Secondary suites the way to affordability
No longer looking shared a link to this story in the Vancouver Sun over the weekend – The Bank of Montreal has just discovered the secret to affordable real estate in Vancouver: secondary suites. Simply rent out parts of your home to others to help cover the mortgage. You may have to wait to use the bathroom, but you’ll have enough money left over at the end of the month to buy some groceries!
Heaney said that on a $580,000 mortgage, which is fairly typical for Vancouver, a buyer would need a family income of around $100,000 a year to carry the payments.
However, throw in rental income of about $1,500 for a suite, and Heaney said the employment income a family would need to support that mortgage would drop below $60,000.
Ulsterman asks the obvious question:
RSS 2.0 comments feed. leave a response, or trackback from your own site.BOM will lend almost 6 times family income? Is this normal?
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crabman Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 8:56 am
BOM will lend almost 6 times family income? Is this normal?
With the secondary suite, they actually claim you can qualify with only $60k. 9.66 times income!
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Purp Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 9:33 am
“a $580,000 mortgage, which is fairly typical for Vancouver”
Does anyone know if Vancouver area mortgage stats are publicly available? For example, % of households with a mortage, median mortage amounts, etc. I’ve found spotty information by province, but it is too general too be of much use.
I’m also wondering whether this data varies greatly between areas in the city. For example, is it possible that West side homes are primarily long time owners who either have smaller relative mortgages or paid off homes, as these are not typical ’starter’ homes. If so, could we expect much less downward pressure in these areas as the market corrects? Downtown condos on the other hand….
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kansai_92 Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 10:03 am
Food for thought:
Banks only use 50% to 75% of the market rent when running their numbers.
It’s sad when families have to live with strangers in order to afford a crap shack.
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DaMann Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 10:20 am
$100k income needed for a $580k mortgage? Let’s see how much income is needed when interest rates are 7%
This whole idea of NEEDING rental suites to buy houses is ludicrous. Why buy a house and have the headache of being a landlord? Buy a Duplex or a condo then. I thought the idea of a house was just that… a SFH ( the S stands for SINGLE).
This city is F@#&# up. Can’t wait for March 2010 and the games to be gone to get this overhyping done and over with.
For now I rent a Million dollar plus house on the westside for $2k a month…with no other renters on top or below me!
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PorkyFlu Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 10:24 am
Anyone seen the new show “income property”? It doesn’t look like it’s based in Vancouver oddly enough. It looks like Toronto. I thought Vancouver was one of the only places in this stupid cuntry to have these basement suites. Is the stupidity spreading? Or is the moldy basement suite a nation wide epidemic?
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DaMann Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 10:26 am
@Purp:
Purp, The Westside rises fast and drops fast. All you have to do is look at the mini correction we had last fall before this current dead cat bounce. The city average was 15%, but westside had a good drop of 20+%. It also pulled back the highest in this latest stupid run up. It’s back up to peak levels again. So will it hold it’s value? No, I think it will get smacked just as hard as condos. There are lot’s of new families there pulling HUGE mortgages praying to god interest rates stay low.
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buff_butler Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 10:30 am
so in order to increase the number of owners we will need to increase the number of renters? Hmmmm… unsustainable? This is a short term solution however I think this could also throw the rental market out of wack. These people also become prime candidates for forclosure durring the next recession due to having external dependancies. Your also claiming unproven income wich is again more risk. Instead all these affordability policies are creating a vaccum for new buyers to occupy that never would have bought in the first place (or sooner then normal) further bidding up prices; I dont think this will be that big of an effect compared to 30-40yr mortgages because its rediculous but I bet a few people will go for it.
This really sounds like the product of a builders lobby group to me.
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Starving Artist Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 10:42 am
I love the term “Fonzie Scheme” – as in, you have to have a renter (at least one – my friends rented the top and basement floors to pay theirs) to make the numbers work. The last thing in the world I want is to be a landlord, so screw that!!
It’s just one of those things you have to put up with in exchange for living in “the best place on earth”.
I wonder how this lovely back-to-normal weather is going to affect the market. I think all the sun this summer cooked people’s brains.
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condosalesgirl Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 10:47 am
Thanks VCI for getting rid of those nasty bears. The negative opinions expressed by people who don’t want to listen to my industries message were really getting annoying. After all we real estate sales people have bills to pay and condos to sell. We need to keep the public happy and buying rather than have them focus on those ignorant homeless people and other bad things.
Thanks for providing a platform for persons like myself to make the message heard ‘That real estate prices will never go down’. Its only with sensible censorship initiatives that we can make sure that everyone stays on message.
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jojo Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 10:47 am
If what BMO suggests becomes the new norm, we’ll see a massive increase in rental suites, meaning a massive decrease in rents, meaning more renters and fewer buyers, meaning a massive decrease in home prices, meaning more people will buy, meaning fewer renters…
In others words, it’s not a very good plan to rely on a rental suite to pay for your house.
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Not much of a name Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 11:13 am
@buff_butler:
I agree with that. If homeownership is at all time highs, where are the renters coming from to support the mortgage helpers? Something doesn’t add up.
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Drachen Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 11:35 am
Ok, I just did a search for 4+ bedroom 2+ bathroom house on MLS, in the 550-650k range, by the time you get anything big enough to charge $1,500 for a suite it’s too far east for you to get $1,500, if you up the size you have to go farther and farther east and it looks to me like you’d never actually reach any house in that price range that you could realistically live in and rent out for 1.5k at the same time.
So don’t even have realistic market assumptions to plug into their theory. Given the size and capability of the bank I’m sure they COULD have looked up the numbers if they’d wanted to (and so could the reporter, it only took me 2 minutes) so this is a propaganda piece both by the bank and the newspaper with no basis in reality.
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read on Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 12:28 pm
Yup, friends have a place on 11th a block or so from Alma, which has to be “worth” 1.5 mil, and they only get $1500 for their basement suite.
article read like a POS to me.
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YLTNBoomerang Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 12:43 pm
Evicted! It’s official, we got our 2 month notice, found a place a couple days later and gave our 10 days notice; can’t wait for the month rent bonus cheque (will cover the move including packing and boxes plus enough for a new TV!). Our new landlord only wanted a 6 month lease as she is unsure what she will do with the place so looks like we’ll get cheaper rent again in 6 months and maybe another bonus move cheque. The only problem in this scenario is that as rents decline, eventually the bonus month cheque won’t cover moving expenses (and a tv! ha!)…I guess then it is time to buy.
So my question is if the one month’s rent is supposed to cover moving costs and a full service move costs maximum $800 for a 2 bdrm local move, is $800-1000 where our rent should be?
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Purp Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 12:50 pm
I don’t understand those numbers in the article. Assuming you receive $1500/month rental income, this is only $18,000 annually (of which only 80% is applied to the mortgage, according to the article, less than $15,000). However, they’re claiming a income requirement reduction of over $40,000, to ‘below $60,000′. How does that jive?
BTW, using BMO’s mortgage calculator ($100K income, $200/month tax, $100/month heating), to carry a $580,000 mortgage requires a 35 year amortization with an interest rate of 2.9%! Frightening.
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Purp Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 12:53 pm
@DaMann “$100k income needed for a $580k mortgage? Let’s see how much income is needed when interest rates are 7%”
…$160,000…according to BMO mortgage calculator
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NO - LYMPICS Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 12:54 pm
Good comments:
I agree, the article is a joke.
IMHO, they are dredging the bottom of the bag of tricks to create sales.
I think more signs indicate it will be a renters market.
McMansions will end up as rooming houses.
Basement Rental suites ?
Those tend to be in older housing stock that has often had its mortgage paid off years ago…or a holding property. Careful re: if they are legal, or require a City license, or if your neighbour complains or don’t report to CRS.
As a mortgage helper these days?…not worth the risk or the hassle. Don’t be dependent on a renter,all that does is help keep the bubble inflated . Virgin landlords can get be the first to get screwed by a number of circumstances.
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YLTNBoomerang Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 1:01 pm
Bear is in agony and crying for answer;the answer is Chinese purchasing power is invincible worldwide.Give up now or you will be crushed miserably for the yrs to come.
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NO - LYMPICS Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 1:05 pm
18 X YLTNBoomerang:
Is that really you in comment # 18 or Supraboy?
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NO - LYMPICS Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 1:07 pm
YLTNBoomerang:
If you don’t mind my asking, why did you get an eviction notice? They had to submit grounds, didn’t they ?
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DaMann Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 1:13 pm
@Purp:
Purp
Thanks for the info.
With higher interest rates also comes higher rates on all the Home equity loans too. So that $160k could be closer to 200k
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pricedoutfornow Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 1:20 pm
So ridiculous when a “SFH” actually is a “MFH” but people brag that they now own a house-a SFH plus basement suite tenants! Oh please. I know people who share a house with the landlord and I wonder why, is it really worth the hassle? They don’t even have a backyard (it’s all paved for parking/back deck) Wouldn’t a townhouse be better (and more private?) The city’s gone mad, what people will do just to say they have a house!
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copswife Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 1:21 pm
I too think that the new VCI censorship policy is good. My husband was very frustrated reading these negative comments. We have to put up with the newspapers printing articles which expose police actions we shouldn’t have to share this information with our neighbours as well.
Thanks Pope for bending to the complaints of the ‘DBoy’ and “Bravery”, they knew you’d fold like you did the last time when the REBGV sent you a email. In the future don’t allow any diverse opinions or any information about police ‘misdeeds’ get out to the public on your site. The fact that our husbands accidentally kill drunks in the cells or seniors off their medication or guys like that slime ball at the airport ( you know that story) shouldn’t mean that it become public information.
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kansai_92 Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 1:35 pm
#5 PorkyFlu said
“Anyone seen the new show “income property”? It doesn’t look like it’s based in Vancouver oddly enough. It looks like Toronto.”
That’s because you can’t make income on properties in Vancouver.
Everything’s negative cash flow with the traditional 20-25% down.
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realpaul Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 1:49 pm
@kansai_92:
#24 K, you thinks its bad here, chack out this article.
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/.....d-93000.do
I don’t know wether it passes the new ‘libel’ laws as interpreted by the snivellers who’ll willingly denegrate the truth but I ‘ll post it anyway.
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YLTNBoomerang Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 1:51 pm
@NO – LYMPICS:
#18 was not me.
Eviction was due to sale with new owner moving in. We have friends (spys) in the building who are going to confirm whether the new owner moves in. We are crossing our fingers that the owner doesn’t move in and tries to rent it out for higher rent as the extra two month rent payout would be great to fund an Olympic trip down South!
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stfu Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 1:53 pm
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NO - LYMPICS Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 2:19 pm
Olympics street closures to relocate homeless in early Feb.
http://thetyee.ca/Blogs/TheHoo.....-homeless/
February 5, 2010, is eviction day for homeless people sleeping near the Georgia viaduct, Vancouver’s city manager said today.
Starting then, the busy thoroughfare connecting downtown to east Vancouver will be closed to normal traffic. It’s part of the 2010 Games transportation plan. And Penny Ballem confirmed anyone sleeping near or under the viaduct will have to leave.
================
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NO - LYMPICS Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 2:32 pm
With Olympics Came New Laws to Sweep up Homeless
Four recent host cities criminalized and removed street dwellers leading up to Games.
http://thetyee.ca/News/2009/10.....elessLaws/
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confused Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 2:37 pm
@YLTNBoomerang
can you (or anyone else) explain the ‘month rent bonus cheque’ you mentioned earlier? What is it and how does it work
thanks
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NO - LYMPICS Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 2:38 pm
From Garth’s blog:
Chartered bank mortgage rates — 14.10.09
One year closed 3.7%
Two year closed 3.85
Three year closed 4.35
Five year closed 5.49
=======
Looks like all sorts of forces are coming into play that will reek havoc.
http://www.greaterfool.ca/
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Bently Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 3:26 pm
“can you (or anyone else) explain the ‘month rent bonus cheque’ you mentioned earlier? What is it and how does it work”
From the ‘Tenant Survival Guide 2008’, found on the BC Tenancy site:
“If you are given an eviction notice for “landlord use” you are entitled to one month’s rent as compensation from your landlord. The landlord must either pay you this money or give you the last month’s rent free.”
In addition….
“If the landlord does not use the property for the reason stated on the eviction notice, you can ask for compensation. For example, your landlord might evict you because their immediate relative is moving in, but later you find out that the relative didn’t move in. If for at least six months after you moved the place was not used for the purpose stated on the notice, the landlord owes you the equivalent of double your monthly rent.”
ka-ching!
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confused Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 3:38 pm
@Bently
Thanks! I did not know that!
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YLTNBoomerang Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 3:59 pm
If the landlord uses an agency they will usually inform you of this just make sure you don’t sign anything and actually get the eviction as some sneaks will get you to sign an agreement to end tenancy then you get nothing. The other thing is, make sure you get a notice before you shop around for a new place as there is nothing worse than finding a new place and then the new landlord calls the old one for a reference… you sign with the new place and then the old landlord waits you out for you to give notice as they know you have to or rent two places!
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markx Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 4:56 pm
MOST major banks would lend 6x family pre-tax income, based on experience from families and friends. That’s first half of 2009. So yes, 6x family income with 10% down is perfectly prime, as far as I can tell, no shady brokers required.
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censorthisassholescomments Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 5:04 pm
Garth is saying some negative things again. Pope, censor this immediatley. We can’t have the truth getting out.
“Why is it that resale house prices are up 11% in the middle of a recession, when new house prices are down 3.1%? Like, huh? Don’t young couples want to rush into contracts with desperate, price-slashing builders so they can have viriginal digs to consummate?
Sure they do. So where are the bidding wars, gushing realtor hype and romping prices that we’re treated to every four weeks from the real estate boards in Toronto, Vancouver and the horsey bits inbetween?
Oh, wait. Resale home prices are compiled by realtors who together make up self-regulated real estate boards. Wait again. They used average unweighted pricing in compiling their stats, which means if one delusional dweeb in, say, Calgary, spends $10 million on a faux palace, it drives the numbers skyward. And, by gosh, it is the arithmetic average of the unweighted local averages which are used by CREA to calculate the national average – then dutifully spoon-fed to a waiting and voracious media.”
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historyguy Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 6:16 pm
Wow, talk about a strange repeat of history. Wierd Karma at play here. The Nazi’s push the reporters and protestors representatives out of the headlines ( by killing them) and civic rights and freedoms begin to disappear. The a guy called ‘The Pope’ turns his back on the disenfranchised and hides behind privelage while the fascists murder millions. The people of Germany say after the war that they weren’t aware of the atrocities taking place and hide behind ignorance of the fact.
When someone sent me a link to this site today and told me how civic rights were being snatched from the stupid and the naive I instantly thought of the parrallel. Deju vu Vancouver. Don’t cry later for what you’ve agrred to do today.
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oneangryslav2 Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 6:26 pm
@censorthisassholescomments:
In the comment to that post, someone posted a link to the Statscan data.
http://www.statcan.gc.ca/daily.....a1-eng.htm
Very, very interesting!
They use 1997 as the base (1997=100) for their New Housing Price Index. Using, 1997 as the base year, as of August 2009, new home prices had increased in Vancouver only 14%. That’s an annual percentage gain of (approximately– [log(114/100)]/12, or 1.16 % annually).
Of the major metropolitan areas in Canada only Victoria, Windsor and Sudbury grew less than Vancouver. (Note that these are metropolitan areas.) Moreover, the Canadian average was a 12-year increase in new home prices of 53.7%, versus Vancouver’s 14%.
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Best place on meth Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 6:32 pm
$580,000 average mortgate for 35 years, 5 year fixed at:
4% = $2556
5% = $2908
6% = $3278
7% = $3664
8% = $4064 (historical norm for mortgage rates)
BRING….IT…..ON…..
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oneangryslav2 Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 7:19 pm
@oneangryslav2: I made a mistake with the annual percentage increase over that 12-year period. The formula is correct, but I inputed the wrong numbers the first time I made the calculation. The correct answer for log(114/100)/12=1.09%. That is the correct annual growth rate for new home prices in Vancouver between August 1997 and August 2009.
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Anonymous Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 7:19 pm
Vancouver, the city of amateur landlords. When will the city look itself in the mirror and start subdividing, instead of making its residents take on what amounts to part time jobs?
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skiff72 Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 7:24 pm
@oneangryslav2: #38
For those wondering how that makes sense (like me about 15minutes ago) they eliminate land value in the data, so the 14% increase is in the selling price of a model (i.e. benchmark) home based on the house only.
Soooo…what does that suggest? I wonder how this relates to condos, since they have virtually no land value to begin with.
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PorkyFlu Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 7:46 pm
Actually that “income property” show focuses on fools who bought homes in toronto and can only afford them if they rent out the moldy basement suite. The host/pimp on the show extols the virtues of doing this and never ever mentions anything about paying income tax on the rent too which is something for the CRA to look at I guess.
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The Pope Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 9:05 pm
@censorthisassholescomments: Drat! That rascal Garth has foiled me with his secret weapon: He started his own blog and I am powerless to censor the truth that he speaks! I hate it when bad news gets out!
@historyguy: Oh come on now, you’re not even trying. The trick to a good trolling comment is to at least attempt to make people think you believe what you’re writing.
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RennieWhereRU? Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 9:52 pm
Off topic, does anyone know good computer store in Seattle area? Down there next week and am looking to buy desk top, name brand like HP? Thanks bears.
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Bob Arctor Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 10:09 pm
@RennieWhereRU?: HP is junk, pick a different brand.
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Anonymous Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 10:17 pm
2 bedroom, 2 bath at Canadian at Wall Centre for $1650..
Leading up to the Olympics and back to 2003 prices?
http://vancouver.en.craigslist.....31742.html
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historyguy Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 11:50 pm
I don’t about that, it’s a ‘if the shoe fits wear it’ situation no? You’ve got a bunch of anal simians trying to suppress the truth and a cadre of mindless collaborators backing them up in the bizarre hope that the betrayal of any morals and their fellow citizens will enrich them. History has shown that these Judas types usually go to wall along with the others, just more pathetically and much less heroically.
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Try Again Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 11:57 pm
Does any one else see the similarities between “history guy” and Realpaul??? Apart from the negative rantings based on their rants? lol
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Try Again Says:
October 14th, 2009 at 11:58 pm
“negative ratings” that is…
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YLTNBoomerang Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 8:49 am
Wow, landlords are getting desperate!
Last year when I looked at places it was a competition to rent, this year I am getting pestered by the landlords of every place I see with offers of “special deals” and rent reductions for signing a longer lease. We looked at one place that was very nice but very small and custom; we told them it was just not big enough as the built-ins would prevent us from using all our furniture (didn’t mention to them that it was over-priced). I got an email follow-up this morning from the landlord/owner offering not only a $200 rent reduction but actually offering to remove the built-ins so we could fit our stuff. Imagine that, they pay for custom millwork to increase the value then rip it out to make room for renters.
This seems to be a re-occuring thing as one of the subjects for the sale of our current place was the removal of the built-ins; it looks like built-ins are not a value add renovation.
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Crash Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 9:42 am
My wife and I just recently got an eviction notice as our landlord wants to demolish the house and build a duplex in place. Too bad as it’s a nice house in Metrotown with the upstairs rented to us, and two lower suites, so it’s a good revenue generator. But anyways, lots to choose from rental wise (and we have 2 cats) and we’ve had potential landlords pester us for business. We found another upper suite in the same area for $75 less per month and negotiated a new dishwasher and kitchen counters and faucets be installed. They are also not asking us for a pet deposit. I also came across a full house (in nice condition) and the rent was originally $1800 but then lowered to $1650. So there’s lots for rent and languishing and rents are definitely dropping.
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blueskies Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 10:01 am
Imagine that, they pay for custom millwork to increase the value then rip it out to make room for renters.
hmmm
desperation always smells like
sawdust early in the morning
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Hey Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 10:22 am
@RennieWhereRU?:
With all the Microsofties nearby, Costco in Kirkland has a pretty darn good selection and decent prices. There’s also Fry’s Electronics in Renton which you could check out. Hope this helps. Have fun in Seattle!
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Bently Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 10:32 am
“My wife and I just recently got an eviction notice as our landlord wants to demolish the house and build a duplex in place….. ”
You should check… In BC, your landlord can’t legally evict you until they have the necessary permits ‘in hand’.
56 X “Wow, landlords are getting desperate!”: Market Rents are Down « Vancouver Real Estate Anecdote Archive Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 10:52 am
[...] YLTNBoomerang at vancouvercondo.info Oct 15th, 2009 at 8:49 am – [...]
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Starving Artist Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 11:14 am
http://www.calculatedriskblog......s-for.html
On a seasonally adjusted basis, the Consumer Price Index for All Urban Consumers (CPI-U) rose 0.2 percent in September, the Bureau of Labor Statistics reported today. The increase was less than the 0.4 percent rise in August. The index has decreased 1.3 percent over the last 12 months on a not seasonally adjusted basis.
The increase occurred despite declines in the indexes for rent and owners’ equivalent rent, the first decreases in those indexes since 1992.
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Copswife2 Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 11:48 am
@Try Again:
Glory page of righteousness.
http://video.google.ca/videose.....BUQqwQwAA#
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renniewhereru? Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 12:15 pm
Cheers Hey. Will check it out. Someone suggested that HP was junk. Any ideas on decent make?
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renniewhereru? Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 12:18 pm
market related matter. guy at work’s son is a controller for major multi-national. said today forecasts are not jiving, and they are preparing for second meltdown mid next year. having lunch soon, so will quiz some more.
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realpaul Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 12:19 pm
Contagion still spreading in spite of the cheerleading about green shoots
http://money.cnn.com/2009/10/1.....2009101507
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crabman Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 12:27 pm
@renniewhereru?: If you want the best, get a Mac.
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wow Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 1:46 pm
http://money.cnn.com/galleries.....ers/3.html
is that for real?
a 750K house thanks to the 8K tax credit?
…Noel Delisle, 30, and her fiance, Mike Spence, 31. She is a hair stylist and he operates a crane.
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T-1000 Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 2:02 pm
@ renniewhereareu?
For a few years running, Sony & IBM (Lenovo Thinkpad) were ranked the most reliable (for the Non-Mac world). I am using an HP (2 years old) and it does suck big time (CPU issues, hard drive issues, etc).
Warning, if you’re going to run Vista, better get at least 4gigs of RAM. It consumes memory like Gandolfini at a pasta bar.
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realpaul Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 2:26 pm
@wow:
#63 Hey, at 5.5% the nut is only something like 3600 a month. The taxes in the US are usually about 1.5% per annum thereabouts so figure in another 950 or so ( slushy ‘don’t give a crap’ numbers) in taxes plus plus and you get to pay around 4600 a month. Not bad for a hairdresser and a crane operator. Add a couple of car payments at 400 a month each and a few gold visas on the burner and you’ve got the American dream unfolding as it should.
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Denialisrampant Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 2:34 pm
Has the teachers union woken up….finally, a public organization that thwarts the bilious deniers and fuckwits who have turned a blind eye to the blatant destruction of the rights and freedoms of Canadian citizens.
WOW , Bravo Teachers for waking up and realising that the thugs in power mean us no ggod.
http://www.theprovince.com/spo.....story.html
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Aleks Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 2:36 pm
Don’t get Vista, Windows 7 will be available to home users in less than 10 days and runs much faster, using less memory.
Personally, I don’t do pre-built systems. Go to some little hole-in-the-wall computer store near your house and get them to build you something. I don’t know about Seattle, but Victoria and Vancouver are lousy with them. You will get better quality parts and waaaaaaaay better service if something goes wrong.
I have taken my computer in for a number of things from the power supply to the CPU fan to just adding more RAM, and he never charged me for labour. Conversely, my ex-girlfriend bought an HP or Compaq and got charged $70 to be told they couldn’t reproduce the problem.
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wow Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 2:38 pm
#65 LMAO
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Braveone Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 2:44 pm
@Copswife2:
58, this student punk getting beaten will make you wet then
http://www.winnipegsun.com/new.....11811.html
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gorky Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 2:44 pm
talking about PC shopping in the states… another mystery i haven’t been able to solve after living in Canada for 5 years is why TF is everything so expensive in Canada when compared to the US?
It was really noticeable when shopping for a car seat for the 6 months old: Canada 95$, right across the Border the *exact* same model at the *same* store chain is 45$. What’s the deal with that?
anyone?
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space Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 3:16 pm
To post #2, this link has the data you are looking for:
http://www12.statcan.gc.ca/eng.....GID=838071
Select Vancouver from the dropdown list on top (cities NOT sorted in alphabetical order) and the measure you want. The measures are total household income, household # and income of owners, household # and income of owners with mortgage, household # and income of owners without mortgage, household # and income of renters.
Roughly 60% of households in Vancouver are considered to be owners. Didn’t really check % owners with mortgage vs % owner without mortgage.
I was a bit surprised @ the uptick in the number of households with $150K+ income.
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Supraboy Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 4:21 pm
Look at all you fools bickering. I put up my third house for sale today and there are so many chinese lined up looking at my house. Listed for 1.8 million. You morons who can’t afford a house in Vancouver, get ready for a Chinese invasion.
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PorkyFlu Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 4:26 pm
@gorky:
It’s called taxes. Every dollar the guberment sucks out of the economy drives up prices and drives down wages. If you want to see the effect in a more pronounced way move to Europe.
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Superlittleboy Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 4:27 pm
Hey Superlittleboy is back!
The friendly family basement dweller is back! Did your mommy and daddy restrict your computer privileges for the last little while? Have your parents finally willed you the family house so that you can move upstairs now and claim ownership?
You are always amusing superlittleboy!
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Wannabe Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 4:53 pm
Who actually buy’s Supraboy’s monopoly houses? Are the Chinese really that desperate to own that they buy those little plastic houses from him?
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SD92129 Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 5:03 pm
Gorky,
Clearly you are not aware that canadian car seats are more expensive in Canada because of the CMVSS sticker and the fact that Canadian car seats have expiration dates.
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oldslappy Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 5:17 pm
Global TV @ 5 announces that the IOC/Vanoc show is bringing in ‘thousands’ of private security contractors to work the crowd ‘out of uniform’ at the Olympics. Now usually these persons are called MERCENARIES ( like in IRAQ and EL SALVADOR)but for Canada we’ll call them guest workers or some lame excuse like that.
THOUSANDS OF MERCENARIES IN PLAINCLOTHES in the streets of Vancouver , armed and dangerous one has to assume!!!! Body count pool anyone????
That new friend or co worker that shows up suddenly is probably not your friend.
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Supraboy Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 5:22 pm
You people are clearly in denial. Housing sales are up. More Chinese are coming over.
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Rich Europeans Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 5:44 pm
The Scottish are coming too. I just sold my place to a rich Scotsman. My neighbour just sold his place to a rich German. Oh, and my cousin sold his place to some rich people from Luxembourg.
Now Europe, there is a continent with rich people that can outright afford Vancouver real estate. Of course, they came by their wealth legally…
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Hype-o-potomous Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 6:31 pm
I’m holding out for the wealthy moon-men, I hear they wear hats made out of solid gold and sneeze diamond dust. They’ll pay anything for a house in vancouver once they discover that everyone wants to live here!
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skiff72 Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 6:43 pm
#71 @space:
What’s also interesting with that statscan data is that among households with mortgages, median income between 2000 and 2005 has DROPPED from $79k to $76k. And that during a significant upswing in prices. Hmmmm.
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skiff72 Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 6:47 pm
For Vancouver, I should add.
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pricedoutfornow Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 8:24 pm
@skiff72:
Why is interesting? People don’t need income to buy houses! Of course not! All you need is your bank to tell you “You’re richer than you think!” Forget income….we have CREDIT!!!
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Disbelief Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 10:19 pm
I drove on w pender yesterday and was surprised to see so many Asians in the soup line.
I thought there were only rich Asians or are these rich ones hoarding there money allowing for increased wealth. Saving on a lunch and dinner here and there.
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Arwen Says:
October 15th, 2009 at 10:34 pm
@skiff72: Isn’t that the average? The median in Vancouver is lower than average; that dropped too.
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space889 Says:
October 16th, 2009 at 1:20 am
no I think the average income went up while the median dropped. Maybe it’s because the higher income households paid off their mortgage??
I did a quick look in the afternoon and it seems the % of high income households (> 80K) is extremely high, maybe even 80%+? The ownership level for those above the median household income is also quite high.
So unless a LOT of those households below the median income households are rich asians, Europeans, US, Albertans households who don’t have to work anymore….seems like the pool of potential buyers who can afford Vancouver is pretty low.
Now I’m Chinese and read the Chinese forums and websites on occassion and apparently Canada, and Vancouver in particular, are well known among the rich Chinese and is a popular destination for moving their family or kids here. Something about if you bring lots of $$$$ here, Canada wouldn’t extradite you back to China for corruption trials due to concerns about human rights, death penalty, fair trial, Falong Gong practices, whatever else an immigration lawyer can come up with. So the bulls might have hopes yet! Corruption is a thousand years plus tradition in Chinese bureaucratic system and you can’t change that in a few decades. Question is how many can slip past the Chinese authority and make it here. Lai Changxing(?) and others have taught the central government some very important lessons about letting too many “rich tourists” or “exchange students” coming to Canada.
Personally I believe housing prices in most places are ultimatedly determined by the disposable income of people who live and work there. Now I know couples who are in top 10% if not top 5% of household income in BC, and if they find that they can’t afford a proper 25% downpayment and living comfortable with a mortgage for a house in the Fairview area in Vancouver then something is definitely wrong with our housing market here! I don’t think you can call them losers who don’t deserve to be in Vancouver!
For me, I doubt I will make more than $1.6M after tax income (in 2009 $) over the next 35 years of my working life. Borrowing say $600K to buy a crappy house in an unsafe area and pay a total of $1M+ in principle and interests over the life of the mortgage just doesn’t appeal to me at all. I mean add in family, children costs, parents care, property taxes, food, clothing, where the hell am I going to get $$ for retirement? Is buying a house the epitomy of my life? Wow I owned a house in Vancouver, yah, that’s the best possible goal I can possibly strive for and achive in my life? Sheesh…
Lastly, I don’t see many people commenting on this…but in my view high housing prices are extremely bad for the economy over the long run! Why? Because capitals are sucked into a non-productive depreciating asset. House provide shelters but that’s it, doesn’t make your life better or easier after that. Also houses get old, worn out, needing repairs, and let’s face it they just aren’t build to last anymore, that’s not the definition of an appreciating asset. Anyways, high housing prices sucks huge amount of money out of the economy, money that can’t go into R&D to create new business & industries, can’t go into improving existing products and quality of life, can’t go into improving infrastructure, etc, etc, etc because everyone will be too busy paying their mortgage! So what happens? We will end up with a stagant economy with no innovation, no new sources of jobs and wealth creation, and deteroriating infrastructure cuz there probably isn’t enough $$ left to maintain them never mind upgrade. When you don’t go forward, you are slipping behind because other people are moving ahead! That’s not a good prospect for Vancouver and BC. I mean just think what a real 200KM/hr passenger train network like they have in Japan, Europe and even China(!) can do for lower mainland!? That itself could potentially solve a lot of the road/highway congestions, cut commute time, traffic fatalities, decrease air pollution, CO2 emission, cut gas prices, etc, etc….and I’m not even talking about the state of the art like the 350Km/hr line that China is building around the country in the next decade!
Ok really long rant and got some stuff off my chest….I used to love Vancouver and say I don’t want to leave for US/China/etc even with the big one we are overdue for. But now I’m thinking more and more of moving out of here….
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Steevee Says:
October 16th, 2009 at 1:50 am
Space 889,
I’m not sure exactly what you were trying to say in your second paragraph but otherwise well said, I enjoyed your rant. I too refuse to believe the the highlight of my working life should be the prospect of owning a house in Vancouver. I get closer and closer to leaving this city every day.
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Steevee Says:
October 16th, 2009 at 2:03 am
As for the article, $1500 for a rental suite?! Who the frak gets $1500 for their basement? My girlfriend and I rent a nice, 3 bedroom main floor of a house in central Burnaby for $1300. The couple in the basement below us pay $900. $1500, what a crock.
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logic Says:
October 16th, 2009 at 2:38 am
lots of westside basements (kits, point grey, etc) go for 1500.
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No Longer Looking Says:
October 16th, 2009 at 8:31 am
@logic: Yes, but they would have about double the “typical” $580K mortgage.
It says this in the story: “In Vancouver, suite rents can range from under $900 to $2,500 or more depending on the suite’s size, age and quality.”
No way, $1500 is the high end (as you indicate) not the average. The story is all lies.
OK maybe, just maybe, if the “owning” family lived in a Kits basement and rented out the main part of the house, they could get more. But that’s not really renting out “the suite”…and what a way to live while carrying a million dollar mortgage.
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No Longer Looking Says:
October 16th, 2009 at 8:41 am
BTW I just did a search for apartments in the City of Vancouver on Craigslist, and the second item on the first page was this:
http://vancouver.en.craigslist.....85666.html
Two seconds of looking and I found a basement suite for $700 (utilities included) at Victoria Drive and 49th. So much for ranging from $900 to $2500.
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space889 Says:
October 16th, 2009 at 9:01 am
In my area which is Fairview, not really posh west side like Dunbar, Point Grey, Kits. The average asking price around my current place is $1.3M to $1.5M. So even with 1/3 downpayment you would be looking at $800K+ mortgages. When I ask the realtor at opening houses, all of them said 1 bedroom rental suite would be $1100 to $1200/month while 2 bedrooms are $1500 to $1800/month. Most of the basements are newly renovated but even the lousy ones realtors are saying $1K/month for 1 bedroom. So $1500/month is not out of the question here. However for me personally, if I’m going to be spending $1200/month on rent I would rather go above ground in an apartment or condo building like say Langara Gardens on Cambie & 57th and get the swimming pool, whirlpool, gym, library, rec area, etc. Basements just not really my thing.
@88 Steevee – let me use an example.
For the $150K+ household income group, there are about 72000 households, StatsCan says about 65000 of these households are owners, so the owernship % is almost 90%? Similarly for other household income groups with income of $80K and above, the ownership % is very high indicating most of the people who has the money to borrow has already borrowed and bought a place. In my view not too many local prime borrowers left for housing.
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Al Says:
October 29th, 2009 at 11:08 am
@space889
Nice rant.
also thanks for clearing up that bit about the ownership %. I too was confused.