”.
Sources: GM to shut many US plants up to 9 weeks
AP Sources: GM to close most US factories for up to 9 weeks this summer to reduce inventory
DETROIT (AP) — Two people briefed on the plan say General Motors Corp. will close most of its U.S. factories for up to nine weeks this summer because of slumping sales and growing inventories of unsold vehicles
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/......html?.v=2
April 22nd, 2009 at 3:03 pm
where did post number 1 go?
I didn’t think it was offensive.. or is that if they get voted down enough they vanish? If so, that’s silly.
April 22nd, 2009 at 3:32 pm
That’s why it is important to vote in the opposition.
See what Bush did to USA and world economy after only TWO terms. The only winners are his close circle of friends.
April 22nd, 2009 at 3:33 pm
It was forecast here and now we’re seeing it happen. Don’t think our own greedy grasping politico’s and Liberals aren’t eyeing this move in Britian as a way to sell the BIG MOVE to MUCH HIGHER TAXES forecast for this country when the sting of the huge government waste comes home to roost.
A bursting and bloated sacred cow of a civil service will force a stand off between the workers and the political claases who suck the life out of the tax stream before it ever gets to the school books and hospital beds it was intended for. Expect tax grabs and tax hrraasment to become the norm here in BC as the local governments would rather raise tax than cut the bloated sucking fat from the civil service.
Expect the Metro Meeting to be primarily arguments and pitches by special intrest groups for higher taxes for all manner of revenue sucking waste.
“City alarmed by 50% tax rate
TOP earners on £150,000 and above were today stung with a 50 per cent tax rate as the economy plunged into record debt.
Alistair Darling stunned the City by borrowing eye-watering sums to make ends meet as he tore up his growth forecasts in his speech to the Commons.
But he fought back with a Budget that battered the better off — anyone earning more than £100,000 will suffer — to help pay for the credit crunch caused by blundering bankers. Some critics called it the end of New Labour.
The new top rate of tax was the sting in the tail of a speech dominated by dreadful economic figures, the worst seen in peacetime. ”
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/.....article.do
April 22nd, 2009 at 5:42 pm
well, if you are earning over 100k (and even in London, this is a very comfortable salary), I have very little pity.
April 22nd, 2009 at 5:44 pm
the borrowing levels, however, are startling, and a very bad move for the long term prospects of the UK economy. sell pounds now, if you’ve got them.
April 22nd, 2009 at 6:22 pm
Absolutely no sign of the bulls (bullshits) on Vancouver condo for a long time now “vancouver real estate never go down” or “my wife buy 2″ or supraboy. I guess they’re too busy dealing with bankrupcy…or being silent – best strategy to save face.
April 22nd, 2009 at 6:41 pm
Housing bubble smackdown: Huge “shadow inventory” portends a bigger crash ahead
Mike Whitney
Online Journal
Wednesday, April 22, 2009
Due to the lifting of the foreclosure moratorium at the end of March, the downward slide in housing is gaining speed.
The moratorium was initiated in January to give Obama’s anti-foreclosure program — which is a combination of mortgage modifications and refinancing — a chance to succeed. The goal of the plan was to keep up to 9 million struggling homeowners in their homes, but it’s clear now that the program will fall well short of its objective.
http://www.prisonplanet.com/ho.....ahead.html
#12 read on, our wages are the lowest in the developed world. Dollar for dollar we are ranked below the poorest state in the US. Do you agree with the CDN government policies developed by Trudeau and perfected by Chretien Liberal Party which have kept you poor, undereducated, unemployed and subservient. If you don’t think it’s a problem when other people lose thier wages to the government tax parasites then you also don’t want to know what they talk about at those G-20 meetings. You’re next.
Remember the old adage ,
“It’s recession when your neighbour loses his job, it’s a depression when you lose yours.”
April 22nd, 2009 at 6:57 pm
Are you smarter than the NY Times? Is Vancouver going to deny reality? Every market in the world is going down in flames. What do you think the incentive to goose the market with flase advertising will be after the Liberals win the May election? Will May be the waterfall moment that everyone agrees will happen here in Denialcouver?
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04......html?_r=1
BTW did you catch the 6oclock news about the perks we have to supply to the IOC fatcats when they come to town? Holy shit, it must be nice to be a government parasite.
April 22nd, 2009 at 6:57 pm
Ok I actually work at Metro Vancouver and I know the people that are involved in the public consultation process. These people work hard to create a regional strategy to accommodate growth so that all municipalities can create their individual plans that fit the regional framework. These are not “consultants” or bloated government beaurocrats, these are people that create the strategy plans that are important for our community to grow (and yes, it is growing) in a sustainable way.
I come to this blog because like all of you, I see the unaffordable, exorbitant prices in Vancouver. I have also watched from my rented apartment as the bubble popped. However I also give credit where credit is due, and I understand that there are civil servants out there trying to improve this region that both you and I choose to live in.
If you don’t like the regional growth strategy – fine. Go to the meetings and tell them that. But I agree with Snark; it is easier to complain rather than do something about the problems that exist and please spare me your rant realpaul about things you know nothing about.
April 22nd, 2009 at 7:28 pm
Post 12, you are a moron. Why should someone earing $100K a year be taxed any higher than someone earing $25K a year. Flat tax rate based on gross income is way to go. Taxing the rich discourages those most productive and entrepreneurs. Plus why should someone earning $100K be made to pick up the shit from the incompetent bankers and government.
April 22nd, 2009 at 9:57 pm
http://e-wavecharts.com/dowlt_index.gif
April 22nd, 2009 at 11:07 pm
Someguy:
#17 someguy, unlike you and your ( supposed) incompetant colleagues I have several advanced qualifications in Urban Economics and Chartered Survey. I have been to many “meetings’ ( possibly for more years than you’ve been alive0 and it’s these PC pukes, the history of political corruption and the generally incompetant who have fucked up livability in the Metro area so consistently for the past 40 years rendering this city a disfunctional fractured joke. Most people who know about these things commonly say that this shithole looks like it was designed by a bunch of drunks. Vancouver is shithole, more resembling a strip mall than a functioning urban enviornment. Have you ever travelled? Have you ever visited a real city?
Are you going to stick your little dickhead out and tell us that the transportation plan for Vancouver was put together by “really hard working people”. In fact Vancouver has the worst transpo design in the world. I’ve been to many third world countries that have better planning sense. Compared to all the other major urban planning designs Vancouvers planners come off looking like absolute idiots. The only other city on the planet that was stupid enough to buy the ‘Skytrain’ design has been Bangkok. With all due respect the Thai’s have done a much better job of it in spite of it being the most inefficient system ever designed. But you wouldn’t know anything about that would you.
What are you saying to the retail vendors who have gone broke due to the PC incompetant planners? DID YOU SEE THE CUT AND COVER PROJECT DOWN NATHAN RD IN HONG KONG? NOT A SINGLE RETAILER OR PEDESTRIAN LOST A STEP IN THE PROCESS. Why did Vancouvers little hissy fit of not going down the obvious Arbutus route or down the “heritage Corridor’ have to destroy the livelihood of so many hard working buisness men and women?
Are you going to tell me that the planners got the leaky condos engineering right? I was there fuck face, arguing that these buildings were failing as they were being built. Are you going to tell all the seniors who lost thier life savings how ‘hard working’ you are?
Are you going to argue that it was OK to allow substandard space variants for the high rise towers built recently that have allready been widely recognized as functionally obselete. Is this another example of your ‘Hard work”. You smary little prick, you and your PC colleagues should all be freaking ashamed of yourselves for being such incompetant dipshits. Look at the mess two generations of political fuck ups in the planning dept have done to the COV.
Look dipshit, I could go on for hours ( I could, I used to teach this crap) about the complete horror show that has been created by incompetant boobs in the various planning commissions, but everyone on this board who has ever driven through the area already knows how screwed up this place has become. They already know that the government and it’s minions have failed them miserably. Tell your boss to hire a few chimps, they’d do a better job.
April 23rd, 2009 at 4:10 am
dear renniewhereaareu
“Plus why should someone earning $100K be made to pick up the shit from the incompetent bankers and government. ”
—
Err, because, if you read the article in #10 I was responding to, those earning aboive 100k were referred to as “the bankers”. Who is the moron now?
April 23rd, 2009 at 4:11 am
dear denial
“#12 read on, our wages are the lowest in the developed world. Dollar for dollar we are ranked below the poorest state in the US. Do you agree with the CDN government policies developed by Trudeau and perfected by Chretien Liberal Party which have kept you poor, undereducated, unemployed and subservient.”
—–
I am neither poor, undereducated, unemployed nor subservient. Please do not project your own issues onto me.
April 23rd, 2009 at 5:13 am
Well, Someguy, Realpaul may have gone a little over the top but you deserved it. Working hard does not make up for failure. There is no excuse for the decades of shit decisions we’ve had to put up with by the powers that be. The only thing world-class about this city is the never-ending incompetence and corruption of the people running it. And the fucking Skytrain is our multi-billion monument to it all.
April 23rd, 2009 at 5:52 am
It seems that all people think about is how the projected population growth will impact the housing prices. Anyone considering how it will impact the livability of the region?
Politicians’ desire is to increase the population of metro Vancouver by another 1 000 000 people in just few years. These people will be squeezed within the existing city boundaries by increasing the population density. This development will certainly benefit some key groups and industries (real estate, builders), but let’s think about how this will change things for the most people living here;
As the population density increases, more and more of the people will be squeezed into towers with tiny concrete cells, with a view to 50 similar concrete cells across the street. People can move around only within a 3-block radius by foot, since all the streets will be impassable due to permanent traffic jam – building one more skytrain line by 2020 will hardly alleviate this. The mountains and the wilderness that used to be close – making Vancouver special – will be further and further away. Just getting across the bridge that leads towards them will take hours. As more and more people move in, even the tiny concrete cells will become more expensive than a large house somewhere else, and thus more low income people will be displaced out on the streets. So, if you leave your tiny concrete cell and go for that little 3-block stroll, you can enjoy the views of concrete towers and streets lined with standstill cars and homeless beggars, instead of the ocean and mountains.
As I see it, quite soon, Vancouver will be more of a stress ridden, overcrowded hellhole than one of the worlds most livable cities.
April 23rd, 2009 at 6:08 am
They are also constructing a skytrain in Dubai, but I don’t think it’s up and running yet.
April 23rd, 2009 at 6:08 am
They are also constructing a skytrain in Dubai, but I don’t think it’s up and running yet.
April 23rd, 2009 at 7:08 am
realpaul:
Are you going to stick your little dickhead out and tell us that the transportation plan for Vancouver was put together by “really hard working people”. In fact Vancouver has the worst transpo design in the world….The only other city on the planet that was stupid enough to buy the ‘Skytrain’ design has been Bangkok.
May I intrude into this discussion with some facts?
One, the “Skytrain” in Bangkok shares only a nickname and outward appearance with the system in Vancouver. Although at one point the hardware used in Vancouver was under consideration, the contract was eventually awarded to Siemens for a different system. The Skytrain hardware used in Vancouver (old or new cars) is also used in Detroit (downtown loop only), Scarborough (Toronto), Kuala Lumpur, and JFK/Queeens, NYC.
Two, the GVRD as it was then called developed a comprehensive rapid transit plan in the late 70’s based on the same light rail technology (not necessarily the same manufacturer) as Calgary and Edmonton. This would have connected Vancouver, Richmond, Surrey, AND Coquitlam. In late 1980 Bill Bennett and Bill Vander Zalm unilaterally terminated this plan and chose the ALRT (as they then called it, the Skytrain name was later chosen by Grace McCarthy). The whole system originally planned by the GVRD could have been built for the cost of the Skytrain to Surrey, So if you want to blame someone, blame the Socred government, not the local planners.
Three, both highway and transit planning in metro Vancouver have ALWAYS been under control of the provincial government. The only exception was when the NDP government, to its credit, set up Translink in the 90’s to allow some local input. Even then, Glen Clark overrode them to choose the Millennium Skytrain line.
Even such limited local control turned out to be too much for Gordo, who recently removed all local representatives from Translink and replaced them with his own stooges.
So if you want to know who to blame for the transportation mess in metro Vancouver, DON’T blame the local planners. If they had been allowed to carry through their plans in the first place we would have a more comprehensive and cost-effective system today.
April 23rd, 2009 at 7:18 am
from NYT article today; already posted at #16.
“They don’t have as far to fall today, but the great real estate crash is not over, either. So if you are part of the 30 percent of American households who rent and you’re trying to decide when to buy, relax.
The market is still coming your way.”
April 23rd, 2009 at 7:30 am
vanguy:
Take a look at the interactive graph at the top of the article. The only US cities that are now anywhere close to Vancouver in price/income are NYC and San Francisco. Vancouver is over 9.
And yet the consensus is that all US markets still have farther to fall. What kind of lunatic logic says that Vancouver is now at a bottom?
April 23rd, 2009 at 8:06 am
patriotz: The lunatic logic that wants to sell you something.
April 23rd, 2009 at 8:07 am
http://www.theglobeandmail.com.....rnational/
Economic meltdown proving a bonanza for Italian mobsters
Mob’s foray into legitimate businesses is paying back big time for them, experts say
Gotta love code name Operation Easy Money. That’s what they should be calling the economic bailouts.
April 23rd, 2009 at 8:14 am
http://www.theglobeandmail.com.....comasses23
The new revolt of the masses
Let them eat RE cake!
April 23rd, 2009 at 8:46 am
realpaul:
ok this one I find offensive..
April 23rd, 2009 at 8:47 am
sorry, post # 20 I mean
April 23rd, 2009 at 9:19 am
I think Patriotz is correct in attributing blame to the Province rather than the GVRD with respect to transit decisions. The NDP had a sound idea in having the TransLink board made up of local mayors, but it failed in practice.
For example, the socialist types like Corrigan in Burnaby used TransLink as a platform to push their socialist ideals. They would oppose any project that was P3 or did not include union workers. For example, Corrigan opposed RAV and twinning the Port Mann, but then goes on to approve strip malls and big box stores along Marine Drive.
I don’t blame the Liberals for taking the power back.
Perhaps the real solution is election of the TransLink board by the public. As much as I hate government, it might be the best solution.
April 23rd, 2009 at 9:35 am
Those people doing the planning are wacked. Population will likely shrink by 1.2 million by 2040. OK, maybe not shrink by 1.2 million. Population growth in Vancouver has been growing about 5% in the 60s, 70s and 80s. In the recent years, it is less than 1% per year. Soon it will be 5% negative.
The population in Philadelphia shrunk by more than 25% since their peak (500,000 people). It is expected that it will continue to shrink. The city of Detroit loss almost 1 million people from its peak.
April 23rd, 2009 at 10:05 am
Someguy Says:
April 22nd, 2009 at 6:57 pm
Do you even know what a strategic plan is? Do you know how much a problem COV will face if the population grew by 1.2 million? What kind of strategic plan would be to make our people to live in shoe boxes?
A strategic plan would be to maintain population and have zero growth. That is a plan. Why would a strategic plan to have zero growth not be considered?
So our current plan is to use current tax payers money to build infrastructure for new comers??? What kind of plan is that?
April 23rd, 2009 at 10:07 am
patriotz:
#27, Patriotz, good points. I was going to add that to my rant against the bloated parasites but feared becoming too long winded, LOL. The point in specificity is that the regions planning was always under the direct control of the temporary political parties and has ended up in a schizophenic hodgepodge which serves no one except the corrupt and useless ploticians game of endless shellgames.
99.9% of these so called “planners” are useless bureaucratic feasting bloated parasites who in fact do nothing, so it would make sense to just get rid of them. WACKY Bennet was well known for his “ability” to plan every thing himself. Give him props though for running one of the most efficient and leanest governments BC has ever had. Although of course the biases were legendary.
The fiefdoms created by elected officials include for the most part pork payments for special intrests and supporters and the reams of political hacks, thier families and followers who leach off the public purse so that precious little of the tax stream that is intended for children, seniors, hospitals , schools, roads, infrasctructure etc etc etc ever trickles down through thier greedy dripping often unionized maw.
We most often end up with siutations like this ( following), although the Translink nightmare is one of the most agregious non elected fiasco’s ever perpetrated on any group of rate payers in the history of mankind.
“METRO VANCOUVER — TransLink says it will be forced to cut bus service to 1970 levels within two years if the gridlock between Metro Vancouver mayors and the province over who should pay for transit improvements can’t be resolved.
TransLink’s 21-member mayors’ council unanimously endorsed a motion Wednesday to support expansion of the transportation system only if senior governments hand over $420 million in additional money each year.”
http://www.vancouversun.com/Te.....story.html
Now isn’t that a classic example of threating the taxpayer? If all these parasites were fired and it was left to the people we elect to actaully do thier jobs ( what a concept) then we wouldn’t have tens of thousands of bureaucratic parasites leaching away tax dollare from the children and the homeless etc.
Regarding the ‘Skytrain ‘ in BKK , it makes the one in Vancouver look like shit puked up by the local incompetants. There theyhave built usuable stations in convienant areas that serve the public. They use many carriages which are much wider and more comfortable, the sheeple aren’t squeezed like like lice in a small tin as they are here. It was actually an Italian company that engineered and built it although the name escapes me. I hate being argumentative ( LOL) but I seem to remember the KL systemm being primarily at grade level.
And finally, I have to disagree with “allow the planners to do thier job” , there never was a plan, thats why the city looks like it was designed by drunken chimpanzee’s.
April 23rd, 2009 at 10:38 am
Canadas growth falls at double the rate US. Underperforming most developed country. BOC prepares to go into a massive debt program. If you thought that the tax hike in Britian to 50% was agregious wait until we get slammed by the fools in Ottawa who think they can spend themselves rich.
OTTAWA — Canada’s gross domestic product contracted at the fastest pace on record in the first quarter, reflecting a new economic reality of fewer jobs, lower profits and weaker spending, the Bank of Canada said Thursday.
The economy shrank at an annual rate of 7.3 per cent in the first three months of 2009, a dramatic collapse that the central bank said will force it to adopt “unconventional” methods of monetary policy making if the freefall continues.
Policy makers sketched out such a framework, saying they are prepared to buy financial assets to lower borrowing rates. The central bank stopped short of stating explicitly what it would buy, emphasizing that for now it’s comfortable that its commitment to keep the benchmark lending rate at a record low for about a year is enough to revive the economy
http://www.theglobeandmail.com.....overy/home
April 23rd, 2009 at 10:52 am
Dave:
For example, the socialist types like Corrigan in Burnaby used TransLink as a platform to push their socialist ideals. They would oppose any project that was P3 or did not include union workers.
You mean Corrigan and his allies was using their positions as elected officials to support the policies they were elected on? Why that’s just shocking. I mean other politicians never do that do they?
IMHO P3 is just a scam to split risk and profit between the public and private sectors respectively and I commend any politician who opposes it. The demise of P3 viability due to the current financial crisis demonstrates that the model never produced any real economic benefit in toto.
That also goes for the granddaddy of all P3’s, government backed mortgage insurance, which I would like to see eliminated. Funny that all of the free enterprise and small government crusaders, including the Fraser Institute, don’t agree.
Oh that goes for the other granddaddy of all P3’s, the Olympics, too.
By the way, back in the days when Gordo was just an alderman (as they were then called), there was a restaurant at the entrance to Granville Island that was known as the 3P’s. A digital cigar to the first person who knows what that stood for,
April 23rd, 2009 at 11:06 am
realpaul:
Regarding the ‘Skytrain ‘ in BKK , it makes the one in Vancouver look like shit puked up by the local incompetants. There theyhave built usuable stations in convienant areas that serve the public. They use many carriages which are much wider and more comfortable, the sheeple aren’t squeezed like like lice in a small tin as they are here.
The locals weren’t in charge of the design of the Skytrain stations. The whole system was a turnkey project – originally by the Ontario Crown Corporation UTDC which designed Skytrain, and then Bombardier which took it over later. At the behest of the provincial government, of course.
By the way, the reason Skytrain cars are so dinky is that the system was never designed for big cities in the first place. It was designed for medium sized cities, airports, and downtown distributors. The Ontario government originally tried to get Hamilton to take it but backed off after vigorous protests. It was foisted on Vancouver as part of a political deal between the BC (Socred) and Ontario (PC) governments.
April 23rd, 2009 at 11:09 am
“The bank says Canada will begin to recover next year with a growth rate of 2.5 per cent, but in the meantime will suffer a devastating recession that surprisingly will be deeper than that in the United States, the epicentre and cause of most of the problems.
Canada’s economy likely contracted by a massive 7.3 per cent in the first three months of this year and will shrink by three per cent this year as a while, as opposed to a 2.4 per cent retreat south of the border.”
Yup, things are looking just rosy. I’m sure they won’t have to revise their recovery estimates at all.
http://www.thestar.com/Business/article/623155
April 23rd, 2009 at 11:31 am
You mean Corrigan and his allies was using their positions as elected officials to support the policies they were elected on?
Actually that’s not what they would admit to. They would usually oppose such projects on more ‘convenient’ reasons (e.g. environmental). Anything P3 or anything non-union would be opposed. Good luck getting them to admit that though.
RAV was studied to death. We needed it. Opposing it based on the project structure was a disservice to all in the Lower Mainland.
April 23rd, 2009 at 12:25 pm
Corrigan and also his wife who is now running as an MLA would oppose anything the Liberal government would do no matter how much it benefited the public in Burnaby. Corrigan is probably the biggest a$$hole of a politician I’ve ever seen.
April 23rd, 2009 at 1:12 pm
Spectrum:
I agree. He is a terrible mayor and worst type of politician.
I have even heard worse things said about him from people who have to deal with him.
April 23rd, 2009 at 1:59 pm
patriotz/Dave: “You mean Corrigan and his allies was using their positions as elected officials to support the policies they were elected on? “
Actually that’s not what they would admit to. They would usually oppose such projects on more ‘convenient’ reasons
Local Translink boards typically get mired in politics without seeing the big picture. As mentioned, even after the board has its say it is meaningless if the compromise isn’t “obviously” in the interest of the greater good.
Political grandstanding is common but the hope is, if the board is diverse enough, this behaviour is sidelined by the majority. I don’t know why some of the board members such as Corrigan were seen as “key” players when the other members should have had the nuts to keep debate on target. Perhaps a rotating mix of locally elected, provincially appointed, and rotating expert members would have done the job. Or is that what the board was before last year?
BTW the Libs have centralised other ministries as well. The logic is that when the purse strings are held centrally, so too should be the decisions on how the monies are to be split up and spent.
Good discussion BTW. Compared to whether there’s a housing bubble or not, transit policy is a much more complex subject but still in many ways relevant for housing, especially condos.
April 23rd, 2009 at 2:05 pm
BTW health and education boards have local decision making abilities but major capex projects I think are controlled from Victoria, or at least the proposals are subject to approval or a set of strict guidelines. Health boards are not locally elected but school boards are, probably because local taxes have a large part to play in the budget. Maybe there’s something to that…
April 23rd, 2009 at 2:17 pm
read on:
April 23rd, 2009 at 2:32 pm
#22 read on, you missed the point Einstein. The fact is that you are paid lower on average and have a lower standard of living on average than everyone in the developed world who is doing a similar job. Those are just facts. Read a bio of the CDN economy under the Trudeau-LaLonde to Chretian Liberal Party years and you will quickly realise ( any semi literate person will) that the economic policies of the Liberal Party under those regimes and in the interim periods affected by Liberal policy were specifically designed to keep the standard measures lower in for stated socioeconomic goals held by the Liberal Party. It’s in the library pally, read on.
One good example ( one of many) is “The Seven Percent Solution” doctrine dreamt up by Pierre Trudeau, the great CDN patriot ( excuse me while I puke). This Machiavellian plot to socially engineer a specific number of people into poverty and under/unemployment was designed to provide an ongoing cheap labour pool for the inefficient but politically controlled industries in the development of ‘Quebec, the nation of’, is an absolute zinger.
If you don’t think that you’re subserviant to the government, then pally, you just can’t think. Either that or you don’t have any formal education and thusly avoided the dreaded poli-sci electives brainfuck at UNI and haven’t a clue about your own political history.. Either way pally, play and learn or STFU.
April 23rd, 2009 at 2:49 pm
dear denial:
#22 read on, you missed the point Einstein. The fact is that you are paid lower on average and have a lower standard of living on average than everyone in the developed world who is doing a similar job.
————
Again, do not project your issues onto me. In my profession, I am paid better than 80% of comparative positions in the US and the UK (the other two major markets for my profession), and have much better conditions to boot.
God luck.
April 23rd, 2009 at 2:51 pm
You are at risk of Permanent Layoff. The Government wants you to know. Heres the proof. Unemployed people and poor scared people are easier to control. Your Government is not your friend.
“Permanent Layoffs in Canada: Overview and Longitudinal Analysis
Issue information
Canadians are increasingly concerned about permanent layoffs, as many feel job instability and the possibility of job loss has increased in the 1990s. Governments, confronted with a large number of permanent layoffs each year, need to know how to respond to improve labour adjustment and the possibility of quickly finding a new job for displaced workers. Within this context, this paper uses a new longitudinal data source on the separations of workers to address three issues. First, has there in fact been an increase in the permanent layoff rate in Canada in the 1990s, as one might anticipate given concerns about rising job instability? Second, what are the underlying causes of most permanent layoffs? The paper explicitly examines the role played by cyclical variation in aggregate demand, variation in industrial demand which is often associated with structural change, and differences in layoff rates by firm size which is in turn associated with the birth and death process of firms.
Third, with this as background, the core of the paper asks a question of concern to policy analysts: are most permanent layoffs rare events for workers, or are they a continuation of a pattern of repeat layoffs? This is important because a worker who is confronted with a layoff which is a rare event will require very different post-displacement adjustment assistance from someone whose history of employment has been marked with frequent layoffs, suggesting an inability to hold a job or demand-side instability in the firm or industry in which the person has worked. The workers’ employment history over 10 years is used to explore the relationship between permanent layoff history and the probability of being laid off. Displaced workers are classified “low-risk”, “medium-risk” and “high-risk” based on their layoff history, and multinomial logistic analysis is used to distinguish worker and firm characteristics associated with repeat layoffs or layoffs as rare events.”
http://www.statcan.gc.ca/bsolc.....p;lang=eng
April 23rd, 2009 at 2:56 pm
read on:
Again, you missed the point DOOFUS. THE CANADIAN STANDARD OF LIVING is lower. Who gives a fuck about you? Your obvious lack of information comprehension and retention has me concluding that you are bullshitting us. Post your information and prove what you say, other wise you are really just looking like another lying troll.
April 23rd, 2009 at 2:58 pm
jesse:
I think the Liberals were going to appoint experts to the TransLink board, or at least that is the last I remember from Mr. Falcon.
That is surely preferable to grandstanding idiots like Corrigan.
April 23rd, 2009 at 3:11 pm
ECONOMIC NUMBERS KEEP IMPLODING. UNEMPLOYMENT UP AGAIN. RECOVERY FAR OFF. HOUSING NUMBERS FALL AGAIN.
Jobs, housing data undermine recovery hopes
Jobless claims rise while homes sales drop; recession may be slowing but recovery far off
Thursday
WASHINGTON (AP) — Worse-than-expected news on unemployment and home sales Thursday dampened optimism that a broad economic recovery might be near.
Many analysts don’t expect the housing slide to show signs of stabilizing until the second half of this year. They said layoffs may be at their high point, but that the jobless rate, already at a 25-year high, will keep rising until the middle of 2010.
The Labor Department reported Thursday that initial claims for unemployment compensation rose to a seasonally adjusted 640,000 last week, up from a revised 613,000 the previous week. That was slightly more than analysts’ expectations of 635,000.
Meanwhile, the National Association of Realtors said sales of existing homes fell 3 percent in March to a seasonally adjusted annual rate of 4.57 million units, with February revised down to 4.71 million units. Sales had been expected to fall to an annual rate of 4.7 million units, according to Thomson Reuters”
This is just the beginning. We see the ‘optimism’ wear off as the economy dies off and no hope can be offered anymore by the MSM and the whores who sell dreams. We are curently seeing more stores and buisnesses fold, there are holes in the wall of every mall, on every street. People will lose all hope as EI begins to run out and no jobs appear. This recession like all others will last for years and it will drag on mercilessly. Buyin real estate now just proves how stupid you areand how easily sucked in you got. Bwahahahahahah, the fools are going to provide a lot of entertainmet, get out the popcorn.
April 23rd, 2009 at 3:16 pm
recessionwatch:
I should have also mentioned that our BOC governor stated today that no recovery in Canada ‘is possible’ until 2011. he’s moving the goal posts out yet again. Don’t you just love these government retards and thier ability to ‘revise’the numbers when it’s inconvieniant to speak the truth. He’s just said that you can expect nothing but bad news for at least another two years !!!!!!!
April 23rd, 2009 at 3:34 pm
Bad GM news being kept out of the CDN papers, why? Has the BOC news been so bad that the papers have been ordered to cool it? We’ve heard that the CAW and GM are negotiating. It may not matter if all the plants are closed anyway. What’s up?
DETROIT — Thousands of GM workers could learn as early as Thursday that they will be idle for up to nine weeks this summer as the automaker’s plants stop making all but its most popular cars and trucks.
The move is a result of slumping sales and growing inventories of unsold vehicles, but some analysts and dealers fear the plant closings could further scare car buyers already made nervous by talk of a GM bankruptcy.
General Motors Corp. is planning to temporarily close most of its U.S. factories for up to nine weeks, three people briefed on the plan said Wednesday. The exact dates of the closures are not known, but the people said they will occur around the normal two-week shutdown in July when changes are made from one model year to the next. None of the people wanted to be identified because workers have not yet been told of the shutdowns.
http://content.usatoday.net/di.....6565.story
April 23rd, 2009 at 4:13 pm
dear denial:
“he fact is that you are paid lower on average and have a lower standard of living ”
and
“Again, you missed the point DOOFUS. THE CANADIAN STANDARD OF LIVING is lower. Who gives a fuck about you?”
—————
Dear denial retard – when you make statements such as “you are paid lower on average” when replying to me, you are addressing ME. Hence my point is entirely valid. Please learn to construct an argument using general terms if you wish to make a general argument.
April 23rd, 2009 at 5:49 pm
DIR re # 57 this ‘read on’ twit is obviously a troll. I get the point you’re making. We have had a comparable lower standard of living in Canada for decades. It sucks. I’ve always hated the fact that we have to offer Canada on sale to foriegn buisness because we can’t compete unit for unit according to the government. It’s demeaning.
April 23rd, 2009 at 6:00 pm
My guess is that those who are complaining about the Skytrain don’t take it very often. I think it is a great system, especially for a city of our size and in North America. It is also on-par with anything I’ve seen in a city of our size elsewhere in the world (mostly Europe.)
April 23rd, 2009 at 6:06 pm
read on:
Thanks yaletowngirl, but I can handle this fool
#57 read on , you;re obviously a wannabe baiter a troll and a fucking narcissistic dipshit of the lowest order. Do you think anyone here is your mommy, to pat your hurt little bum bum when the the bid bag blog world tells you to put up or shut up? OK READ On, Wahhhhhhh Wahhhhhhhh Wahhhhhh, is that better for you? Did you have a good cry? Wahhhhhhhhh. You misread the context of my comment twice and you don’t have the guts or the intelligence to back up your claim and now your smacky little bum is sore and you’re trying to retaliate with a hissy fit . Well fuck you newbie, no one here is your Mommy. Read my comment again, use a dictionary if you have to. Put your proof up for scrutiny or suck heiny like the wimpy troll that you are.
April 23rd, 2009 at 6:19 pm
punface:
#59 punface, just curious, which systems in Europe are you referring to? I too have travelled extensively in Europe, so I would like to hear about your experiances with the transpo systems compared to here. I disagree with you but I’m willing to listen to what causes you to have such a disparate opinion.
PS, great rants D, keep the trolls in thier place, we get some real losers trying to defend the main stream message of bullshit. It’s either psychois, denial or desperation.
April 23rd, 2009 at 6:43 pm
Dave:
RAV was studied to death. We needed it. Opposing it based on the project structure was a disservice to all in the Lower Mainland.
How about opposing it because it is simply too expensive and the ridership is unlikely to meet projections? How come an elevated line was OK for East Van and Burnaby but RAV had to go underground all the way to Marine Drive? Or why wasn’t the Arbutus corridor considered? Well those questions pretty well answer themselves.
If the ridership does not meet projections, local taxpayers are 100% responsible for meeting the shortfall. That means property tax increases and/or transit service cuts. Everyone likes big-ticket projects, until they find out who’s going to pay for them – themselves.
April 23rd, 2009 at 6:55 pm
This has to be the most irresposible comment from a banker that I’ve ever heard,
“”This is a good thing for the home-buying market,” John Turner, director of mortgages for BMO Financial Group, said in a conference call.
For example, Turner said, the prime-rate cut brought the rate on BMO’s five-year variable-rate mortgage to 3.05 per cent from 3.3 per cent, which would reduce payments on a $200,000 mortgage by $26 a month.
While it doesn’t sound like a lot, Turner said the reduction of rates “brings more consumers into the market who likely may not have qualified before.”
Wait just a freaking minute. If a ‘buyer’ is $26 dollars away from qualifying for a mortgage ( or not) is it a good idea to try and shoehorn the poor smhuck into a deathgrip ( latin for mortgage) at the lowest intrest rate in history. Rates can only go up, so why are they pimping real estate to people that really CAN’T afford it if they are going to have to take it away in five years anyway when rates normalize and that Yahooooo !!!!! low intrest rate has doubled. Think about it. Someone who is barely qualified now is probably at the bottom of the income ladder has no way of increasing his income at the same rate as inflation, so he’s guaranteed a screwing when rates go up.
Are his friendly helpers at the realwhore office and bankster pimp considering the strata fees, increased property taxes, food price inflation ( $26 bucks don’t go far) , utilities increase of 13%, transpo (up), Nah I didn’t think so. A pimp doesn’t usually guarantee the health of the john after the screwing.
http://www.househunting.ca/buy.....eabbcb9205
April 23rd, 2009 at 6:56 pm
Skytrain is like any real estate investment, inflation/population growth/currency debasement make it a good call. Ten years from now the millenium line cost will look like chump change. The source knows these things.
April 23rd, 2009 at 7:27 pm
dear yaletowngirl:
“DIR re # 57 this ‘read on’ twit is obviously a troll. ”
——-
How on earth am I a troll? Denial makes blanket statements about salary and conditions across ALL fields, and then loses it when someone contradicts him. In some fields (and only some, as I make no claims as to the general picture of living standards etc), professionals in Canada ARE better off then in the US and the UK. In MY field (and that is all I am commenting on) things are better in CA than elsewhere. I’m talking specifics, not generalities.
So, instead of addressing the poorly constructed nature of his/her argument, Denial retreats to the fortress of the ignorant: ad hominem attacks. Good luck with that.
April 23rd, 2009 at 8:04 pm
patriotz: “Or why wasn’t the Arbutus corridor considered? Well those questions pretty well answer themselves.”
Regarding Arbutus corridor, Cambie was the better choice anyways, given its proximity to higher density housing and shopping along its path.
Interesting note: cut and cover was tried in Victorian London 150 years ago on the first tube lines and the results were the same as Vancouver’s experience: pissed off residents and years of traffic congestion. London went to a tunnel boring method for most subsequent tube lines. I think the Libs have indicated boring for the planned line out to UBC. What’s better is if the boring equipment and expertise stay local, it could well be subsequent tunneling costs decrease.
April 23rd, 2009 at 8:20 pm
it will be interesting to see whether the UBC line goes ahead given the current turmoil. On the one hand, cost will be a consideration, but on the other, a great make-work scheme (infrastructure) while contracting costs are lower than boom times.
April 23rd, 2009 at 8:42 pm
jesse:
I think the Libs have indicated boring for the planned line out to UBC.
Wouldn’t have anything to do with the local MLA would it?
Anyway, I’d be surprised if the line ever gets farther west than Granville. There is nowhere near enough density to support underground rapid transit (compare with Toronto or Montreal), the local residents don’t want increased density, nor do I think most of them want a line in the first place,
That of course will not prevent the plans from being “announced” as regularly as the Second Coming.
I think both political and economic considerations would favour expansion in Coquitlam, Surrey, and Langley where these negatives do not apply.
April 23rd, 2009 at 10:04 pm
read on:
#65 read on, are you really as stupid as you come off. Get your head out of your ass. Are you a girl? Talk about an over sensitive limpo. Were you breastfed until you twelve?
D was right missy, Wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. Get a life.
April 23rd, 2009 at 10:32 pm
Well, it really is irrational evening, isn’t it? Typical of the purile level of the argument on this blog (cogent posters such as Patriotz etc aside).
April 24th, 2009 at 8:02 am
While I appreciate the passionate remarks about Transit and Olympics etc. realpaul, NONE of the projects that you talk about are Metro Vancouver projects. I understand that you are angry, but blind rage never solved anything.
For a person that claims qualifications in Urban Economics, I would think you would know the difference between the Federal Government, Provincial Government, Regional Government, individual municipalities, Translink, VANOC, and individual developers. So I would caution you against whining and complaining about every poor government decision and blaming everything on an individual organization that had as much control over the projects you describe as you do.