Friday Free-for-fall!
It’s Friday Free-for-all time, and boy is it starting to feel like autumn here in Vancouver. Equity markets certainly spent Thursday falling, should we expect to see a seasonal downturn in BC housing markets as well? This is the place to discuss anything related to real estate and the economy.. Here are a few stories I’ve noticed lately to kick off the conversation:
-Coldwell Banker: Canadian real estate a world ‘bargain’
-BC real estate returning to a sellers market?
-Vancouver population growth comparison
-Stocks tumble on economic doubts
-IMF: Canada to lead global recovery
-Economic rebound could be slow in BC
-Lets pay people to buy houses!
-Auto sales crash after losing clunker cash
-Finding a new ‘normal’ for the global economy
So what are you seeing out there? Post your news links, thoughts and anecdotes here and have an excellent weekend!
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Supraboy Says:
October 1st, 2009 at 9:52 pm
You got it, BC’s going back to a sellers market. So how many fools here missed out on the dip, raise your dinky hands.
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Arwen Says:
October 1st, 2009 at 10:05 pm
Supraboy, you do know there are other investments, right?
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other ted Says:
October 1st, 2009 at 11:19 pm
I think the article made a mistake with showing brisbane at $217,000 for a home that would be 1.2million in vancouver. From what I understand Australia’s bubble was as bad as ours. Anyways the list is a joke I don’t see how they get affordablility out of that list.Vancouver was near the top of the list. So if I were to read into it correctly the spin is buy in Vancouver, Charlottetown is a steal. Nice bizarro world logic there.
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nonymouse Says:
October 1st, 2009 at 11:29 pm
Interesting comment on the motley fool podcast for 9/30/09.
From economist Simon Johnson at about 12:45 minutes in.
http://tinyurl.com/y9yehmx
“…The next wave of bubbles is coming in emerging markets …it’s almost certainly coming to countries and places that did well in this crisis. Places that people now think are, you know, recession-proof or collapse-proof. That’s the classic sort of cycle that you get into. Crisis, fear, panic then a recovery, then you start to beleive that some people are some how never going to be touched … and this is always a mistake.”
Interesting interview.
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Anonymoose Says:
October 1st, 2009 at 11:39 pm
The Colbert Report just did a plug for Vancouver 2010 – that’s about the first time most people in the USA will have heard about it.
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Anonymous Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 12:00 am
From: B.C. real estate returning to ‘seller’s market’: report
‘If you “invest” in a house you own a tangible asset that you can see, touch and feel. Stocks are often manipulated or use false accounting to inflate their value. Even if you overpay for a house, you own a physical asset that you can rent, live in…whatever.’
People are so blind … real estate is the most honest investment eh? No one is manipulating the RE bubble? People in this city is so hell bent on RE it makes me sick, can’t want till the bubble pop.
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browntown Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 12:11 am
oh yeeeah nutslaps! garth T visit 3vets for bunker kit!
big bear movie cuming
“2012″
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Anon Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 2:16 am
These people are on drugs and are not checking their facts- there is no way a “typical 4 bdrm house” costs $1.37 million in Romania!
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patriotzed Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 5:03 am
From that reliable source, Coldwell Banker:
More apples versus oranges nonsense.
Both Beverly Hills and La Jolla (which is in north metro San Diego) are counterparts to West Vancouver – rich suburbs. I don’t know whether they are talking about CoV or Metro Vancouver, but the comparison is bogus in either case.
They also compare 4-BR detached houses against each other in a range of cities around the world. This is meaningless, since in places like Singapore or Shanghai they are only for rich people. Of course they are going to cost more than in North America.
Simply comparing house prices in one city against another is meaningless. What matters is price versus rent for the same house and price versus income for the same market. On both counts Vancouver is one of the most overpriced markets in the world.
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patriotzed Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 5:12 am
And…
Well obviously they didn’t talk to Tim Geithner.
When looking at RE markets you have to ignore city boundaries and look at the whole metro. Geithner’s house is not in NYC, but it’s only 1/2 hour from Manhatten on the train.
Utter nonsense.
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patriotzed Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 5:25 am
Baloney from the Globe and Mail:
Canada’s anemic first-time home buyers’ credit
All government credits for home ownership make housing more expensive and less affordable. They benefit only sellers and the RE industry at the expense of everyone else.
The way to get any RE market back to normal is to let prices fall to normal levels.
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crabman Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 6:19 am
@patriotzed:
Exactly. If you want a better comparison, look to the Seattle area. The most expensive Washington city in their report is Bellevue – $781,825.
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realpaul Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 7:25 am
@crabman:
Exactly, comparing Vancouver to La Jolla or Beverly Hills is just stupid. Why not Vancouver to Paris or London, New York. The fact is that Vancouver is none of those things. Seattle is a far better comparision in terms of location, industry, pop, etc etc. Good time to invest…… Bwahahahahahahahaha.
Meanwhile, I see that official numbers put umemployment at 9.8%, its really 20% but you’ll never get the government to own up to it.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/200.....NzcmF0ZXI-
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patriotzed Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 7:52 am
@realpaul:
Metro Seattle is quite a bit bigger than Metro Vancouver and has a lot more world-class industry (Microsoft, Boeing, Amazon.com, Starbucks, etc).
The most appropriate comparison is Portland, Oregon which has about the same population for both the city proper and the metro and has about the same amount of world-class industry (i.e. very little).
http://www.movingtoportland.net/homes_price.htm
Nuff said.
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Mark Downs Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 8:03 am
I see that Campbell wants to limit municipalities ability to raise taxes:
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/briti.....ights.html
This should be interesting…
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rentah Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 8:16 am
We should all curse (and punish) those policy makers that have created the perverse monetary and market circumstances of the last 10+ years. They have forced honest citizens to become financial hustlers simply to try to keep their heads above water. The effects have been profoundly distracting and counter-productive for the society, and they are far from having run their full course.
Here’s a wonderfully straightforward article on the effects of inflation on individuals:
Inflation’s Moral Hazard
An age of loose money not only destroys savings; it corrodes character.
by Theodore Dalrymple
Excerpts:
—
(My father) sold his business in the sixties, at the end of the period of price stability that had reigned throughout his life, for what then seemed a large amount of money. He was a man who, for both temperamental and ideological reasons, held a deep contempt for financial speculation and wheeling and dealing, with the result that he did nothing as inflation inexorably eroded his savings. He grew poorer and poorer through the remaining 30 years of his life, and might have sunk into poverty had he not moved into a house that I owned. And this after reaching a level of wealth that, relatively speaking, was greater than I shall probably ever know.
—–
I still remember the letter that the bank sent me when I was a student, pointing out with considerable asperity that I was almost three pounds overdrawn and asking when I would correct this serious irregularity. Nearly 40 years later, I briefly overdrew my account again—this time by much more—and wrote to the bank, explaining that I would clear the balance in a few days. Unusually, the bank called me: a banker wanted to see me, and would like to come to my house. I made an appointment and expected him with some trepidation.
When he arrived, I repeated that I would pay off the overdraft, and more, in less than a week’s time. “Oh, we don’t want you to do that,” he said. “I’ve come here to ask whether you want to borrow more money.”
—–
I remember an eminent professor’s telling me, with a barely concealed exultation, that he was making nearly $1,000 per day, week after week, merely by owning a very large house in a fashionable area: an amount that, needless to say, dwarfed any savings he might salt away from his salary.
—–
(A good read.)
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rentah Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 8:22 am
@Mark Downs: “I see that Campbell wants to limit municipalities ability to raise taxes:”
Agree, this should be interesting.
Crank up the fire under the pot, AND screw on the lid, at the same time.
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realpaul Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 8:27 am
@patriotzed:
I was referring to the comparison of Vancouver to anything else other than the closest comparable offered by Crabman which was Seattle, but you are correct that Vancouver has very little to say when it comes to competing with Seattle mano a mano. Getting down to the nitty gritty even Portland can stand against Vancouver in many ways. This doesn’t say much for Vancouver as a comparable to any location like La Jolla, there is no comparison.
I note that the article today in the Vancouver Scum relating to Canada becoming a sellers market again doesn’t mention the interferance of the extreme intrest rate enviornment. Happy days are here again….unless you’re one of the growing legions of unemployed. We’re going to have to do something about the optics soon. The lines at the food banks and the welfare offices are getting ugly. I heard through a contact that the welfare offices are busy transferring ‘clients’ out to relocate in new municipaties/ neighbourhoods to flatten the spikes of cases in the city.
http://www.vancouversun.com/bu.....story.html
But if you believe that everything is OK, good luck with that. Reading the information flow these days is kind of like being a manic depressive.
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patriotz Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 8:28 am
@rentah:
Er, didn’t Gordo tear up his own balanced budget law when it became inconvenient?
http://www.vancouversun.com/ne.....story.html
A deficit, of course, is just a delayed tax increase.
Obviously Gordo subscribes to the “do as I say, not as I do” school of leadership.
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realpaul Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 8:30 am
@rentah:
“We should all curse (and punish) those policy makers that have created the perverse monetary and market circumstances of the last 10+ years. They have forced honest citizens to become financial hustlers simply to try to keep their heads above water. The effects have been profoundly distracting and counter-productive for the society, and they are far from having run their full course.”
Thats some powerful shit, thanks for the read.
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rentah Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 8:43 am
Yeah, it is powerful. I can’t resist another quote from the Dalrymple article:
But asset inflation—ultimately, the debasement of the currency—as the principal source of wealth corrodes the character of people. It not only undermines the traditional bourgeois virtues but makes them ridiculous and even reverses them. Prudence becomes imprudence, thrift becomes improvidence, sobriety becomes mean-spiritedness, modesty becomes lack of ambition, self-control becomes betrayal of the inner self, patience becomes lack of foresight, steadiness becomes inflexibility: all that was wisdom becomes foolishness. And circumstances force almost everyone to join in the dance.
Except in one circumstance, that is: the possession of a salary and a pension that the government promises, implicitly or explicitly, to index against inflation. This is the situation of public-sector workers and is a pyramid scheme, too, perhaps the biggest of the lot, since events may require the government to renege on its obligations. But meantime, such employment will seem a safe haven, and the temptation will be for government to expand it, with the happy consequence—for itself—of increasing dependence. And dependence, too, undermines character.
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PorkyFlu Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 9:10 am
Ok serious question here folks listen up. We all know Vancouver is a shithole and we all know there is good reason to buy a shack for nearly a million dollars in this shit town. So what the hell are we doing here? Why even participate in this scam?
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PorkyFlu Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 9:11 am
@PorkyFlu:
I meant NO GOOD REASON to buy a shack in this shit town. So here’s my post again :
Ok serious question here folks listen up. We all know Vancouver is a shithole and we all know there is NO GOOD REASON to buy a shack for nearly a million dollars in this shit town. So what the hell are we doing here? Why even participate in this scam?
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rentah Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 9:20 am
@PorkyFlu:
We aren’t participating. We’re sitting on the RE sidelines, watching one of the biggest economic shows on earth unfold, and positioning ourselves to take best advantage of the fireworks aftermath. This may (or may not) involve eventually buying a Vancouver ’shack’ for less than half of it’s peak price.
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patriotz Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 9:20 am
@PorkyFlu:
Living in Vancouver and buying a house in Vancouver are two entirely different things, contrary to what the civic religion would have you think.
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digby Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 9:35 am
@patriotzed
The most appropriate comparison is Portland, Oregon which has about the same population for both the city proper and the metro and has about the same amount of world-class industry (i.e. very little).:
Correction. Portland has Intel, Adidas, Columbia Sportswear, and a small company called Nike. While not technically their headquarters, Intel’s Portland office is large as is Adidas.
But we do have… ummmm.. Lululemon? bahahahaha.
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Supraboy Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 10:04 am
I know why people want to come to Vancouver, because they want to see the canucks choke every season.
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PorkyFlu Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 10:16 am
YOU ARE PARTICIPATING YOU FOOLS. You are paying rent to property owners in this shit town. You are financing low interest rates by buying GICs, bonds and putting money in the bank. Your best course of action is to leave this city. These turds do not deserve the fruits of your labour. Leave this city. Leave this country. Let it burn.
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patriotz Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 11:00 am
@PorkyFlu:
The market rent is exactly what the use of a property is worth.
Beats borrowing money to buy a property with a rental yield half the interest rate, don’t you think?
Who’s getting the best return? The saver or the homedebtor?
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PorkyFlu Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 11:05 am
What I’m saying is why bother supporting this shit? This place is an utter dump and by living here you are supporting everything you rail against on this blog. You are a hypocrite. Myself I am leaving soon.
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blueskies Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 11:08 am
Rio de Jeneiro “wins” the 2016 Olympic Games
may god have mercy on these poor souls!
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scullboy Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 11:29 am
Porkyflu, I am starting to get where you’re coming from.
This town seems to have three classes of people:
Upper class, comprised of gangsters, wealthy offshore types and people who made it big in the housing boom
Middle Classes, who are barely keeping their heads above water but are pretending they can afford their own lifestyle
Everyone else.
I’ve never met so many gangsters as I have in Vancouver and bear in mind these people admitted they’re gangsters. One kid got kicked out of culinary school when the head of the school discovered he was only using his education as a cover. And that’s just the kid they happened to catch.
I’ve given up trying to figure this town out…. I’m giving it a couple more months, then I’m packing it in for somewhere else. I’ve spoken to a lot of people between 35 – 45 who are saying the same thing….. “Yeah it’s pretty but I’ll never be able to afford more then a 2 bedroom apartment I’ll have to share with a roommate.”
My own roommate is preparing to leave. He’s in construction. He runs fiber optic cable through new buildings. He was saying the whole construction industry is set to dry up completely after the Olympics.
It’s sad but to be totally blunt, I don’t think natural born Canadians can move to Vancouver and compete. Guys like Supraboy can because they live with Mummy and Daddy but that’s hardly competing, it’s just extending adolescence indefinitely. I think you’ll all agree his posts illustrate my point perfectly.
I’s say the city will collapse in on itself when all those 35-45 years olds migrate somewhere else, but after three years I can figure out how Vancouver ever functioned as a city. There aren’t a lot of head offices. It’s expensive to start a business here. Except for construction and tourism, there just aren’t many industries to support the population.
I know a lot of bears are patiently waiting with loads of money to buy a cheap house but if what’s left of the local economy goes tits up, do you really want to live in a city with high unemployment? There’s a pretty good chance you’ll lose your own jobs and then, you’ll just eat away at your cash while you look for another. You won’t be quite as screwed as everyone else, but you’ll be screwed nonetheless.
Frankly I’m starting to think East Coast. It’s a low level of economic activity but everything is quite a lot cheaper. Happy hour drinks are still a couple of bucks, and a burger and beer won’t run you more then $10 (here you’re not getting away with less then 20). Yeah they get a lot of snow in the winter, but it’s pretty at least and you usually see the sun.
I dunno…. anyone else feel the way I do? I’m tired of sitting on the damn sidelines and I refuse to make a ridiculous purchase. I’m sure Supra and a few others will be gleeful but I’m beyond caring even about that.
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Hey Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 11:52 am
@scullboy:
Yip our family feels alot like you. We’re in our early thirties and just starting our family. For now, we’ll hang in here for awhile longer and see what happens. However niether of us feel married to living in Vancouver and if we can provide better for our family somewhere else we’ll move.
As a side note, I noticed that recently housing prices in places like Ottawa, Halifax and Montreal have gone above pre-reccesion highs. Interesting development anyway…
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patriotz Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 12:06 pm
@rentah:
I have a couple of problems with this. First, as I have said previously, asset inflation is not a source of wealth. It simply creates the illusion of wealth, and a vehicle for the transfer of wealth from the stupid (the buyers) to the smart (the sellers). Maybe that’s what he meant but he could have said it better.
Second, nobody has to participate in asset inflation, because the only things people need to buy are consumables, by definition. Nobody ever had to buy pets.com, and nobody ever has to buy a house either. And asset prices inevitably must revert to fundamentals. Because of this, asset inflation does not truly represent debasement of the currency – just a temporary mispricing of capital. Debasement of the currency is caused by consumer price inflation.
As I have said before, just say no to overpriced assets.
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Hovering Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 12:16 pm
http://www.theglobeandmail.com.....le1306445/
I read this article a couple of days ago and I can’t get the stupidity of it out of my head. The author is lamenting that the Conservatives broke an election promise to do away with the capital gains tax.
Capital gains attract taxes when you sell capital property such real estate (unless it was your primary residence -lived in it for at least a year) stocks, bonds, mutual funds etc..
Apparently the Conservatives considered eliminating capital gains taxes so long as you “reinvested the money within 6 months”.
As I see it this idea would only fuel the speculative disease under which we are now suffering. Stocks could be bought and sold without tax consequences. RE speculators could keep flipping houses until they settled in one for a year and then sold it – without paying tax – only to start flipping again.
my gawd the ideas people come up with to keep the status quo going ! It makes my head spin. I can’t wait to see what our “leaders” come up with over the next few years.. the mind boggles.
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read on Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 12:45 pm
PorkyFlu Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 11:05 am
What I’m saying is why bother supporting this shit? This place is an utter dump and by living here you are supporting everything you rail against on this blog. You are a hypocrite. Myself I am leaving soon. ——–
——–
Good, cya then. Close the door on your way out.
Vancouver may have its issues, but it beats most other places in Canada. Lot’s of places overseas beat Van, however.
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patriotz Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 12:53 pm
@Hovering:
No, a change in use to principal residence is not a reinvestment for tax purposes now nor would it have been under the proposed changes. It’s treated as a sale, period.
I agree with everything else – the proposed exemption would have amounted to a lifetime capital gains holiday for the rich and speculators. As far as I know less than 10% of Canadians ever incur taxable capital gains under the present tax structure.
38 X “I’ve given up trying to figure out this town…” « Vancouver Real Estate Anecdote Archive Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 12:55 pm
[...] are a good number of non-owners exhausted and demoralized by Vancouver RE price action. This from scullboy at vancouvercondo.info Oct 2nd, 2009 at 11:29am [...]
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patriotz Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 1:08 pm
@scullboy:
Ever?
Canadian Pacific Airlines
BC Railway
BC Hydro Gas & Railway
Pacific Coast Terminals
Versatile Pacific Shipyards
Bank of BC
Vancouver Stock Exchange
McMillan Bloedel
Western Canada Steel
Ioco refinery
Westcoast Energy
Woodward’s
Microtel Pacific Research (MPR)
Etc.
Vancouver is a leading loser in the head office game
But but but… wasn’t Gordo supposed to have turned things around from the dark days of Glen Clark?
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other ted Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 2:35 pm
I find it hard to believe that in 2001 vancouver had more head offices than calgary.
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YLTNboomerang Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 2:41 pm
@scullboy:
I’m at exactly the same point, same age bracket, good savings from when I got out of real estate 2.5 years ago but just not seeing the jobs here even if prices do decline significantly.
The East Coast looks very interesting, PEI looks good if interested in politics (they have all the same federal requirements but a miniscule population) as it is pretty easy to get some kind of federal posting. But I’m thinking South of the border. I’m lucky (or unlucky depending you you look at it) in that I have very specialized expertise such that visa’s are easy to acquire… at the same time, there are only a handful of “good” companies that use people with my experience thus limiting the places I can go.
Hmmm, minister of XYZ in PEI sounds not bad…
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Hovering Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 3:15 pm
patriotz says
“No, a change in use to principal residence is not a reinvestment for tax purposes now nor would it have been under the proposed changes. It’s treated as a sale, period.”
Ok, lets say I bought House #1 and moved in. On the side I bought and flipped condos. One year and a day later, I sold house #1 (principal residence therefore no capital gains tax on the profit) and used that $ plus the profit from my last condo flip to buy house #2.
I move into house # 2 and live there for a year and a day. I continue flipping condos on the side.
Repeat
I think I have avoided paying any capital gains on any of the properties I sold.
No?
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patriotzed Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 3:39 pm
@Hovering:
No.
The house you are living in at any given time is your principal residence. You are not liable for capital gains tax when you sell it. You are liable for capital gains tax on all other properties that you sell. And remember if you move into a non-principal residence and make it your principal residence, that is treated as a taxable sale as of the date you move in.
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23man Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 3:45 pm
I had always heard the famous anecdote that you know that a bubble will finally burst when you hear investement advice from your shoeshine guy, etc.. etc..
Well, my buddy who works as a flight attendent just advised me that now is a great time to buy an investment property in Las Vegas. He’s been talking to a few co-workers about it and wants me in on the deal. He also just bought a place in Calgary (5% down, 35 yr mortgage). Although I’m realistic about the fact that the govt will keep ultra low interest rates for the next year (at massive future cost to our country), the end will come… eventually. Patience, all.
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crabman Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 3:47 pm
@scullboy:
I felt the exact same way back in LA in 1989. I was ready to buy my first house or condo after being in apartments my entire life. Unfortunately, this was the height of the last bubble and I couldn’t afford anything I liked. I thought a lot about moving, and even took a few trips to scout out some other cities. In the end, I just rented until 1993 and the problem took care of itself. I bought a small house for about 50% off peak prices.
I have no doubt this current bubble will also pop. So, like 1989, I’ll rent while I wait it out. (But if you can convince enough of those other people to move, it will speed things up!) ;^)
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Hovering Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 3:51 pm
patriotzed
I think you miss the point of the G&M article I linked. THe author and briefly the COnservatives were proposing changing the captila gains laws so that selling a ppty would not attract capital gains tax so long as you reinvested the $ within 6 motnhs. My point is this change (if doen) would be crazy and fuel RE speculation as I think one could sell one’s principal residence at the same time as flipping a condo and used the proceeds from both to buy a new principal residence. One year and a day later the sale of the second residence would attract no capital gains thus one could speculate in real estate and pay zero capital gains
madness
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Hey Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 4:42 pm
@crabman:
LOL Crabman.
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ReadyToPop Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 5:16 pm
Nothing new here folks. Still a market that is overdue for a correction and has lots of room to fall. Move along ladies and gentlemen….move along now.
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patriotzed Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 5:22 pm
@Hovering:
Wrong, the proceeds from the flip would have to have been invested in another taxable investment to defer the captital gains tax.
A principal residence is not considered a taxable investment on either the buy or sell side.
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patriotzed Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 5:29 pm
@23man:
Well based on current price/rent one might think so, since LV is now down over 50% from peak. However the fundamentals for LV (i.e. real rents) look pretty grim looking forward due to declining US disposable income (which the local economy depends on) and climate change (water supply, air conditioning).
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observer Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 5:44 pm
Bond yields have tumbled recently. It’s an ominous sign.
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Anonymous Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 7:34 pm
Ok, fuck buying, fuck renting, I ll become the richest homeless of vancouver! Will see where it goes.
How did I end up on such a crazy resolution?
As usual it s a girl story! Basically my GF got a new job and need to go away for a year out of vancouver.
We were living in a wicked condo in downtown, perfect location gorgeous view for a “reasonable” rent of 1400 all included.
But now that she is leaving the 1400$ just don t cut it. I got a decent paying job and I could afford it by myself if I wanted but the idea of spending so much of it on rent just kill me. So I gave notice to my landlord. My first idea was to try to find a small one bedroom or a large bachelor for 800$. Oh I was so wrong! Yup I can find some of those. They are basically small old piece of shit basement suite lost in the boring suburbs of vancouver… I m going to end up far from work adding a 45mn one way commute to live in a depressing piece of shit suite. I was so pissed after visiting a particular nasty one with no light, wet, dirty that I realized going back to my vehicle that my truck was as large and certainly more comfy than this place.
Then a light bright up in my silly brain:
Here is the plan, and it is going to simplify my life for the next year for the better.
#1:Work like a mother fucker. Nothing come free and I have loads a backlog in my work. I love my job and I want to succeed. So I will happily go for a daily 12h+ a day. That will keep it busy most of the time.
Then I m going to enjoy Vancouver to its best. With all the money freed from rent. I’ll enjoy going out to see my friends more often, dine out in the best restaurant, get the shape of my life at the gym and the pool. Watch all the movies I want on the big screen and spend hours at the library.
When the day it s over I ll just crash exhausted in my truck in the back alley of one of my friend house so I keep everything legal. No windows in the back an inflating mattress and a super cozy warm sleeping back. Then back to work. For the WE, I m going to get a whistler season pass and ski every single one of them!. To keep all my stuff organize I ll get a storage.
I think that should do it.
I agree this is a little bit extreme solution but in my particular case I think it is going to be perfect.
For all the greedy Scumlord of vancouver, go fuck yourself
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realpaul Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 7:58 pm
@Anonymous:
#52 Jeez dude, why not just get another girl to move in and save yourself all the hassle?
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Anonymous Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 8:47 pm
yar, seems like a lot of hassle to save effectively 700 a month (half yr current rent)
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Boombust Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 9:00 pm
“…way back in LA in 1989. I was ready to buy my first house or condo after being in apartments my entire life. Unfortunately, this was the height of the last bubble and I couldn’t afford anything I liked. I thought a lot about moving, and even took a few trips to scout out some other cities. In the end, I just rented until 1993 and the problem took care of itself. I bought a small house for about 50% off peak prices.”
I have always said our market are/were in synch.
For the UGLY AND OVERDUE upcoming Vancouver correction, look South, once again.
They are our canaries in the coal mine.
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rubberduckie Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 10:26 pm
I feel upset that our landlord lets this house deteriorate. Instead of fixing a small roof problem when it started years ago, he lets it go, and now the whole side of the building is rotten and moldy. It might get repaired in the spring, but it will be a costly job that only gets worse each month.
I know the human cost of this bubble is obvious, but what of the poor houses? People buying them at peak won’t be able to fix anything. It’s a bit sad.
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Machiavelli Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 11:19 pm
Porkyflu said: “So what the hell are we doing here? Why even participate in this scam?”
The moment these blogs have no traffic is when you know the market will tank. But it seems these blogs always have huge traffic. So guess what, the market is always top of mind around here. That IS the problem.
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Mark Downs Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 11:52 pm
@Machiavelli: The moment these blogs have no traffic is when you know the market will tank.
sounds like a reasonable theory, but I dont think that’s how it worked out in the states. From what I remember the bubble blogs had increasing traffic while the market tanked.
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Vansanity Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 1:04 am
That CBC “news” article makes Foxnews look like PBS. What sellouts. Not a mention of interest rates, currency exchanges, employment, income… nah, that would require real journalists. It infuriates me to see advertisement being passed off as news over and over. The real problem is limited media outlets all trying to make a profit. Pathetic.
My wife and I just got back from Maui a while ago. What a paradise!!! That was our 3rd trip this year and the 6th in the last 2 years. Renting has been the best decision we’ve made. Net worth continues to soar… I’m not sure if I’ll ever buy even if the market did crash. I’m chillin and lovin it.
Hi everybody, I’ve been in the shadows but still here.
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patriotzed Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 4:55 am
@rubberduckie:
At least the homeowner has some control of the situation. They might be able to save money by doing the work themselves, or sell the house to someone who is able to do so, or just sell the property for land value.
None of these options are available to condo owners whose strata is unwilling or unable to perform required maintenance. It is possible for the condo owner to lose everything (except the mortgage debt of course) if the building deteriorates enough – the land value per condo is negligible. And this is not a hypothetical scenario – it has already been reported on this blog.
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Dave Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 6:29 am
@patriotz:
I don’t think you understand inflation. We all participate. It’s cooked into the system.
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patriotzed Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 6:45 am
@Dave:
You are the one who doesn’t understand the difference between asset price inflation and consumer price inflation.
Asset prices are determined solely by what the buyer is willing and able to pay, because nobody ever has to buy assets, but somebody always has to sell. If people stop being willing (or able) to pay inflated prices for houses, house prices will come down. That’s all there is to it.
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Digi Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 7:36 am
Hey Vansanity, we were in Maui a few months ago and you aren’t kidding, what an amazing paradise. We went to four of the islands and that one was our favorite. And did you see what’s happening to property values on the islands? If house prices can fall in a paradise setting like that Vancouver doesn’t stand a chance!
Agree with you on the savings point too, there’s a real level of comfort to having the ability to travel and still have money in the bank. I feel quite fortunate to be in this situation.
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Anonymous Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 8:31 am
“If house prices can fall in a paradise setting like that Vancouver doesn’t stand a chance!”
Maui: nice place to visit, wouldn’t want to live there.
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Digi Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 8:47 am
@Anonymous: Really? I suppose it comes down to personal preference, maybe it’s a bit isolated for some people. I love the climate and would consider living there if I had a way to make a decent living. I enjoy Vancouver most of the year, but the winter here really depresses me with the lack of light.
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realpaul Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 9:18 am
@Anonymous:
#64, Property taxes, maintenance/building schemes and management fees are extremly high in Hawaii generally. I know a guy who pays close to $1000 per month to hold a two bedroom at the Kehie Akahi on S. Kehei Road, older building, nice enough location, not worth the grand a month and was only justifiable when prices were going up. He’s shitting nails rght now though because the bills are still high. Property taxes have gone up as well as all other costs inherant with living in a dream world, literally. The costs were deferred when the tourists were renting regularlily but business is off some 30% and the place has become an alligator for investors.
Frankly I don’t understand why it got this way, except to think that its a situation of ‘bracket creep’ thats gotten out of control due to a complacency built in by a high percentage of absentee owners and a longish period of escalating land values which has now reversed quite sharply. Owners just got lazy and thought the upside would never end.
I am a big fan of Maui as well. Its a great place to be a tourist or a part time retiree, but, you don’t want your kids in the school system over there. The indigenous Hawaiians are very much a differant culture. Drugs/booze related crime are real big problems on the islands. There is a hard underbelly of poverty obvious in the local communities and especially now with the recession pushing unemployment up more than triple in the past twelve months. The housing projects and crack crime are not something a tourist generally sees while laying on Waikiki Beach during the day.
Homelessness is growing exponentially. Fortunatley for some its a bit easier to be homeless when its warm all the time and you have the beach park showers. There are a great many families now living in tent communities in beach parks with the kids still going to school. A lot of these people are working poor, holding down jobs but unable to afford accomadation.
The County governments are being real assholes are pushing these people around though and making their lives miserable in keeping with the idea that the tourist is king and they don’t want to mar the view with these nasty undervalued hotel workers and unprivelaged flotsam littering the beaches. Sound familiar Vanshitstain?
I access a website which dumps all the new listings into my mailbox. The foreclosures and shortsales have been huge and growing. Many areas of residential Maui ( forexample) are down as much as 50%. But it wouldn’t be comfortable for a ‘haole’ to live in these areas. In the tourist meccas like Kihei prices have been also coming down albeit more slowly because the market has been supported by ex-pats. But those condos are soft and depreciating as well as there are many retirees and off island buyers who have lost big in the credit and equity meltdown and now are having to dump their second homes. Sound familiar Shitstainers?
Paradise is not immune to the vagaries of the market obviously. Vancouvers little bubble will pop just like every other . The catalyst is just going to be differant.
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realpaul Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 9:20 am
BTW, that ‘grand a month’ is only the strata fee, does not include prop taxes and management fees etc etc.
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landlord Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 10:36 am
I love it when bears claim their networth is soaring. Really? How much you putting away little bear? 500-600 a month? Har har har har. I make that an hour.
– The landlord
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read on Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 11:44 am
on the interwebz, everyone is a millionaire! one million dollars!
tool.
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other ted Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 12:12 pm
I am more of an Oahu guy. Its the best of both worlds,quiet in the north, with the hussle and bussle in the south. I was only briefly on maui but found it full of mcmansions and suburbs with no city. but it is beautiful. But I get your point. Renting allows us to visit. And even to buy hawaii is a much better deal than vancouver. That is right Hawaii a real resort destination is a better deal than fake resort vancouver.
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Carioca Canuck Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 12:30 pm
http://www.calgaryherald.com/b.....story.html
When the largest apartment owning landlord in CANADA says that RE is too expensive to buy right now and that they are not going to do it…….time to take notice.
Of course, what do they know eh ? They’re not gouging 7% from each and every sale…….so that does not make them “professionals”.
Heh.
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Carioca Canuck Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 12:37 pm
@landlord: To answer your question……$2,600 – $2,800 a month actually……..
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woof Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 2:06 pm
Last week I posted along these lines about the macro economy vis a vis Vancooover, and just read this in the FP about Britain, and their recent recovery in real estate. I think it’s exactly the same situation here. Nap time for bears….wake up hungry when the time is right:
FP:
“So prices can keep rising, but only if interest rates stay low and banks soften their terms for new buyers. But the reverse is more likely. If the U.K. economy keeps recovering – and the International Monetary Fund has just said it will do so more sharply than previously expected in 2010 – then rates will eventually rise, probably well before banks return to pre-crunch levels of lending.
That leaves house prices in an odd place. If the economy stays weak, rising unemployment and lack of mortgage supply will keep a lid on a recovery. If the economy motors, rising rates could re-open the Pandora’s box of forced selling. Either way, the bearish case is still strong.
Read more: http://www.financialpost.com/o.....z0SuOfptS8”
patience bears, patience.
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patriotzed Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 2:27 pm
@Carioca Canuck:
They are talking about multi-unit rentals, not the individually titled properties (condo, SFH) which are the topic of this blog.
But ponder this: price/rent for multi-unit rentals is WAY lower than for individually titled properties. If Boardwalk thinks the former are too expensive, what does that say about the latter?
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NO - LYMPICS Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 3:57 pm
46 X Hovering Says:
October 2nd, 2009 at 3:51 pm
patriotzed
I think you miss the point of the G&M article I linked. THe author and briefly the COnservatives were proposing changing the captila gains laws so that selling a ppty would not attract capital gains tax so long as you reinvested the $ within 6 motnhs.
======
Ya’ll remember when Jean Chretien Liberals took away the $ 100, 000 lifetime exemption for capital gains ? ( this was over and above principal residence exemption). Chretien and Paul Martin were the authors of that bogus deficit reduction, sucking and blowing at the same time.
I agree, assumin gthey are leaving the prnicipl residence issue alone, don’t encourage people to re-invest within 6 months…, simply to create or maintain more bubbles???? It’s time to unleash the hounds of fundamentals who have been caged up for too long.
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NO - LYMPICS Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 4:09 pm
#67 realpaul:
yeah..Hawaii and other offshore locales.
I seem to recall the Japanese started that bubble…but regardless such investment is dependent on greater fools unless one rents out ones ofshore unit.
However, as you say bracket creep , kicks in….but it is worse for those who bought at the peak. In addition,things like estate taxes will kick in and blindside many Non US citizens. Timeshares are already suffering , so I can see freehold sales tanking. Better to rent the place for 2 weeks than own it and use it for 2 weeks.
IMHO, if you are a non citizen or non resident, you have a big bullseye on your back re: taxes etc.
Even locally, I was discussing with a relative who lives up coast on an Island near Campbell River. No services at all,(no power, phones etc….like Gilligan’s Ilsand but his portion of the taxes is over $2000…for what ? I told them sounds like their regional district cast a net and included them,and can thus gouge them on taxes for squat all in return. They should vote themselves out , which they can.
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Dr Topper Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 6:25 pm
“I love it when bears claim their networth is soaring. Really? How much you putting away little bear? 500-600 a month? Har har har har. I make that an hour.
– The landlord ”
I really like this comment! I illustrates, with diamond precision, the absolute stupidity of anyone who would buy Vancouver real-estate under the current market conditions. Do you suppose that he really thinks that bears don’t buy because of a $600 per month ‘owning premium’? Try 10 times that amount per month. I can’t wait until I’m his landlord, clearly I won’t have to wait long. Bring it on!
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Vansanity Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 6:59 pm
@landlord: Hi Landlord, thanks for replacing our decks, fixing those leaks and replacing our flooring this year, awfully kind, and thanks for the rebate for putting up with that. You’re too much. I know $800 rent per month is tough, especially with two incomes, but we’re finding a way to manage while we bank $4k per month… ya landlord, I didn’t want to go there bu $4k is an average and yes, our net worth is soaring, higher than ever, plus with the holidays we keep taking… life hasn’t been this good. Thank you landlord, thank you for subsidizing our lifestyle, the 8 minute commute to work for us is just great. – just another dumb bitter renter – LOL!!!
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Vansanity Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 7:02 pm
@Dr Topper:
LOL! Nice, I just wonder how that interest is doing to his networth and I wonder how a 10 or 20% decrease in price would do for his overall financial health. But then, whom am I just a poor bear with six figures of liquid cash at my disposal and zero debt, ho hum, life sucks, poor me.
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Anonymous Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 8:26 pm
No point spewing, just leave.
#32, Scullboy.
“It’s sad but to be totally blunt, I don’t think natural born Canadians can move to Vancouver and compete. Guys like Supraboy can because they live with Mummy and Daddy but that’s hardly competing, it’s just extending adolescence indefinitely. I think you’ll all agree his posts illustrate my point perfectly.”
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Supraboy Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 8:26 pm
Yeah, that’s me, I said leave this town.
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BoB Says:
October 3rd, 2009 at 8:57 pm
I already left the shithole called Vancouver. Totally over run by gangsters and money launderers. Fucked up place…
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ave Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 1:21 am
Oh dear. Such pain on this blog.
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Lilypad Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 5:49 am
I came across this ad on craigslist — I’m guessing that someone spent $6000 on dining suite to stage their home and are offering the dining suite at a discount of $3000 to be picked up only “when we have an accepted offer on the house.”
NOW I’ve seen it all!!!
http://vancouver.en.craigslist.....36589.html
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patriotz Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 6:17 am
@Supraboy:
BC has been in a sellers’ market for the past five years, because it’s a sellers’ market if the market price of a house (or anything else) is more than it’s really worth – in other words, it’s the seller who is making the right decision and the buyer the wrong one.
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realpaul Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 9:21 am
@Lilypad:
#84, L, I can buy a similar table and chairs set at JYSK or IKEA for under $600. These must be the same people who’s HELOC was burning a hole in their pockets. Bwahahahahahaha !
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realpaul Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 9:49 am
The BS propaganda of late has overwhelmed the fact that fundamentals are still in the dirt. Is it human nature to seek comfort in a storm? The article attached caught my eye and reminded me of an interview I caught recently by the author of ‘Juggling Dynamite”. We ( our precious media mind) forgot that green shoots and talk of recovery were all machinations by the desperats governments to have us restart the economy after they had wrecked it. We were expected to bail out the banks after they had lost all our money and support industries ( auto and housing) that had been gouging us for years.
The big head fake in the recovery propaganda was the concerted effort the government made to skew the optics of the non-recovery. A huge moratorium was placed on foreclosure offerings in the US to try to clear up the inventory. But that hasn’t stopped the banks from foreclosing, thos properties have been piling up on the books and the moratorium is now expired. The second tsunami of foreclosed properties is hitting the markets overwhelming current supply.
http://southflorida.bizjournal.....ly71.html#
We saw the CFC program artificially skew the GDP numbers higher along with the super cheap money for mortgages scam. When the CFC program was withdrawn the market again crashed and we saw Saturn fold immediatley, too bad for the buyers of those products eh? Believed the swill and got a chill, brrrrrrrrrrrr.
We are hearing from the CDN government lucid explanations of how the economy is roaring ahead while at the same time we witness increasing job losses played down as part of a jobless recovery and corporate profits which they state ( Flahhhhhhherty said yesterday) will improve in ‘two to three’ years. Is that a recovery or a pipedream?
Banks have recently raised all long term rates they control and the indebted just got the bad news on their HELOCS where the rates in many cases have been increased a full 100 basis points. When the HELOC is 100% of your equity as it is in many cases that represents a bit hit to your ‘profit’.
recently you may have noticed the new push to trash your cash with many bank economists coming out stating that saving is ‘dangerous’. The government is whining that CDN’s are putting too much cash away in spite of the effort to convince the populace that there is no benefit to savings ( evidenced by their efforts to drive the interest returns on savings to the negative) and thereby convince you that cash is worthless. Saving money means fees and taxes aren’t being collected and they don’t like that and so they manipulate the saver and position them to fall into the CRA thresher.
If it is true that 85% of new home buyers are 1% away from being underwater in their mortgages then we are mere millimeters away from the abyss. Whatever the catalyst may be doesn’t have to be more than a whisper of negative reality to push the farcical ‘recovery’ back into the second leg of a W recession, and with the government having blown it’s entire wad into saving the phoney Keysian recovery last year only to having seen it fail, where will our salvation come from from? Can they print more and make it even cheaper? Its all yet to be seen.
But as the woman from ‘Juggling Dynamite’ said ” We’re primarily in Cash”. Thats probably not bad advice.
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patriotz Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 10:04 am
@realpaul:
Banks don’t control long term rates. The bond market does.
Banks are just intermediaries. They borrow money and lend it out with a profit margin. If they have to pay more to borrow, they have to charge more to lend.
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realpaul Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 10:57 am
@patriotz:
P #88, they do have a say in consumer discretionary rates such as the HELOC, Auto and Credit ( hey, who says you can’t take 30 years to pay off a HELOC or Visa loan) which is why I added the proviso ‘that they control’, but….clarification is a good thing, thanks for your input.
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realpaul Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 3:14 pm
The Death Throes of California
“One in four American mortgages that are “under water”, meaning they are worth more than the home itself, are in California. In the Central Valley town of Merced, house prices have crashed by 70%. Two Democrat politicians have asked for their districts to be declared disaster zones, because of the poor economic conditions caused by foreclosures. In one city near Riverside, a squatter’s camp of newly homeless labourers sleeping in their vehicles has grown up in a supermarket car park – the local government has provided toilets and a mobile shower. In the Los Angeles suburb of Pacoima, one in nine homeowners are now in default on their mortgage, and the local priest, the Rev John Lasseigne, has garnered national headlines – swapping saving souls to saving houses, by negotiating directly with banks on behalf of his parishioners.
For some campaigners and advocates against suburban sprawl and car culture, it has been a bitter triumph. “Let the gloating begin!” says James Kunstler, author of The Long Emergency, a warning about the high cost of the suburban lifestyle. Others see the end of the housing boom as a man-made disaster akin to a mass hysteria, but with no redemption in sight. “If California was an experiment then it was an experiment of mass irresponsibility – and that has failed,” says Michael Levine.
Nowhere is the economic cost of California’s crisis writ larger than in the Central Valley town of Mendota, smack in the heart of a dusty landscape of flat, endless fields of fruit and vegetables. The town, which boldly terms itself “the cantaloup capital of the world”, now has an unemployment rate of 38%. That is expected to rise above 50% as the harvest ends and labourers are laid off. City officials hold food giveaways every two weeks. More than 40% of the town’s people live below the poverty level. Shops have shut, restaurants have closed, drugs and alcohol abuse have become a problem.”
http://www.guardian.co.uk/worl.....state-debt
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patriotz Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 4:09 pm
@realpaul:
In a few years you will be able to substitute “Canadian” for “American”, “BC” for “California”, and quite possibly “one in two” for “one in four”.
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Lilypad Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 4:48 pm
@realpaul: Well, IKEA is NOT exactly the same quality as custom furniture — sorta like comparing MacDs to Feenie’s burgers http://www.flickr.com/photos/yusheng/2034185469/ OMG!
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realpaul Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 6:03 pm
@patriotz:
#91 P, the mania we are witnessing right now will go down in a future ‘McKay’ compendium ala ‘Extraordinary delusions and the Madness of Crowds’ as one the all time greats. We are watching the circus parade by without getting the most out of the entertainment value. Consumer idiocy is, after all, the greatest show on earth. Feel free to laugh until you puke.
Its not often we get a front row seat to history. I have my popcorn bucket filled and a bag of confetti at the ready for when the Christians ( real estate bag holders)begin to stampede out of the (Pacific) Coliseum and realise the doors are barred and the lions are very hungry ( it is announced that its over) and the Emperor has no clothes. I can hear the screams now. How delightful.
#91, Lily, tomatos, tomatas. The snob edition of an IKEA knock off has little intrinsic value in the second hand furniture market. For those who have paid multi thousands for ‘designer’ furniture and such must find public auctions very distressing.
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Boombust Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 6:32 pm
“Well, IKEA is NOT exactly the same quality as custom furniture”
Well, la di da.
A lot of it looks good and it’s CHEAP!
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Boombust Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 6:35 pm
You know something, realpaul?
For someone who’s touring around Europe, you sure spend a lot of time on this blog instead of visiting old cathedrals.
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Arwen Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 7:04 pm
@scullboy: I had a friend go for vacation in Toronto – she was born and bred here. I lived in Ontario for a number of years. She commented on how cheap things were, how much there was to do, how gorgeous the architecture was.
And for the first time since getting here, I thought: damn. This city is more money than it is worth for so much more than housing. I even *like* snow.
My only issue is that my friends and family are all here. Now, if we did a mass relocation of, hm hm, 60 people, I’d be out of here in a jiff. Sadly, it’s unlikely to happen.
So, we’ll rent. For now.
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Lilypad Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 10:49 pm
@Boombust: CHEAP is the word. Disposable is another. At least with good furniture that lasts a lifetime you don’t have to replace it every few years because the finish is peeling off (veneer) or it’s disintegrating from moisture (mdf). Oh, well we have to keep those chinese factories busy, eh? Why hire Canadians to do good custom work when we can buy cheap sh*t from China?
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other ted Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 10:53 pm
okay I expect with all the bad news out there that crash 2.0 is around the corner in the stock market. When this happens I wonder how it will shake up the real estate industy. Everyone talks about the rebound in real estate these last few months but the stock market has not done so bad. Lets see what happens next month. I predict October will be the beginning of a trend downwards. It may not be evident right away.
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other ted Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 10:57 pm
On Garth’s site there is a poster who keeps mentioning the grow op premiun in Vancouver. There could be some truth that grow ops add to the average income in the city. But I doubt enought to justify these ridiculous prices. Now that is an industry I know nothing about, but if everyone has a grow op shouldn’t the drugs become worthless as supply is abundand. Or are there that many pot heads in the US that happen to be rich?
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realpaul Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 11:01 pm
@Boombust:
#95 BB, this isn’t the only blog I haunt nor am I a stranger to old cathedrals. Travelling was the catalyst to starting my first business. There are few places I haven’t been and places I still lust after. Quite frankly I can’t get enough,it’s become like blood and oxygen ; I recommend it to everyone.
For one thing access to a diversity of information opens your mind and really helps one cut through the bullshit streamed through the media to local populations due to geographic isolation. For another, its life affirming and fresh. I have a lot of fun travelling and it seems to make life have the appearance of being worth living. I keep in mind that this was the same thing Sitting Bull said when he was asked why he drank so much. Life is what you make it out to be.
I form a lot of interests, associations and opinions while travelling. I am a fairly hardcore photographer and adventure travel addict. So please don’t restrict me to cathedrals when there are so many other things to get involved in. I did recently visit Bristol where I found some very interesting 11th century cathedrals, like RedCliff. Amazing to walk on the gravestones of people buried in the floor a thousand years ago. The original site was pre Christian Anglo Saxon. Leeds is also interesting and predates the conquest.
Access to information and other peoples perspectives is important to understand the truth rather than the bias fed by a local media for propaganda and misguided nationalism purposes.
When people are poor, frightened , ignorant and isolated the government has more effective control than they would over a population that is healthy, well educated and world savvy. People like me are considered dangerous by the government. People like me don’t take crap ; we know things, and aren’t afraid to speak out.
If you feel disonant personally because I have a life then perhaps you should cut yourself out of the funk you’re in and get yourself one too?
I just got back from a month in Europe. It wasn’t the first and only I have taken this year and it won’t be the last. My last trip was for business though. The next will be to refresh myself somewhere tropical to recover from the ‘hard work’ I had to do in Europe over the past month.
I guess if you were qualified to do anything you would also be in demand and being sent to rep your profession or skill set for a company/organization willing to pony up the approx 20 grand it takes to send a businessman to Europe for a month AND you’d be able to have a more interesting life AND perhaps we wouldn’t be having this conversation or IT WOULD BE OF A DIFFERANT TOPIC?
Hate the game, not the player dude. But please feel free to loose your slings and arrows. I have a few bolts in the quiver myself.
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realpaul Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 11:15 pm
@Lilypad:
#97 Lily, how do you know that custom work is being done in Canada? We have so few trained craftsmen in this country that it would be difficult to manufacture furniture of any quality in sufficient quantity to make it profitable as an enterprise. So whats the bottom line. Maybe people are paying way too much for crap made in China or Indonesia (where they also have a huge furniture manufacturing industry) or perhaps even Egypt, and its being marked up to rediculous prices for Canadian suckers.
Let me give an example. When I was a kid I was in the import buisness. One of the items I handled was womens fashions. I manufactured dresses in Indonesia for distribution to boutiques here in Canada and elsewhere. One simple dress which would cost me under $5 dollars landed ( simple poly cotton cut work sundress, typical of the time) would wholesale for $35 CDN and retail at over a hundred at the tony west side boutiques I supplied. They’d sell like hot cakes when we would put them on sale at $75. My point being, many people have no idea about value and its very easy to pry a buck loose from a fool.
I also imported wholesale coloured gemstones and the mark up is so astronomical it could be referred to as ‘obscene’ to see what a ‘precious’ sapphire or ruby sells for here in Vancouver jewellery shops as opposed to what it costs when persons like myself buy them by the pound in buckets from the mill. I’m talking 1000’s of percent mark ups. Wooooooops, I let another secret slip. Theres another industry that hates the truth.
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read on Says:
October 4th, 2009 at 11:22 pm
hey RP, glad you enjoyed St Mary Redcliffe. Bristol is a great city. Most of the church (not cathedral, as it isn’t an episcopal seat) is 15th, but yes, the site is earlier.
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patriotz Says:
October 5th, 2009 at 3:02 am
@other ted:
So why aren’t rents higher?
It’s the fundamentals, stupid.
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Lilypad Says:
October 5th, 2009 at 4:51 am
@realpaul: Because I know. And it’s because people buy the junk like what you sold that we don’t have more quality tradespeople in Canada. Quality vs quantity. You choose.
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Boombust Says:
October 5th, 2009 at 6:12 am
“At least with good furniture that lasts a lifetime”
Who wants furniture to hang around THAT long?
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Boombust Says:
October 5th, 2009 at 6:16 am
“But please feel free to loose your slings and arrows.” -rp
\
Aw shuddup.
Ever been in the Hagia Sophia in Istanbul?
I have.
Floated in the Dead Sea?
I have.
Been to Wat Po?
I have.
So there. Now get lost.
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realpaul Says:
October 5th, 2009 at 8:30 am
@Boombust:
Been there done that when jumping off for most interesting areas. Ever sailed the South China Sea across to the Spratley Group and ridden turtles the size of a Volkswagon? you can’t backpack there though or fly in? Trekked Borneo yet up the Kuching River by canoe? What about the Xingu River, or did you ever float down the Negro in a dugout? Been to the North Pole Yet. Trekked Nepal? How about that 4 day ride from Mumbai to Chennai? Freaking Awesome . Horseback across Afghanistan ? Tiruchirapalli?
Don’t give me your Lonely Planet Backpacker crap. Do some real travelling. Don’t make me tell you about landing on Kata Beach before Phuket was discoveredby tourists. Or what BKK was like before the backpackers got there. Any idiot can buy a discount ticket, a guide book and go where every other douchebag has gone a billion times before him, thats strictly the goon show of travel.
Try again my petulant pet, and try something challenging next time, without the youth hostels and bonehead ease of being ‘another stupid tourist’.
Bwahahahahahahahaha , amateur.
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read on Says:
October 5th, 2009 at 9:19 am
boom and rp – we don’t care which of you has a bigger dick, ok….
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Boombust Says:
October 5th, 2009 at 9:57 am
Yep. I was right. You’re an A-hole.
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Anonymous Says:
October 5th, 2009 at 10:20 am
Isn’t there a forum at Frommers for this crap?
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realpaul Says:
October 5th, 2009 at 10:58 am
@Boombust:
Call the burn unit.
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Carioca Canuck Says:
October 5th, 2009 at 2:49 pm
Patriotzed……
Apartments get turned into condos, and vice versa on occasion……Boardwalk REIT buys anything in those two categories that makes sense and fits their business model. Either an entire condo complex, or an multi-unit apartment building. But you got my point about the numbers not making sense for the biggest landlord in Canada to not want to acquire any more real estate at this time……I seriously doubt John Q.Public will though…..
FWIW this very salient news tidbit had a small C/C sized placement buried on the 5 or 6th page of the Calgary Heralds business section last week….and never made it to the TV stations owned by Canwest. Imagine ‘dat.
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No Longer Looking Says:
October 5th, 2009 at 8:23 pm
@other ted: Marijuana costs the same now as it did 20 years ago. Yes, I mean the nominal value. At least, here in BC.
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Franco Says:
October 6th, 2009 at 8:53 am
Bears are once more got shit thrown on their face again.
Find one more job to offset the rent hike.
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Time for Real Travel Says:
October 6th, 2009 at 12:50 pm
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BB and RP. Same old, same old travel places.
RP, sounds like all your exotic travels took place when you were already working in SE Asia. So big deal if you traveled in your back yard when you were younger.
Its like a Vancouverite bragging about seeing the glaciers at Banff, the Grand Canyon, or the wilderness of Alaska to someone in Istanbul. It sounds exotic, but anyone here were would shrug it off.
Come back and tell me when you have been charged by a Silverback gorilla in Rwanda, flown a plane solo through the Andes, escaped a rebel attack in the Congo, or hunted big game with Masai warrior. Those are just a few of my real travel adventures.
Save real traveling to the big boys, and keep your childhood “adventures” and European tourist wandering rants to yourself.