Current score: 0 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

Current score: 1 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

people just don’t do their homework, reading the contract, asking questions, researching ect…

anecdotal:
One time I made an inspection because the friend that bought was out of town for a while and it was shocking how many fails there were in his brand new Firenze ‘luxury’ condo. Bought a while back at 450$/sqft, presale takeover/unseen. I doubt they would have bought upon actually seeing the thing but presale is hoe they got the ‘great’ price.
Just a few gems:

- huge gap in balcony door letting air and water in (1 inch on the top)
- carpet wasn’t glued to the floor everywhere (you could see wave bumps)
- brand new fridge had a huge dent on the side
- about 50 minor to medium things like scratches, loose power outlets, ect ect…

They thought they’d be priced out soon and felt they have to rush into the market. The big selling points from the brochure had to be removed to to space issues so i doubt they could sell at the same price even if the market went sideways.
- fireplace: removed to allow for more room in the tiny place (mind you it was an electrical one, kind of looked like a closet with an artificial fire in there…pretty tacky…it looked so nice in the brochure…)
- ‘solarium’ was 2 glass walls built in WITHIN the living room. They had it removed so they could actually fit a couch in the living space
- the grande balcony: it’s almost unusable since they way the door opens to the outside only one person can get out and would have to shut the door to get behind the door on the outside to let a second person out. Bigger folks cannot use the balcony.
- the awesome ‘walk in’ closet: about 50 cm deep and yeah you can walk in as long as there aren’t any clothes in there. Basically a regular closet.
-no basement storage room at all

Current score: 2 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

Current score: 0 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

Most people in Vancouver are better off in rental or non-market housing. Unless prices plunge 50%, home ownership is too risky.

Do you recognize that condos are inherently a problem? They are built for short-term profit and there is no way to hold the builders accountable. If buildings were built by those who would own them for decades, I can guarantee they would be properly designed with higher quality workmanship.

Its really too bad that the rental stock is growing old, and all we can replace it with is these bloody condos.

Current score: 2 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

Hmmmm, ever heard of a thing called: ‘RENT’? Forget owning; start renting and save yourself big $’s over the long term. It’s the desperation to own that pumps up the prices and makes others ever more desperate!

It’s not enough that people are stupid enough to pay way too much to own condos in this city, they add insult to injury after the fact by suggesting that taxpayers (not the Government) should pay for their maintenance.

Current score: 2 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

People need a home. Most cannot afford to buy a detached home in this city. What other choices do they have. They are not moron’s, they are usually desperate, a position I hope that you, with your high standards never find yourself in.

Sean Wiens
President – SENWI Home Inspections

Current score: -2 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

Give your empty head a shake Sean! It’s the Government’s fault that it rains in Vancouver?? Taxpayers bail out Governments so when you suggest that the Government should pay, you’re saying that I should pay. What’s unconscionable is jerks like you suggesting that it was somehow the Government’s fault (because they have the deepest pockets) that people were stupid enough to buy leaky condos. I wouldn’t take a condo in this city (or any other city for that matter) if it was free, and I’m certainly not willing to pay for someone else’s stupid mistake (i.e: the moron who bought the condo in the first place).

Current score: 3 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

Sean Wiens
President – SENWI House Inspections

Current score: -1 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

…and yes, they do drive an SUV bought new not too long ago.

Current score: 1 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

Thanks for expanding on your experiences with young adults, particularly around your ethnic minority associates. And I agree with your statement that they are “socially behind.”

As an aside, three former work associates, not friends, are either still living at home or just moved out. One was of Scottish descent, 32 and moved from his Dad’s home to his own condo; another Fijian, 34, moved from his parents house to his wife’s condo after marriage; and one East Indian, 34, just laid off, and still living at home. When questioned on how they could still live at home, they said, “we don’t know any better, so don’t know what we are missing”

I am quite shocked that none of your younger staff took on the matching employee pension contribution. Every job I have gone for, I have looked for matching pension contributions from the employer. In fact, soon as I go my first job after grad school (23) I immediately went to the bank to set up a financial plan and retirement program because I was schooled with the “knowledge” that OAS and the CPP might not be around when I wanted to retire. Fortunately, while having worked in the private sector, I have largely worked in the M.U.S.H sector which has generous defined benefit plans.

#75 ulsterman

“my 75k salary gets sucked away renting my house”

Ulsterman, if you are single, why are you renting an entire house? And if you have dependents, then that is why you may not be saving buckets of money every month like a lot of posters here.

However, if you are single, then a 75k salary is above the median FAMILY (2 person) income in Vancouver of 62k. So, you are ahead of game in income, whether single or with dependents. This is by no means mean-spirited, but you should be able to sock quite a bit away with that salary if you are single.

Current score: 1 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

I’m glad you said this Piddlesbby. On this site i feel there is a tendency for people to claim that because the condo they’re living in would cost them $1000/month more to buy than rent, they are saving $1000 / month. It’s as if they are actually saving this money. As your example suggests, your employees aren’t able to save anything on their 35-50k and the $1k / month rent is all they can afford.

It seems that everyone on this site is socking away thousands a month by not buying – except me. For me, my 75k salary gets sucked away renting my house, running my 5 year old car, going back to the UK once per year to visit family, and going out for a meal maybe once a month. I wish i new the secret to accumulating the six figure downpayments that so many here appear to save while they wait for the crash that appears to never come. BTW my trip home costs me all of $1200/year before anyone explains away my lack of saving that way.

Current score: 3 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

Current score: 2 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

I will dig out the statistics for you. It was a stats can census report conducted about a year ago. Give me a day to find it as I have a hard copy in my files.

In short, the large number of “young adults” living at home in the Metro area was indirectly attributed to the large number of ethnic minorties living here. It was hypothesized that cultural values, where kids stay at home until they are married, was the explanation for the delayed development.

As for my opinion, it has been shaped by my professional employment as opposed to my social circle (as they left home early). I worked in the post-secondary education sector, privy to enrollment information at the graduate and undergraduate levels. Professors and associates at the AUCC have also commented on this trend of delayed development out here, and impact of “helicopter” parents on the system. I work in government relations know, and often discuss this trend with HR managers like yourself in public agencies.

That being said, I really appreciate your example. It is good to see some young people trying to live on their own.

As for the future of 18-30 year olds, if prices stay high, yes its grim. I am more of the opposite belief that they will be superbly positioned to reap the rewards of any bubble collapse, and may get to enjoy a situation where incomes match prices.

Current score: 4 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

Current score: 1 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

so they get homes but remain socially retarded? that actually explains quite a few of my experiences since moving to Van.

Current score: 0 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

One contributing reason why real estate in Vancouver is so expensive is the number of young adults staying at home until they secure a reasonable down payment.

We have the highest proportion of “young adults” (18-30) in Canada living with their parents rather than starting out on their own two feet. The number of late 20s and early 30 year olds living with their parents, or “sharing a house” as they like to call it, is significant.

Even with a mediocre wage, you can save significant amounts of money when you have no living expenses (rent, groceries, utilities). You can even party every weekend and pay for your designer jeans, while banking a tidy sum. As such, you can come to the table with large DPS that allow you take out large mortgages.

You do not need the 110K income to afford half a million mortgage when you have lived at home and saved for numerous years. Throw in a parent’s willingness to continue to coddle their “child” through a contribution to the DP, and things become very “affordable.” Take a poll of any FTB, and I bet you that the majority of have been given parental assistance (whether they want to admit that is another story).

“Forget the chat’s with the barista’s and young cabbies. If they are from another province, they are living here alone, no parents or grandparents to help and they are simply dreaming”

You are right with your qualified “analysis” that young FTBs from other provinces are largely incapable of affording RE here. But the majority of FTB’s are from this province.

Explanations for this delayed adulthood and social retardation stem from the expense of real estate in Vancouver down to cultural values of ethnic groups. However, IMHO, it is attributable to a loss of the independence drive of young people, and the desire to maintain their parent’s lifestyle. They will sacrifice their independence and the “joys” of making it on one’s own rather than rent some dumpy first apartment and eat KD.

Young buyers today are largely making the transition from their parents home to their own homes, bypassing that pesky renting and independence thing.

Unless this trend abates, real estate will continue to be expensive compared to those other areas where youth are willing to leave their parents nest and start living.

After all that, I do agree with you that opportunities abound for RE in other jurisdictions.

Current score: 1 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

Current score: 1 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

Current score: 0 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

Current score: -4 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

Ahhh… the manifestation of intelligence! Look at the due diligence of Thanks Dave, Supraboy!

”there will be a large wave of sellers (boomers and older)in the next few years wanting to downsize…the market will flood”

That was a QUOTE from No-Olympics (#62). I guess you just don’t understand quotes or grammar…

To No-Olympics:

“I will admit I don’t have the data readily at hand…but I will assume that the numbers are correct..ie that interest rates were 2% higher at the peak of the bubble.”

Just look up the BOC tables – you will see that rates were higher at the peak years.

Attention Thanks Dave, Supraboy! Note the above QUOTE referencing No-Olympics again. That means, in plain English, that those are his words. Just a reminder.

PS – Yes, listings are down from the 19,000 in late summer 2008/early Fall 2008, but you will note that they are still above the average listing numbers during the boom years (on average 8500 compared to the 12,000 now).

Current score: 5 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

http://www.househuntvictoria.blogspot.com/

Median Greater Victoria price in October 2008: $495K
Median in June 2009: $530K

July numbers are out, along with hyper-spin, and the median price dropped to $520K. My earlier guess was off, I had expected price hikes, avg and median prices both declined MOM. What this indicates is that it is properties priced below $500K that continue to fly off the shelf as fast as they are listed while properties priced $600K or more move slowly if at all. Official sales stats are: 516 single family homes, 252 condominiums and 103 townhouses or 933 in total–the highest July sales volume in 19 years.

The “buying opportunity” in housing occurred exactly 3 months after the fall declaration: interest rates dropped to equal the lowest on record and buyers bought. But real estate analysts should be concerned that previous high water marks weren’t surpassed–considering the frenzy during the fall of 2007 and spring of 2008 was happening with interest rates more than 2% higher than today’s.

======

I will admit I don’t have the data readily at hand…but I will assume that the numbers are correct..ie that interest rates were 2% higher at the peak of the bubble.

Thus, they are dragging the absolute bottom to acquire current buyers. Where were these buyers before ? This is a scary sign !

I agree that RE In BC is like a religion..or is it more like a cult ? I guess it gives people some faux hope that BC is a good place to work and live,FLIP YOUR HOUSE for Big $$’s !!! even if the rest of the economy is tanking or getting offshored. When I was 20, most homes were still priced within the reach of the average middle class couple. After the Hong Kong expatriate invasion to BC ….it became a luxury.

IMHO….there will be (2) collapses…which may be stand alone collapses or perhaps integrated. The bubble will burst when interest rates rise ( my guess is within the next year) . The wave of boomers etc. will be selling soon after . However the boomers may bail more quickly if they see the bubble burst ( like rats leaving a sinking ship )and want to cut their losses .

Vicious circle, and Ugly either way.

Current score: 0 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

Current score: -6 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

When I repeatedly chat with 20 year old baristas strategizing on how to get their condo now, or 25 year old cabbies living with their parents to save for a DP, I walk away with the distinct impression that RE is what Vancouverites live for.

I don’t know about you, but at 20, I was worried about finding a summer job, not what colour I was going to paint my aspired condo. RE, in my opinion, has become a defacto “value” of our little society here. You are judged by whether you are an owner or renter, and social stigmas have been created to facilitate RE purchases. People are not viewed in terms of their experiences or character here as much as they are by the title “owner” or “renter.” When a value becomes part of a society, it takes some time for it be modified or altered. It is a sad commentary on Vancouver, but nowhere else have I seen such an enduring fascination with RE.

As for the timing of the market, I think you have implied several more years as you mentioned that “there will be a large wave of sellers (boomers and older)in the next few years wanting to downsize…the market will flood”

That is my point – we may see another 5 years become the inevitable crash comes…

Current score: 4 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)

I agree with much of your last post.

However,….In a reducto ad absurdum argumment, what if Gov’t legislated zero interest payments ? People still need an income to make payments and pay down the debt incurred from the original purchase price. How secure are their jobs as unemployment mounts ?

Everybody is h-a-p-p-y if:
(i) The seller can sell
(ii) The buyer can buy
in some sort of equilibria.

Will the Buyer pool continue ad infinitum ?
I submit not enough exist to maintain the current prices.
Then the Sellers get upset because they didn’t get peak price or lost out.
In my view… , demograpically, there will be a large wave of sellers (boomers and older)in the next few years wanting to downsize…the market will flood.

In the 1980′s, local RE prices did bubble and collapse to 50% off peak.

IMHO, people are buying because they feel prices will go up, a combination of fear (of missing out)and greed. Low interest rates, the key to this, can’t continue, as to do so will make an already bad situation even worse. I’m not even sure there are that many greater fools left .

Current score: 3 (to vote for this comment, please visit the site)