Friday FREEEE for ALL!!
I’d like to get a jump-start on the weekend.. Any objections? Ok Then, lets kick off the open topic discussion a little early this week. Thanks to everyone who’s posted links here, I’d thank you all individually, but that would take extra time, effort and space. You know who you are. Here’s a few gems I’ve noticed this week:
-The Best Realtor Ads EVAR!
-Leaky Condo owners spittin’ mad about stalled loans
-You just bought $21.9 Million more worth of Olympic Village
-Bad neighbors get $15,000 fine
-Could we please have a proper house price index?
-Nanaimo Realtor: No better time to buy than now
-Annual inflation rate falls again
-Low Rates? Buy another condo!
-BC folks dig that recreational property
-A recession spawned baby boom?
-Carney: Currency intervention an option
-Bailout Costs vs. Big Historical Events (graphic)
-50 US cities discover land-making machine
So what are you seeing out there? Post your news links, thoughts and anecdotes here and have an excellent weekend!
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June 18th, 2009 at 4:14 pm
Love the free for alls! But dude, it’s only Thursday!
June 18th, 2009 at 5:13 pm
Well according to Mr. Muir today, now that supply and demand in the Vancouver R.E. market are balanced, there is no further downward pressure on prices…
June 18th, 2009 at 7:56 pm
whoah that teranet housing index is sweet
June 18th, 2009 at 8:06 pm
teranet? What’s that? Sounds like a terminator movie ripoff.
June 18th, 2009 at 8:34 pm
and the bailout nation graphic..
shudder
hey anonymous, any room in your bomb shelter?
June 18th, 2009 at 9:22 pm
Just got back from Kelowna a bit amazed how the dip that started last year and all the bad news from the US has not shaken the confidence of most in Canadian real estate. Apparantly “that is the states” sums up why we are different here. Apparantly markets are expected to work there while we are in some bizaro new dimension where markets and fundamentals don’t matter. And what’s even crazier is I am starting to believe that.
June 18th, 2009 at 9:42 pm
Other Ted
“.. I am starting to believe that”. Good point dude!
You are still at the START, don’t go till the “END” and you’re saved.
Cheers
June 18th, 2009 at 10:30 pm
other ted:
This is a great contrary indicator; RE prices in Vancouver will be heading down again real soon and the more bears that capitulate (if only sentiment-wise), the closer we are to prices falling again.
June 18th, 2009 at 10:45 pm
OTTAWA — The Bank of Canada governor, Mark Carney, signalled Thursday that exchange-rate intervention, while fraught with shortcomings, remains “an option” for the central bank should the Canadian dollar continue a climb based on factors unrelated to economic fundamentals.
One, the CAD is climbing – or more correctly not falling in tandem with the USD – because of fundamentals. The most important one being the price of oil. Compare a graph of oil in USD with one of CAD in USD. The relationship is obvious.
Two, any intervention by the BoC to push down the CAD will bring about a flight from the CAD, i.e. a bear market in CAD bonds. You cannot have both a weak currency and low interest rates – unless you are the US, whose trading partners have a vested interest in buying and holding USD bonds.
The bond markets are much bigger than the central banks. We got a taste of that lately, and if the central banks don’t show them more respect we will get more of it.
June 19th, 2009 at 4:05 am
I hear you patriotzed re the bond markets but I also am starting to believe that the market can just be manipulated by the US government with no ramifications. I think capitalism as I believed in it is now over. If you’re one of the chosen ones (big banks, big insurers or big fund manager, etc.) you will always be around and able to make money. Entrepreneurship is going to die.
June 19th, 2009 at 6:49 am
Fairly good BC (Before Crash) oriented thread on Garh’s site today. Excerpt:
…One observation: People in BC are nuts. At least the ones who think it’s normal to spend a million dollars on a house in a former lumber town. Or half that amount on a concrete box in the air over downtown Van. Or four times that sum on a moist Victoriana money pit in Victoria.
If you ever lack proof Canadians can out-bubble the Yanks, look west. In fact, when I gave a speech last autumn to a sea of US realtors in Nashville, I flashed a current Vancouver listing on the screen – a crappy clapboard bung on the market for $949,000 – and the crowd roared. And why not? The average home value in the US is under $150,000.
No doubt in my mind that BC real estate is sitting on a fault line and ready for the big one. When it takes 70% of disposable income for the average Vancouver family to carry the average home, you know delusion has replaced logic.
Here’s the link: http://www.greaterfool.ca/2009...../#comments
June 19th, 2009 at 7:17 am
Yes, but once we showcase Vancouver at the Olympics, that place is going to look like a DEAL!!!
hahaha – omg
June 19th, 2009 at 8:19 am
townmouse: Exactly! Just like everyone wants to move to Salt Lake City, Nagano, Lillehammer or Turin since the winter games put them on the map.
..or not.
June 19th, 2009 at 10:56 am
“hovering Says:
June 18th, 2009 at 7:56 pm
whoah that teranet housing index is sweet”
Tell me about it. It’s only the reliable “multiple sales” method housing index we have here. I only wish it didn’t lag by two months.
June 19th, 2009 at 10:56 am
“hovering Says:
June 18th, 2009 at 7:56 pm
whoah that teranet housing index is sweet”
Tell me about it. It’s the only reliable “multiple sales” method housing index we have here. I only wish it didn’t lag by two months.
June 19th, 2009 at 10:59 am
townmouse:
#12, yeah and look what our ‘SIX BILLION DOLLAR OLYMPIC 13 DAY DRUNK AND WHORE FEST’ buys us.
http://www.vancouversun.com/Li.....story.html
Shame on to of shame. Thats the Olympic legacy. Good for you Gordo, you da’ man.
This is a guy who’s poking his nose into National Politics? What a freakin’ horror show that would be!!!!
June 19th, 2009 at 11:06 am
Roving RCMP killers plan the murder of Djikanski. The smirks and laughter of the pigs at the inquiry show IN FACT that these pyscho’s are running wild with the explicit OK from RCMP brass. Disgusting details. Canada cops kill more citizens every year than any other western nation, doesn’t everyone have a sense of outrage?
http://www.vancouversun.com/Br.....story.html
June 19th, 2009 at 11:21 am
We’ve discussed this before. I suggested that the Teachers Federation was demonstratably careening the school curriculum of public schools away from academic excellence. Some of you disagreed with me, saying that they couldn’t organize something that deep and dirty.
My belief is that the BCTF is basically a front for the TROTSKYITE bent hard core left who’s intention it is to bolster flagging union membership roles by pushing children out of academia and into menial labour and into union membership. Stupid and desperate people are more easily pushed to the left as has been proven ad nauseaum.
Obviously when the public embarrassment was unearthed and the curriculum was partially re-set the kids in general started doing much better. This has all been BECAUSE a Provincial exam was introduced to smoke out the nefariuos revolution perpetrated upon the children of BC showed that whole school districts were failing. It has nothing to do with individuals it has everything to do with the institution and heres the proof. Sorry doubters but the BCTF really does have a very nasty political agenda.
http://www.vancouversun.com/Ne.....story.html
June 19th, 2009 at 11:53 am
Nov 2010 House prices in Vancouver 15-20% down from now
Fixed mortgage rates 5.5-6% and moving up
Invest in bonds and make 10% by Nov 2010.
Buy a condo and lose 15-20% by then. The choice is yours.
And please dont say I didn’t warn you!!!
June 19th, 2009 at 1:52 pm
Re-diculous:
I wonder if Garth knows that Vancouver real estate crossed $150,000 about 25 years ago. The ‘greater fool’ who purchased then has now paid off his mortgage.
The 70% figure is bogus. First, it is out of date because affordability has improved significantly over this past year. Second, the average SFH buyer is nowhere near the average income. Typical new home buyers do not start out in SFHs in the Vancouver market. Rather, they start out in condos. And what percentage of income in that market is devoted to a mortgage? It’s something around 30 to 35%. But, I guess reality doesn’t sell books for Garth… fear does, so it’s better to take the extreme position.
June 19th, 2009 at 4:20 pm
Dave, nobody cares that you think the median property is a condo.
The fact is the REBGV defines a median benchmark property, and this property price is around 450k. Quick math shows it takes 46% of the median income to buy the median property. This is with rock bottom interest rates. I was very generous in using the full 25% down payment, which even you will admit is a thing of the past. Low affordability with low interest rates is a very bad sign.
June 19th, 2009 at 4:53 pm
Dave is just Krissh, browntown etc.
It already admitted to being a troll last week remember?
June 19th, 2009 at 5:56 pm
realpaul: realpaul, the 1960s are over, man!
One of the reasons (there were many) that I wanted Obama to win the US election was so that the US could move past the silly, polarizing view of social and political life characterized by the “Vietnam generation” and subjugated upon those of us not of boomer-age (and mentality).
I know a crapload of teachers, not only here in BC, but in other provinces and in many states of the US, and in other countries. I have yet to meet a single one whom I would consider a Trotskyite, let alone self-identify as such. I can’t remember the last time a fellow Gen-Xer let the word Trotsky, or Lenin, or Marx, slip out.
June 19th, 2009 at 6:32 pm
Hey gang, a couple things to remember. People have made a lot of money doing the exact opposite of what Garth Turner suggests. Never trust anyone from Ontario, especially a politician. Everyone from Ontario wishes they lived here. I’d like to put a fence around BC.
June 19th, 2009 at 10:41 pm
angry slav trotskism is alive and well. It isn’t just the teachers it is alive and well in the faux conservative movement called neo conservatism founded by former trotskyite leo strauss. The worlwide strugle and exporting of socialism was taken and tweaked and the result was there worlwide conflict of spreading democracy. Well the neo con variety.
And the left is no better what we call political correctness was coined by trotsky and is cultural marxism. so no these ideologies are not dead just rehashed and repackaged.
June 19th, 2009 at 10:52 pm
RealPaul:
“Stupid and desperate people are more easily pushed to the left as has been proven ad nauseaum.”
Your reasoning about stupid people is flawed. Stupid people are not more easily pushed to the left, or the right — they are just more easily pushed in general, because they have never learned to think clearly.
The other thing to remember about stupid people is that they are not self-critical. In other words, they always think that they are right.
Can you reason out my next point, or do I have to spell it out for you?
June 19th, 2009 at 11:36 pm
Realpaul, i’m a former child-of-maggie-thatcher, treasury and capital markets former british banker, current capitalist, now turned BC teacher. I can spot a pinko, looney-left, commie teacher from a mile away and i can assure you that your vision of teachers is real tinfoil hat stuff. Most are just as upwardly mobile, acquisitive, and materialistic as the rest of us and are certainly not trying to “push[ing] children out of academia and into menial labour and into union membership.”
I too hate the beardy BCTF types, but you give them far too much credit. We generally just ignore them.
June 20th, 2009 at 7:20 am
From the Globe and Mail-Globe Investor
“Cracks seen in foundation of U.S. housing recovery”
http://tinyurl.com/n8o9yp
June 20th, 2009 at 9:44 am
Anyone know if there is a chart readily available comparing real interest rates and RE price changes?
June 20th, 2009 at 10:06 am
Now the leaky condo loan well has run dry:
http://www.vancouversun.com/bu.....story.html
One of the owners, asked what taxes are for. Not for this. Sorry bub, there are too many out-stretched hands in the parade of human misery caused by our poor construction practices. And there is only one taxpayer.
How will this affect the wider market? There will be more supply, but it will be known leaky condos.
June 20th, 2009 at 11:03 am
Always glad to get some discussion going on the nefarious world of bureaucratic and union flunkyism. I do see some grudging movement by membership of the union disorder after 8 years of zero taxpayer funded NDP indoctrination. Most of those bozo’s are jst mindless sheeple and trend followers. Fair weather communists you might say. Of course now we’re getting the complete opposite end og the spectrum with brain dead douchebags like Vision vancouver getting into office. Don’t forget thet Gen-X wasn’t exactly a generation that set the world on fire. I mean jeez ‘DePeche Mode’ come on. We’re seeing the exact same confluence of false optimism flood out of grandma’s basement and onto mainstreet. Gen-X’ers are finally growing up and showing their worth and it doesn’t look good. Entitlement schemes, lack of personal courage, inheritance based finance goals. Gen-Weasel more to the point. Gen-Weany if the fuck ups that just got into city hall are any representation.
Meanwhile, weeds in the green shoots, we’re in for a long drawn out recession and a double dip to boot.
http://www.reuters.com/article.....ET20090616
June 20th, 2009 at 1:12 pm
realpaul:
I agree with you on this realpaul. Of course the idiots who mention tin foil hats when subjects like this are brought up usually have no clue what they are talking about! All you have to do is read something a recent high school grad has written to come to the conclusion that they are not being taught to be academics. Read the following book then talk about tin foil hats. http://www.deliberatedumbingdown.com/
June 20th, 2009 at 4:25 pm
stinky ron: What a load of rubbish…
The task of education properly is difficult enough without ideologically-spun drivel passing as expertise.
From the first page, the author explains that the reason kids are dumber in the USA–not Canada–these days (are they really dumber? I’d argue that the answer is much more complicated than the author seems to suggest.) is because of a fundamental change in the philosophy of education. She argues that today’s educators define education consistent with this view:
Do you know any educator who subscribes to this view? I sure as hell don’t.
On the first page of the book, the author y
June 20th, 2009 at 6:49 pm
Brilliant and incisive piece analysis stinky ron! My preamble should have made it clear that i have seen both side of the story:
1) working in an epicentre of world capitalism a.k.a. the square mile in London
2) Working in the BC education system
Now let me think, who would be in a better position to make a comparison – you or me?
There are multiple reasons for a perceived lack of spelling and writing skills in high-school graduates, but i don’t want to bore YOU with the issues. Keep up your joe six pack commentary.
June 20th, 2009 at 9:25 pm
stinky ron:
#32 SR, This is classic. Whenever you win an argument with a socialist they start throwing weeds in the air and chest thumping like chimpanzees.
The Provincial exams provide proof positive that the BCTF was dumbing dumb the school districts which they could control while other districts scored much higher. The introduction of a fair and balanced assesment turned the BCTF on its head and they started trying to lynch the messenger. Just like the responses you have recieved to your posting of the dumbing down article. Obvious socialist response to non liberal arguments.
” If you’re not a socialist, then you must be a fascist and a rascist and a child molester and a generally bad person…..ya right.
June 20th, 2009 at 10:23 pm
realpaul: “the BCTF was dumbing dumb the school districts”
My Komrad!! I am from komunist skool bord – you must not reveal our sekret dumbing dumb of the school distrikts on public blog sites. I am suspecting you are produkt of such institvtion, no? is why you are write so good, yes?
June 20th, 2009 at 10:26 pm
What’s with all the nut-bar idealogical comments this weekend?
June 21st, 2009 at 3:32 am
no idea. is there another local election coming up? (gods help us)
June 21st, 2009 at 4:30 am
Ulsterman, advice please -
If you had school age children in BC at present (you may well have, for all I know), would you educate them in the public or private system?
June 21st, 2009 at 8:14 am
I find it very interesting when people rant on about gen xers being stupid, lazy self entitled and so on. Last I checked, it was the gen xers that are having to clean up after the previous generations gluttonous lifestyles. In my workplace, the only people greedy enough to commute in a single occupancy vehicle are over 50. They do this so that they can have their giant house in the burbs that they share with their partner – no kids, they’ve already left. They don’t recycle, and they sure as heck hate that Suzuki guy for questioning their gluttonous over the top consumption. We haven’t grown up feeling like the world owes us a living, and we have to get a lot more education just to have that job that the lazy complacent older generation complains about until retirement day.
June 21st, 2009 at 8:23 am
realpaul:
What has the YVR incident have to do with anything? And as police officer I find your comments offensive – I very much doubt that police in Canada and senior brass are involved in a campaign of death and destruction. You seem to posture as though you are some type of intellect yet you fall blindly in with the ranks and spout the same diatribe ….. can we get back to re?
You need a life buddy -
June 21st, 2009 at 10:22 am
Can we vote realpaul and stinkyron off the island and get back to real estate and the economy?
Some people seem to think the Canadian housing collapse is over, but we enthusiastically took part in the credit boom and still have a lot of debt hanging around.
June 21st, 2009 at 11:36 am
Cracks seen in foundation of U.S. housing recovery
Though buyers are rushing in, rising interest rates, growing unemployment and a likely new wave of foreclosures signal that problems in the sector are far from over
June 21st, 2009 at 11:55 am
http://www.theglobeandmail.com.....le1190012/
June 21st, 2009 at 11:59 am
dboy:
#41 DB, The Braidwood Inquiry has plainly disclosed the fact that the RCMP thugs and bullies who killed Djikanski lied on the stand, conspired to lie, created false and misleading evidence, had conspired to enter false evidence to commit perjury and misle the public officers of the court and Her Majesties representatives. Provided false and contradictory testimony. Mr. Braidwood has said so himself on the public record and remarked that some of these officers have displayed illegal and offensive behaviour on several occasions outside this courtroom. The native Indian cop, for example, killed a young boy in Tsawassen while driving drunk with his kids in the car and then fled the scene. Oh yeah, he pulled his badge out and told the witnesses he had a right to do his offensive and illeagal runner because he was an RCMP officer. What fucking louse!!!!
The fact came up that he had to be removed from his post at Merrit because he was an asshole beyond the public appetite for assholes in Merrit , which is substantial. That would make ‘R’ a super asshole I guess. Transferring him to Richmond was reminiscent of what the Catholic church did with child molesting priests. Cops and child molestors. It would almost lead me to think that there is a link between the mindset of the two sub species.
The crime and conspiricy was exposed by the defending lawyers and the examination of the videotape evidence. The RCMP has shown contempt for the laws of Canada and contempt for the citizens of this country. They have acted like a goon squad from the very beginning. These are all publicly available facts that anyone can read in the newspaper. It has NOTHING to do with my (thank you) intellect.
The latest email evidence has proven that the RCMP brass were in fact complicit in a cover up and hid the evidence from justice ( Guy Moran case anyone?). The email also shows that the officers were not only lying to the judge and the public but considered it a public relations game to keep the truth from the public.
They planned to blast Djikanski no matter what the situation they found at the airport like it was a sick bully game. Djikanski ends up dead and the officers got to smirk and pansy in their dress suits. I also found it strange that the RCMP brass wanted the officers to be dressed down ie: not in uniform . My contention is that they are trying to misle the public by disassociating the image of a uniformed officer to the less offensive regalia of a buisneess suit to alter the focus of opinion. Cheesy tactics, but look who we’re talking about.Shameless AND stupid.
The Governments own lawyer could no longer hide her shame or disgust at RCMP tactics and broke down crying at the inquest. The Canadian government is obviously not going to stoop to lying for a psycho pack of killers. That part of the lawyers presentation made me proud to be a Canadian.
You may think blustery PR man Dale Carr and the other RCMP spokesmen can obfuscate the facts forever but every other moral and ethical citizen who has a concious is sickened by the Machiavellian word play that is so obviously untrue and cynical. The RCMP is proving itself to be much more concerned about keeping it’s secrets than it is about discovering the truth publicly about the death of an innocent citizen at the hands of a pack of jackals.
What part of the whole truth are you so uncomfortable with? The police have a history of lies and decieving the public. If you haven’t noticed there is a very public uproar against the fact that the RCMP is operating like a rogue institution that has a habit of murdering citizens and getting away with due to the cover ups of the ADMINISTRATION. tHIS IS all PUBLIC INFORMATION . The RCMP has enjoyed their days of skulking behind shadows. It’s high time that every officer who murders a citizen does life behind bars.
If you are a police officer as you say , you should be railing against these neanderthal thugs who are dragging the reputation of all civil servants through the mud, not supporting them. Hiding the facts has got the RCMP in the pickle they find themselves in today. The public perception of the police force is that they are all liars and thugs with no compunction against murdering citizens. Which by the way is a statistic which has ballooned in the past ten years with many cases of dead citizens being murdered in custody. Ian Bush , for example, ended up with a bullet in the back of his head. That was proven to be an impossibilty by independant police ballistic experts.
The police force is painting itself into a corner with their hiding the truth about killers in their midst the same way that the vatican tried to whitewash child molestors in the priest hood. The walls of deception are falling and the RCMP and other notrious police forces will be exposed and it will end up a very messy affair with LOTS of officer/criminals going to jail. Its just a matter of time.
It is after all Friday Freeee for all.
June 21st, 2009 at 3:37 pm
realpaul, you are a nut who is offending all of us who have relatives in the police forces. am sick of you spamming this blog, so stfu.
all, and ALL police forces around the world have a SMALL percentage of overzealous/corrupt/problematic employees. unless you can create a perfect world, live with it.
“The public perception of the police force is that they are all liars and thugs with no compunction against murdering citizens.”
– bullshit. YOUR perception is this. Not “the public’s”.
“They planned to blast Djikanski no matter what the situation they found ” – bullshit. speculative. evidence please?
“every other moral and ethical citizen who has a concious is sickened” – bullshit. EVERY? No, YOU. once again.
“here is a very public uproar” – yes, just look at the protests and blood in the streets. ….. or not.
bored now.
June 21st, 2009 at 5:11 pm
read on:
#46, RO, you just have to read the papers dude. Everything I included is right out of the national editions. Go stick your head in someone elses sandbox. The truth will set you free.
The cops are getting a well deserved ‘outing’.
June 21st, 2009 at 11:15 pm
I just watched a segment on CBC on the recent uptick on the market. They interviewed people thinking it’s a great time to buy. One guy even thought it was a great time to buy a second place with the low interest rates and a ‘stablized’ market.
It’s funny how people put more time and research into buying a car than they do with property. That guy and many of the others who are buying fearing prices rise back to ‘par’ pre-slump will be in for a big surprise.
It doesn’t help when they interview a industry person saying that the lower mainland’s inventory is dwindling and prices are creeping back up.
I gotta stop watching the news
June 21st, 2009 at 11:25 pm
Also ….
U.K. home sellers drop asking price 0.4% in June
http://www.marketwatch.com/sto.....04-in-june
June 21st, 2009 at 11:41 pm
It’s amazing to see peoples determination to self destruct their (financial) lives for a piece of RE. Before any media hype brainwashed bull calls me bitter renter, I admit I am renting because I am (as they say) “priced out”. The funny thing is that I really like being in this situation. It makes my financial decisions so simple. I contribute to my RSP, contribute to my children’s RESP, go on vacation, eat out, and YES, rent for half price of owning in the “Best place on Earth”. Life’s really good! And reading blogs like this and the economic blogosphere in general makes me think that “ignorance is bliss” is not applicable to me anymore.
And as a side note for those who think that chinese RE “investors” will save our local market, please read the article in the link below. It may be sooner than later when the chinese will have bigger fish to fry than spending for the absurdly overpriced RE properties here (hey, I am a renter, I can tell it’s absurdly overpriced, LOL)
China – Economic Catastrophe Unfolding
June 22nd, 2009 at 12:25 am
Interesting story I would like to share. Its not quite real estate related but I think it sheds some light on the psychology of the average canadian and why we are in this mess. I work on a trading floor. And a month or two ago we got rid of an analyst. I was surprised as he seemed intelligent and overall reasonable. Well no one knew why but talking the other day to a fairly new young coworker who happens to be in with some of the higher ups. He made a comment. I can sort of tell when a comment is a genuine observation or a comment from someone else. He claimed in his experience the analyst was a doom and gloomer. My interpretation our fearless leadership didn’t like what they heard didn’t want it to be true so axed the messenger.
June 22nd, 2009 at 1:23 am
People only want to hear what THEY want to hear.
June 22nd, 2009 at 2:34 am
$2000 / 2br – Olympic Rental – Oct. 1st – 2 Bedroom Garden Suite (E. Vancouver)
http://vancouver.en.craigslist.....97831.html
June 23rd, 2009 at 12:04 am
“My interpretation our fearless leadership didn’t like what they heard didn’t want it to be true so axed the messenger.”
What did they axe him?
June 23rd, 2009 at 11:13 am
realpaul,
Dude, your rants would gain much credibility if you made an effort to spell the name right. It’s D Z I E K A N S K I
And before you ask, yes, it does make a difference. especially to his mother and other polacks like myself.
June 23rd, 2009 at 6:06 pm
pimppin, you don’t expect him to actually get his facts right, do you?
June 24th, 2009 at 11:32 am
#50 Tacoman
Bravo article Economic Catastrophe Unfolding-ZERO HEDGE
Anyone thinking Vancouver RE needs to READ THIS!
Congratulations Tacoman to find this!
CHEERS