Friday Free-for-all!
Happy Friday the 13th everyone! The weekend is here, time for the free-for-all post. Lets round up some recent news links to kick off our regular end of the week open topic discussion thread:
-Sales across BC drop 42%
-North Shore home sales drop sharply
-Surrey builds the most
-Calgary the #1 place to buy
-BMO seeks 34 in mortgage fraud
-The ups and downs of asking rents
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So what are you seeing out there? Post your news links, thoughts and anecdotes here and have an excellent weekend!
August 12th, 2010 at 6:11 pm 1
I know this is bad etiquette, but I can't help myself, it's like eating cashews or popping those bubbly bag thingys.
So,
FIRST!!!!!
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August 12th, 2010 at 6:54 pm 2
"Calgary the #1 place to buy"
http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/Real+estate+in…
I've said this in another thread, but it bears repeating – nowhere in this article are any figures given for prices or rents in any of the cities listed. And this from the "Real Estate Investment Network". What a joke.
Love the comments though:
mainlander
1:22 AM on August 13, 2010
This comment was left by a user who has been blocked for mentioning the word 'housing bubble'.
Name withheld
6:42 PM on August 10, 2010
This comment was left by a user who has been blocked by our staff.
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August 12th, 2010 at 9:55 pm 3
Don Campbell is a bit of a superstar when it comes to the"semipro" real estate investment crowd. He has articles claiming prices will drop until 2013 or so mostly due to rising rates, so he claims. But he also states that if you buy now you will be slaughtered unless you are prepared to hold for five years plus, no flippers need apply.
REIN is a great example of why investing in real estate in BC may not pay off for many years. It has many members, some who believe in investing in little else other than RE. Notice his slant towards BC, markets with some of the worst yields on the continent. Sage advice indeed. One must ask why he concentrates on BC so heavily but a look at his clientele's locations may provide a clue.
One scheme I have heard about thru rein is the "lease buyback option" plan which works roughly as follows: foreclosed owner occupier approached by investor, told investor will assume mortgage and title and owner signs 5 year lease. After 5 years renter has the option of buying back at a fixed price determined beforehand or walking away or simply continuing to rent. The carrot: this is your only chance to avoid being kicked out. I've heard of these schemes in the US but never in Canada. Until I heard of one in Pitt Meadows.
This latest carnival trick brought to you by REIN. We're all speculators now.
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August 12th, 2010 at 10:24 pm 4
jesus, that 1-bed place in Shn is a p.o.c. 1800-1900 for that? No wonder it is still vacant.
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August 12th, 2010 at 11:04 pm 5
Maybe I haven't had enough coffee yet, but I've got a possibly silly question:
Why, when real estate speculation takes a turn for the worse, do rental listing also drastically increase?
It seems to me that a speculator with a few properties on hand would be renting them out already, so why would a bunch of people flood the rental market at the same time the same people flood the sale market?
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August 12th, 2010 at 11:46 pm 6
@snatchamoto: not a silly question at all. Answer: dwelling oversupply and speculators who kept units vacant hoping to flip are denied and need to generate $ somehow.
The supply of money is running out all round.
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August 12th, 2010 at 11:50 pm 7
Poor bull. Tears down nice house to build monstrosity for quick flip. Now monstrosity sitting on market like condo in Athletes village. Then renter bear moved out of basement because rent condo for same price. With asian hot money disappearing whats bull to do? Time to move whole family downstairs and rent top floor to 24 yr old male nurse.
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August 13th, 2010 at 12:37 am 8
From the 42% drop article, this bon mot from our favourite economist:
"As a result, we'll see firmer market conditions in many markets by the time we reach the fall," Muir said.
Oh Cameron!
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August 13th, 2010 at 12:48 am 9
“As a result, we’ll see firmer market conditions in many markets by the time we reach the fall,” Muir said.
Why doesn't this guy just shut the hell up?
He's looking more foolish by the hour.
I guess it doesn't stop these types, though. That Lereah phony in the US certainly enjoyed the limelight.
I guess that's what it's all about.
So, Cameron, jump out of a plane like that Slater fellow; only make sure it's at a high enough altitude and WITHOUT a parachute.
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August 13th, 2010 at 1:00 am 10
LOL I love the rental swinging its asking price. You would think if you were going to do that you would at least delete the old posts so people wouldnt get wise. If you reply to the $1750 ad do you think the landlord would give it to you for that or does he have his heart set on 1975 now?
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August 13th, 2010 at 1:11 am 11
According to the VREB 500 Rich foreign investors have just arrived and are ready to buy properties with cash… buy now or be priced out forever:
http://www.theprovince.com/health/Tamil+migrant+s…
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August 13th, 2010 at 1:31 am 12
@snatchamoto: "Why, when real estate speculation takes a turn for the worse, do rental listing also drastically increase?"
Because the economy goes to hell so household formation slows and possibly contracts.
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August 13th, 2010 at 2:14 am 13
Hey, you know what I just realized? The word "mortgage", directly translated from its French roots, means "death-pledge". If that doesn't give you pause, it should.
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August 13th, 2010 at 2:30 am 14
@shikko:
And "amortize" means "to kill", as in to kill the mortgage.
In Vancouver though it actually means "to kill" the mortgage holder.
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August 13th, 2010 at 2:33 am 15
Even with the drop of rent from $2000 to $1750 last week, the infamous "Penthouse" has not been snapped up…
http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/van/apa/1896134…
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August 13th, 2010 at 2:50 am 16
I think with anything involving Vancouver, be it Real Estate, Rents, Fashions, Tastes, you have to factor in the "Caboose Effect" : the trestle is washed out, and the engine and passenger cars have gone hurtling into the canyon, but Vancouverites are in the caboose still on the rails, wondering what that loud noise was.
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August 13th, 2010 at 2:55 am 17
Oh boy, if they think mortgage fraud in Calgary is an issue, wait until they open that can of worms here in V-Rock! It's going to be YEARS teasing out that ball of twine.
Calgary doesn't even have a gushing drug money pipeline and a "don't ask don't tell" policy for money laundering.
AMATEURS!!!
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August 13th, 2010 at 3:18 am 18
NY condos worth millions qualify for FHA mortgage subsidies……now this is an absolute indicator that the government wants the phony RE market to be suspended in mid air.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-08-13/manhatta…
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August 13th, 2010 at 3:23 am 19
@realpaul:
Condo owners need their pet spas, damn it.
If the government can't help them, who can?
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August 13th, 2010 at 3:30 am 20
@realpaul:
Both Obama and McCain promised to support RE prices during their election campaigns, so you can't say that the US isn't getting what it voted for.
Do note that FHA does have upper limits for purchase price, $729,750 for NYC as the article states. CMHC has no upper limit at all.
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August 13th, 2010 at 3:32 am 21
@Best place on meth:
And the word "mortgage" is loosely translated to mean "DEAD HAND"
…ooooh sign me up for that.
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August 13th, 2010 at 3:36 am 22
@ Boombust 9
If memory serves, I believe Lereah at least came out a couple years after the crash and admitted he had totally blown the call. He also lost his job over it, so I suppose there is a bit of natural justice in the world at times.
As the Emperor might say of young Muir, "We shall watch your career with great interest!"
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August 13th, 2010 at 3:40 am 23
Chaotic situation at the Tamil boat docking:
Gary Anandasangaree, a lawyer with the Canadian Tamil Congress, was on the scene as the boat arrived. He was seen jostling for position with Bob Rennie, who was attempting to hand out flyers for 2300 Kingway.
Neither man was seriously injured in the ensuing scuffle.
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August 13th, 2010 at 3:47 am 24
@Meat Robot:
Lereah didn't lose his job for getting it wrong. His job was to get it wrong.
http://davidlereahwatch.blogspot.com/
He was just a fall guy.
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August 13th, 2010 at 4:00 am 25
@patriotz: The world's tiniest violin plays a song for poor David Lereah. Still, people who listen to those with obvious conflicts of interest, without checking things for themselves, get what they deserve.
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August 13th, 2010 at 4:10 am 26
What is going on with that Laurier location?
The only thing I can figure, besides confusion, is that they're trying to make up for vacancy loss by increasing the rates and hope that September sells it with the inrush of students.
I agree with davers – they should at least delete the old listings, wow.
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August 13th, 2010 at 4:35 am 27
Uh oh bears, mortgage mean death, so better to pay cash always. Even at 70% off, you have lots of saving to do. Why so scared bears? Buying house with mortgage entail risk just like life, this isn't Playstation or FIFA hifi. Avoid all risk and you guarantee lose.
Since also so critical of missed calls by bulls, how about we list bear calls from this RE blog from past 3 years. It will be fun to see how many times bears wrong too. Leave your arrogance for Playstation after 10000 hour practice, maybe have to cut back time posting on blog.
Anyway, this is sunny time, go out and enjoy beautiful city with cranteeny, biking down Dunsmuir bike land and maybe check out culture. Soon will be Whitecaps FC big league and Beckham, Donovan and Henry buying second condos for road trips. Then when get Grey Cup 2011, Potash money will come from Sask and Van RE will shoot up to moon and beyond to Perseid Meteor Shower.
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August 13th, 2010 at 4:47 am 28
Here's a new one: rent to own! http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/pml/reo/1897088… It's obvious now, folks, that even the property managers are openly admitting we're headed for a crash.
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August 13th, 2010 at 4:49 am 29
"HOUSING prices on the North Shore are remaining steady, despite a dramatic recent drop-off in real estate sales."
That's like saying… "Overall dollars in bank account of Zimbabweans remain steady, despite a 1,000 per cent daily inflation rate."
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August 13th, 2010 at 5:03 am 30
@SuperSmartBull: When will learn life lesson? You baby bull too young to see whole picture. Vancouver market just like annual bull run in Spain, at end of run bull always slaughtered. End of run near no? Smart bull evolve into bear, ride out, as per Garth Turner theory. Greedy bull wait too long, forced to flip like Sammy Bull Gravano. Then bull have to flee to country side and hide out in camouflage bear suit while son sell ecstasy pill to pay off bank.
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August 13th, 2010 at 5:08 am 31
"Here’s a new one: rent to own…"
I saw a similar Craigslist ad for a new tonhouse complex in Pitt Meadows just yesterday.
I guess sales are, shall do we say, "slow"?
At any rate, I replied and told them to just get it over with and drop the price.
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August 13th, 2010 at 5:19 am 32
@jesse:
What conflict of interest? The NAR is of, by, and for the realtors. Nobody else was paying Lereah.
But yeah, people in the mouthpiece business should know they're likely to get the boot when their message runs thin.
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August 13th, 2010 at 5:21 am 33
@Boombust:
Yet another echo of Housing Bubble Blog, circa 2006. A sure sign of a market in trouble.
How it works: you pay an above market rent in exchange for an option to purchase at an above market price. How could anyone turn that down?
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August 13th, 2010 at 5:37 am 34
People are having a tough time remortgaging their 0 down homes.
http://www.globaltvedmonton.com/video/index.html?…
Theres a 20 second ad first.
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August 13th, 2010 at 5:39 am 35
“Here’s a new one: rent to own…”
BTW, those Cora Tower twin buildings on the Coquitlam/Burnaby boundary are in a "less than desirable" location, IMO.
I'm sure the actual units are nice enough, but hell, they've been flogging them for TWO YEARS now.
Drop the price.
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August 13th, 2010 at 5:52 am 36
http://www.calculatedriskblog.com/2010/08/double-…
Note that Rosenberg is also openly bearish on the Canadian RE market. Google "david rosenberg canada real estate".
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August 13th, 2010 at 5:53 am 37
Wow, the Cora Towers rent-to-own program is even worse than the rent-to-own programs from a bank! (AKA monthly payment with an "interest" and an "equity" component)
So now the "rent-to-owner" can be an owner a year later by having 0% downpayment today! And be on the hook for the rest of the financing next year!
How about we pay the market rent (assuming it's $1600 as they said) and save the equity (the extra $400) elsewhere, and buy it next year (for $449K if we still feel like it).
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August 13th, 2010 at 6:00 am 38
#29 SC, Theres a moment after the slug enters the bulls brain when slaughtered that it stays on its feet, swaying, bellowing, unsure and panicked….by the time he realizes that he's falling and that everything is going dark its too late.
Is this not allegory for whats happening to many failed sellers? The sales have stopped, the number of listings is rapidly increasing …but everytime the seller peeks through the curtains he's sure that nothing could possibly happen to him/her/she/it. "I'm not going to lower MY price' bellows the seller….even though he feels his knees start to buckle…..Noooooooooooooooooooo, he says as he falls to his knees.
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August 13th, 2010 at 6:05 am 39
Here's first quote for new bear quote database. Check charts again please, listings going down. This is going to be easy.
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August 13th, 2010 at 6:09 am 40
@patriotz: Rosenberg is very bearish. CalculatedRisk himself thinks odds are the US will avoid a technical recession. Do you think Rosenberg is right in his call?
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August 13th, 2010 at 6:54 am 41
@jesse:
"Still, people who listen to those with obvious conflicts of interest, without checking things for themselves, get what they deserve."
.. and it's not like Garth Turner has books to sell, or anything.
Surely if Garth's information was so valuable he'd be using it himself to make cash for himself instead of selling paperbacks at $20 a pop.
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August 13th, 2010 at 6:55 am 42
hey bears and girls. It's been more than 6 months after the olympics. Where's the crash? Economy in China is riding high. Anyone see the reports out of Germany? Record economic growth there.
It's hard for bears to sell a crash when the world economy is recovering at a record pace. Vancouver is not the only place contributing to inflation.
A lot of you fools miss out the big picture. There are more countries and people out there around the world. Pull your head out of your you know what and see what's going on. If everyone's recovering, the worst that can happen is for the real estate market to be flat here. Realistically, I see real estate going a hell of a lot higher as the Asian economies are on the move.
It's a global phenomenon, not some bullshit local story.
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August 13th, 2010 at 7:04 am 43
Hey bear speaking of dope what happen with HA hit the other day? Don't you think cops complacent in killing? They say to HA "oust" your man or else and they comply? Kind of expose police involvement in drug trade no?
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August 13th, 2010 at 7:07 am 44
@Supraboy:
Here's a bigger picture:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703…
"Concerns that growth may be slowing in the U.S. and China have also fueled fears that euro-zone exports, particularly from Germany, will suffer. Economists say growth is likely to slow in the latter half of the year as stimulus measures run their course and governments cut spending to reduce their budget deficits."
http://www.businessweek.com/ap/financialnews/D9HH…
"The market lost ground after overnight Wall Street losses and Chinese data Wednesday that showed growth in factory output and retail sales slowing.
"That aroused uneasiness about the global and Chinese economic recoveries," said Chen Jinren, an analyst for Huatai Securities in the eastern city of Nanjing."
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August 13th, 2010 at 7:08 am 45
@Supraboy:
Supraboy, you're a fool. Germany is just about the only country in EU where there never was any real estate bubble as speculation is impossible due to government regulations. Germany actually makes stuff that people want to buy, hence the numbers. As opposed to Spain or Greece where they sell condos to eachother and eventually go broke.
Sheesh,,,
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August 13th, 2010 at 7:13 am 46
@Anoymous:
I guess by the same token, my daughter's drama teacher should just go and make it big in Hollywood instead of wasting time on teaching all this Shakespeare crap if he's so smart, no?
You people make me feel ashamed to be from Vancouver, I swear.
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August 13th, 2010 at 7:20 am 47
@giggling:
"I guess by the same token, my daughter’s drama teacher should just go and make it big in Hollywood instead of wasting time on teaching all this Shakespeare crap if he’s so smart, no?"
Worst analogy ever. Well done, you.
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August 13th, 2010 at 7:21 am 48
But I guess they do say "Those who can, do. Those who can't teach".
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August 13th, 2010 at 7:22 am 49
@jesse: so where does the profit comes from in this case if the mortgage is underwater?
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August 13th, 2010 at 7:25 am 50
@jesse:
I actually find this offensive.
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August 13th, 2010 at 7:26 am 51
@Supraboy:
"hey bears and girls. It’s been more than 6 months after the olympics. Where’s the crash?"
The crash began there months ago. That's when local RE prices began falling. You didn't know? I know a good bankruptcy lawyer…
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August 13th, 2010 at 7:29 am 52
@patriotz: i wonder if the comment was left by mainlander himself since it's not in italics like the other comments.
Regardless I think you missed the most important part of the article! It stated that Winnipeg is posied to become a major destination for international immigration!! This is huge because lots of wealthy asians might be heading to Winnipeg instead of Vancouver now. I already know quite a few Asian who went to Winnipeg for university. My friend's friend runs 2 room houses for international students there. Looks like Vancouver is going to have a tough fight on its hands for the all important wealthy Asian immigrants if UBC, SFU, UVic, UNBC, etc don't step up their advertising budget in Asia and more importantly stop being such a hardass about English! Yeah, I'm talking about you UBC with your minimal LPI score! Don't you know most wealthy Chinese students have trouble getting past your LPI exams with some avoiding you altogether because of it?! Damnit UBC you are hurting Vancouver Real Estate!
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August 13th, 2010 at 7:29 am 53
@space889: it should have said my wife's friend runs 2 rooming houses.
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August 13th, 2010 at 7:46 am 54
Quote #2 for bear database. 5% off peak price is not crash bears. Always scolding bull for extrapolating past into future, please don't do same. Take some time off, have a cranteeny, stop looking at Garth, Mish, Rosenberg and other uber Grizzly bear team and spend some time on sportsnet.ca or hellobc.com. You will feel better.
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August 13th, 2010 at 7:56 am 55
@Supraboy: hey bears and girls. It’s been more than 6 months after the olympics. Where’s the crash?
RE crashes are always super S-L-O M-O
They take years. (often the same number of years as the increase).
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August 13th, 2010 at 7:57 am 56
Since we're playing fun with quotes, lets pick out another juicy bear quote from Tyee.ca quoted in this RE blog in Jan. 2009:
Housing market ‘rebound’ unlikely, say local bloggers
Nonetheless, the folks over at Housing Analysis and condohype, two widely read local real estate blogs, seem to think there’s little chance market levels will “rebound” to 2007 levels anytime soon.
“What people are apparently still not getting is that a ‘return to normal’ does not mean returning to 2007,” reads a recent post on Housing Analysis. “It was 2003-2007 that is the anomaly; not 2008-09.”
According to the blogger, the rampant speculation that’s driven up real-estate prices for the last few years is gone for the time being – and unlikely to return anytime soon. The upshot is that $1000 per square foot pricing, the reported break-even point for the Olympic Village, is a fairly improbable scenario.
“Maybe speculators will return to the market and blow a new bubble. Could happen, but I doubt it will happen in the next few years,” writes the blogger.
A recent post on condohype echoes similar opinions:
“I’m increasingly worried about the expectation of a ‘bounce back’ in the Vancouver real estate market…many people who are supposedly well informed aren’t getting the memo about the real estate decline.”
Best part bears? Was that bears on VCI were complaining they weren't quoted in article. Looks good now no?
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August 13th, 2010 at 7:58 am 57
PS, this article was after BOC rate cut, so bear ShouldaKnowed.
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August 13th, 2010 at 8:03 am 58
@realpaul: Haha… that's exactly what is happening.
@Anoymous: Firstly, Garth Turner only talks so much about real estate because that's where most everybody has all their money these days! He talks about money in general, actually. Secondly, Garth is well-off enough (without his book sales), but is concerned at what Canadians are doing to themselves. Can't someone care these days, without a profit incentive?
Hell… if you actually read Garth's blog, you'd find that he mentions his own book about 1/25th as much as your typical "real estate guru". You'd also know that his books are self-published.
@all the BULLS out there: Please just know that history only repeats itself because there are people like you out there!
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August 13th, 2010 at 8:10 am 59
@SuperSmartBull:
…spend some time on sportsnet.ca or hellobc.com.
What the fuck are you doing here then asshole, trolling? Slow business these days must be…
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August 13th, 2010 at 8:14 am 60
Attention all posters:
Please be careful around SSB.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mamacats/2647394848/
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August 13th, 2010 at 8:38 am 61
OK….I feel like such a guilty shit for not not buying more property. This seller seems to have skewered the zeitgeist of the RE buyers. Man …. I just feel awful that I'm not as pure as he.
http://www.observer.com/2010/slideshow/130828/eco…
AND…….can anyone tell me where Ozwaldo Jerkoff and his merry band of multiple property collectors in Edmonton have gone……It seems that Ozzies 'cashflow' concept has gone from hot to stone cold now that all the zero down deals have been plunged. OZZIE………DUDE………where have all the winners gone?
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August 13th, 2010 at 8:44 am 62
@Anoymous: While I think he's got some good call on RE right now, his investing mantra and advice are in my opinion just horrible for the average investor, if not downright dangerous. I don't know if he's only business is selling books or he's actually an investment advisor/manager as well. But I have a feeling that 5 years out, anyone who follows his advice on investing and stock market will probably get slaughtered. Off course he does have an out in that he says you need to trade sector ETFs and be nimble to make profits. But if trading is as easy as he says, there would be a lot more rich investors than we have now. Heck, people wouldn't get so suckered into investing in RE if stock & bond market trading is easy. Or if it is easy to hire someone who's good at it.
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August 13th, 2010 at 9:08 am 63
UBC expert approximates each Tamil Tiger 'refugee' will cost CDN taxpayers $100,000 in the first two years of their being processed……$8000 a month after that for the entire gamut of welfare and services we will haveto pay for as claims are appealed ( for perhaps ten years) . The current bunch just cost you $50,000,000.00 taxpayer dollars.
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August 13th, 2010 at 9:17 am 64
@Anoymous:
….Surely if Garth’s information was so valuable he’d be using it himself to make cash for himself instead of selling paperbacks at $20 a pop. ……
What makes you think he's not using that information to make $$'s ?
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August 13th, 2010 at 9:34 am 65
@realpaul:
This is big and openhearted country with infinite supply of taxpayer dollars so maybe we could volunteer to become a global dump for any kind of waste and garbage. The World's unique junkyard that would buy (pay) junk from everyone and from everywhere.
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August 13th, 2010 at 10:04 am 66
"What makes you think he’s not using that information to make $$’s ?"
If I knew where a source of gold was located, I wouldn't tell you.
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August 13th, 2010 at 10:06 am 67
@space889:
"But if trading is as easy as he says, there would be a lot more rich investors than we have now."
I don't think so. It's like saying that everybody is able to be richer than average.
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August 13th, 2010 at 10:20 am 68
#65 K, right…theres no fucking way we should be putting money into kids, schools, seniors or poverty in this country when there are so many other better qualified candidates to piss our money away on around the world.
I mean geez…the Tamil Tigers are a ruthless bunch of killers that didn't hesitate to kill their own women and children as human shields whenever they ran from head on confrontation or planted bombs on trains and busses…why not have a group like that in downtown Toronto.
The current ship is only one of a flotilla headed for Canada according to international sources…isn't it a good idea to set loose several thousand crazy armed and battle trained terrorists in Canada rather than having their own government deal with them? We saw that the RCMP and TO police couldn't deal with a few dozen blue haired university trained anachists at the G20…what will happen when these professionally trained Tamil motherfuckers get ready to take out Etobicoke????
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August 13th, 2010 at 10:26 am 69
realpaul, if you'd stop ranting for just a moment and acquaint yourself with the facts I think you'd find that nobody is talking about just releasing these people into Canada and letting them do as they wish.
The government is already on the record as saying that all criminals aboard with be prosecuted, and that they're hoping this will act as a deterrent to others from attempting the same thing.
If you have concrete evidence that all on board are Tamil Tigers then please let the RCMP know – I'm sure they'd appreciate your help.
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August 13th, 2010 at 10:34 am 70
@Anoymous:
You make it sound like investing is just like finding a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. There's no silver bullet, if someone has a sure way to make money, it's a scam, I don't even need to know the details.
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August 13th, 2010 at 10:39 am 71
The worthless cheerleaders get their first 100% sell/list day since….I don't know, Easter? Valentines Day?
Sellers must have been to busy doing yardwork to list today.
Dailies – List | Sold
Vancouver East & West*
New Listings – 47
Back On Market Listings – 0
Price Changes – 28
Sold Listings – 42
Vancouver All Areas*
New Listings – 119
Back On Market Listings – 2
Price Changes – 71
Sold Listings – 127
*Attached & Detached – Date: 08/13/2010 Time:19:54 PST YatterMatters.com
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August 13th, 2010 at 10:40 am 72
Good day for the Bulls.
Oh well, it is what it is. (From Larry Yatter's site)
Vancouver All Areas*
New Listings – 119
Back On Market Listings – 2
Price Changes – 71
Sold Listings – 127
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August 13th, 2010 at 10:41 am 73
@Best place on meth:
haha Meth, you beat me posting the numbers probably by a few seconds.
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August 13th, 2010 at 11:35 am 74
@ Anoymous "If you have concrete evidence that all on board are Tamil Tigers then please let the RCMP know – I’m sure they’d appreciate your help.
I watched the high consul for Sri Lanka say this boat shouldn't be allowed to dock because it's full of criminals. What 'evidence' do you suggest the RCMP will have on the status of its passenger foreign nationals that's better?
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August 13th, 2010 at 12:07 pm 75
@fixie guy:
"I watched the high consul for Sri Lanka say this boat shouldn’t be allowed to dock because it’s full of criminals. "
If Sri Lanka knew the boat was "full of criminals", why did they let it leave port in the first place?
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August 13th, 2010 at 12:12 pm 76
I don't understand the point you're trying to make. On the basis of your knowledge of Sri Lankan shipping, what should have happened? Is the consul lying?
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August 13th, 2010 at 12:15 pm 77
Economy data point: Brian Jessel BMW called me today, asking me if I want to schedule some maintenance. The strange thing is that I bought the car from them 10 years ago. The last time I had service with them (or talked to them at all) was 7 years ago.
Why are they calling me all of a sudden? Is work drying up? BMW owners aren't servicing their cars?
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August 13th, 2010 at 1:37 pm 78
@SuperSmartBull: I resent those remarks. Neither condohype nor housing analysis were "widely read."
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August 13th, 2010 at 1:42 pm 79
@SuperSmartBull: I love your new aggressive stance, but what happened to the fake accent? You get tired of that shtick? Did SuperSmartBear get under your skin? Getting freaked out about the 'can't lose' Vancouver housing market? Just buy more condos, there's lots for sale and it's an easy road to riches right?
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August 13th, 2010 at 2:00 pm 80
Hey guys. Re the Tamils. How about we ask some real Canadians what they think about it? You know the ones who have been here for 4000 years or more, not the ones that have been in Canada for three generations and in BC for one or two.
Nah, better not. They may ask us all to leave.
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August 13th, 2010 at 2:01 pm 81
@WORLDS GREATEST LOVER: I've grown suspicious. This baby bull has my spidey senses tingling. A true bull never lose accent.
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August 13th, 2010 at 4:28 pm 82
@space889: It is my understanding that Garth T is totally against "trading" as us you claim. He said that anyone trading in and out of individual stocks using their online account is destined to lose money. His strategies appear to be conservative from my perspective. He's against people stashing cash in bank accounts and watching it be eaten away by inflation.
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August 13th, 2010 at 5:47 pm 83
@fixie guy:
I suppose you've never studied a civil war closely. To answer your question, yes, it is very likely that the Sri Lankan consul (in other words, an official of the state that was one of the two warring sides) may not have been completely truthful about his claims regarding the members of the ethnic group that was the opposing side in this conflict.
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August 13th, 2010 at 6:40 pm 84
Unit Sales
2007 = 3493
2008 = 1611
2009 = 3496
2010 = 995** Aug 13
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August 13th, 2010 at 6:55 pm 85
The HST is really working…. looks like new unit sales of condos in
Van West this month will be at a 17 year low.
August Van. West – New Condo sales
1994 = 32
1995 = 40
1996 = 120
1997 = 198
1998 = 59
1999 =123
2000 = 49
2001 = 77
2002 = 49
2003 = 71
2004 = 73
2005 = 105
2006 = 87
2007 = 74
2008 = 24
2009 = 60
2010 = 6 ***Aug 13
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August 13th, 2010 at 7:11 pm 86
@frank:
So Frank, is your point that we should return to a system that existed 100's of years ago where we just get on a ship and migrate? To hell with modern laws and accepted convention? Who cares who has applied legally and is patiently waiting to immigrate to Canada?
100's of years ago a Sri Lankan (or anyone else) couldn't simply download a Canadian immigration information package off the internet. See the difference?
But hey, nice analogy. Next up? "We are all immigrants" right?
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August 13th, 2010 at 11:22 pm 87
@chilled,
Here is what the rules say: (taken from Immigration Canada)
"Canada offers refugee protection to people in Canada who fear persecution or whose removal from Canada would subject them to a danger of torture, a risk to their life or a risk of cruel and unusual treatment or punishment.
If you feel that you will be persecuted or otherwise at risk as mentioned above if you return to your home country, you may be able to seek protection in Canada as a refugee."
As far I can tell, they are following the rules. It is Canada's job to sort out who is a criminal and who is legitimate. If you don't like these rules, put pressure on your MP. Or move to a place that has more restrictive immigration policies.
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August 14th, 2010 at 1:05 am 88
@Anonymous:
Of course the Sri Lankan government is biased.
But think about it. We are not talking about people in fishing boats fleeing South Vietnam, or people on rafts freeing Cuba. It costs a lot of money to obtain a seagoing ship and sail it to the other side of the world. Only the Tamil Tiger organization is capable of doing that. And everyone on that boat is there on the say so of their leadership. Anyone thinking otherwise is just kidding himself.
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August 14th, 2010 at 1:22 am 89
Chilled. My point is simply this – there is always going to be someone who doesn't think WE should be here. The people who were first and were treated so badly would probably like to have us all leave.
This wasn't meant as a public policy post, just to try and induce a little humility in us all. Most of the Europeans who came here were either refugees from Eastern Europe, or penniless and hoping for a better life from Western Europe.
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August 14th, 2010 at 1:38 am 90
One thing is for sure, the so called 'first nations' living here today displaced many others who had come before them. The ice corridor opened more than 25 thousand years before the last ice age resulting in a flood of migrants who moved south to populate south america, mexico and this continent. The current 'first nations' came after the last ice age 10 -12 thousand years ago and up rooted the remaining cultures that were already here. Clovis Point sites indicate occupation long before the current batch had begun to migrate. So…in all due respect….. 'first nations'…..not even close.
The Tamils have a homeland in India….to be fair….they are economic migrants here only for the reasons of fat paycheques and freebies from a soft legacy of federal Liberalism that we are still trying to divest ourselves of. The Tamils are criminals in every sense of the word. US policy is to turn them away, Aussie ditto and did….Europeans have put up the fences…..why are the bleeding heart Torontonians thinking that giving away billions in free lunches to terrorists is in Canadas best intrests. The Tamils waged a bloody war against the Sri Lankan nation…it was a war of separation and a power grab. It was no differant from the Sikh terror in the Punjab or pakistans support of terror in Kashmir…illegal wars should not be supported with Canadian tax dollars. The Liberals were openly supporting the Tigers when they were in office…..the Cons put a stop to the fund raising and the blood shed in Sri Lanka stopped within months…..coincidence?????? Not.
Now the Liberals want to continue to wreck Canada with their 'divide and conquer' immigration dumping tactics…..enough say the people. We have had enough of the Liberal bullshit.
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August 14th, 2010 at 1:43 am 91
@realpaul:
Would be cheaper to send them all back with $10,000 each in their pocket.
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August 14th, 2010 at 2:09 am 92
@Bilbo Bloggins:
"Would be cheaper to send them all back with $10,000 each in their pocket."
In the short term it would be cheaper, but if we did that then a million of them would show up next year.
Then we have a much more expensive problem.
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August 14th, 2010 at 2:14 am 93
@realpaul: Very well said !!!!
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August 14th, 2010 at 2:26 am 94
Bullish news from Hong Kong earlier this month.
"Hong Kong home prices will rise another 15 percent in the next 12 months as limited supply forces buyers to pay more for property that’s already expensive"
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-08-02/-painful…
Does anyone think this will have any effect on Vancouver real estate?
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August 14th, 2010 at 2:29 am 95
A Preview of things to come.
Same human race, same greater fools, just a bit south of us.
"Banks, mortgage brokers and real-estate agents were only too happy to encourage these fantasies, of course. In many cases, their encouragement crossed the line into malfeasance. But the bubble grew as large as it did because this malfeasance fed on human frailty, naïveté and even irresponsibility"
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/15/magazine/15fob-…
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August 14th, 2010 at 2:31 am 96
@Daddy Fat Stax:
That's not news (i.e. facts), that's a prediction.
And the answer to your question is no.
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August 14th, 2010 at 3:30 am 97
The current story amongst the Chinese parents is that plane loads of hundreds of people from China are coming next month to buy up Vancouver houses…
Does anyone have any specific proof to substantiate this story?
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August 14th, 2010 at 3:31 am 98
The Liberal spun the story that the Tamil migrants were at deaths door after being at sea for threee months…that we should all be sympathetic to these desperates and their waifs. It has been pointed out the the children were only added to the mix after the Aussies had turned the ship away from that country…the Tamils cynically brought the kids aboard to elicit sympathy…there is no persecution of children in Sri Lanka.
The entire ships compliment..that was supposed to be so sick and disease ridden that a special wing of Victoria general was isolated for the immediate care of same has been money flushed down the toilet…. as it has come to be a fact that every single person on the ship is perfectley healthy…no bullet woulds or eveidence of starvation.
I have sailed around the world on a much smaller vessel…I saw big waves too…but is it as the media proclaimed 'death defying and life threatening to be at sea on a frighter….what bullshit…again to strum the heartstrings of the weak kneeed populace. The Tamil Congress in Toronto flew out a contingent of the Tiger supporters to do PR with the press…evidently they were successful in having the script read by the local media that the Tamils were under some extreme hardship at sea and in their native land….. a democracy by the way.
http://www.vancouversun.com/health/Tamils+much+he…
Canadian media …..shame on you.
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August 14th, 2010 at 3:40 am 99
From Calculated Risk today, I read these comments (by CR) regarding the (U.S.) existing home sales report coming out in a few weeks time:
- The existing home sales report will show that sales collapsed in July ….
- The existing home months-of-supply will jump to double digits.
- House prices are probably falling again ….
The interesting thing for me is that this is on top of the already-bad scenario in the U.S. This is expected to be a bad report added to what is already a bad situation.
We're in the early stages of our own collapse, and we will go through stages of optimism and pessimism as it unfolds over the next few years, but I suspect that we will indeed eventually see this kind of ongoing, no-end-in-sight doom and gloom news happening in Western Canada.
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August 14th, 2010 at 3:41 am 100
Ooops, "anonymous" at 11:40 am was me.
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August 14th, 2010 at 4:21 am 101
brian jessel took over a GM dealership on boundary, called it 'autohaus' or something and is servicing cars. they are probably drumming up business off people who don't want to pay $135/hr dealer service rates.
i bike by brian jessel and the audi dealership on boundary rd every day and don't worry business is good – very good.
all those 26yr olds leasing 3 series while living with mom and dad
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August 14th, 2010 at 4:29 am 102
@frank:
………….. just to try and induce a little humility in us all. Most of the Europeans who came here were either refugees from Eastern Europe, or penniless and hoping for a better life from Western Europe.
++++++++
Fine, understood. My point is times have changed and there is absolutely no justification in our government allowing people to jump the que. Sri Lanka does not produce refugees, period.
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August 14th, 2010 at 4:33 am 103
@gonzonista: ……………Canada’s job to sort out who is a criminal and who is legitimate. If you don’t like these rules, put pressure on your MP. Or move to a place that has more restrictive immigration policies.
+++++++++++
What makes you think I haven't discussed this with my MP? You are one of the politically correct muddled thinkers who probably criticizes EVERYTHING the federal and provincial governments do, EXCEPT the immigration policy, right? Too hot a topic for the simple minded and it's just too easy to go with convention.
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August 14th, 2010 at 4:39 am 104
This is beautiful – Journalism Warning Labels – perfect for real estate media watchers.
My favorite: "Warning: This article is basically a press release, copied and pasted."
Well, they're all good!
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August 14th, 2010 at 5:36 am 105
@Anonymous: The current story amongst the Chinese parents is that plane loads of hundreds of people from China are coming next month to buy up Vancouver houses…
HAHAHA. Yep, if by 'hundreds' you mean 40, and by 'Vancouver' you mean Canada. These are people that buy $35 dollar meals.. FORTY OF THEM! Our real estate market is SAVED!
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August 14th, 2010 at 5:39 am 106
@realpaul: So it's likely around 85% of the migrants will be granted refugee status. How many do you think will have their claims accepted?
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August 14th, 2010 at 5:54 am 107
Realpaul – your tone of moral superiority makes me quite sick. Maybe you should learn a little history first and then open the bilge pump OKA your mouth.
Firstly I am a Proud Canadian and accept my country's history warts and all. I don't feel responsible for the sins and mistakes of the past, but it gives me humility not to judge others so quickly.
Here are a few snippets for you Realpaul, since you seem so ignorant.
1) The early settlers did not out-number the first Nations so they signed treaties which gave land and property rights to them in return for limited settlements and the right to trade.
2) Those rights were reneged upon. How would a Point Grey home-owner like the previous owner to come and just throw them out of their house regardless of who's name was on the Deed.
3) Then in the 1950's it was decided to 'integrate' the Natives and make them more 'civilized'. This involved breaking up families forcibly and sending children to Residential schools were they cared for by male Priests who systematically abused most and raped many defenceless children.
4) We deny the right to vote to many non-whites eg Indian, Chinese and Japanese until 1947 even though they helped build this Province/Country and many fought and died in the Canadian army during WW2.
5) During the Second WW 22,000 Japanese were sent to internment camps until well after the war ended and their property was confiscated- even though most were born in Canada and many had sons serving in the Canadian armed forces.
So Realpaul take your petty pride and shove it where the sun doesn't shine. Or better still read some history.
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August 14th, 2010 at 5:57 am 108
@Supraboy: "World is recovering at record pace"… Where? Maybe you should pull your head out your "you know what"… Our biggest trading partner is getting ready to enter a double-dip recession… Or are you too busy listening to CKNW?
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August 14th, 2010 at 6:30 am 109
@chilled #102,
Sri Lanka has just finished fighting a civil war and the Tamils lost. If that doesn't produce refugees, what does?
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August 14th, 2010 at 6:44 am 110
@chilled #103,
Now, now. Let's not get into any name calling. I'm not calling you an ignorant isolationist just because you don't agree with the present policy. The government here has lots of things I don't like, and lots that I do. It is not perfect, but no system is. You do your best to change the things that you feel need fixing and if you don't, you can always go somewhere else. In my experience, for all the flaws, Canada is about as good as it gets.
The very fact that we can discuss our differing viewpoints without fear of reprisal is what makes this country worth living in. So, once again, if you've talked with your MP and nothing is getting done, maybe you aren't communicating well with your MP. Or, maybe there are other justifications that outweigh your concerns. If you don't like it, there are other countries that you could go to that might fit you better.
Now, can we get back to waiting for the real estate market to crash? T
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August 14th, 2010 at 7:04 am 111
@gonzonista:
"Sri Lanka has just finished fighting a civil war and the Tamils lost. If that doesn’t produce refugees, what does?"
So every rebel group that fights and loses gets to come to Canada?
Great. There are several dozen such groups in China and India alone. Let's welcome them with open arms and chequebooks.
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August 14th, 2010 at 7:13 am 112
@realpaul:
"The entire ships compliment..that was supposed to be so sick and disease ridden that a special wing of Victoria general was isolated for the immediate care of same has been money flushed down the toilet…. as it has come to be a fact that every single person on the ship is perfectley healthy…no bullet woulds or eveidence of starvation."
Then why were they taking refugees by ambulance to hospital? Do you EVER even take a cursory glance at the facts before opening your mouth, or does it work on its own without needing to be connected to a brain?
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August 14th, 2010 at 7:15 am 113
@Best place on meth:
"So every rebel group that fights and loses gets to come to Canada?"
Strawman alert.
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August 14th, 2010 at 7:15 am 114
#107 F, so your sense of PC arrogance can't allow you to admit that 'first nations ' are not first nations at all? The natives came as migrants across from Asia who warred against others who were displaced by brute force and canibalism…..looking at West Coast history…thats what it says…….its not sympathetic to the bullshit that comes from the PC camp, for sure. Unlike the 'pure souls and guardians of the forest' stories ( and thats what they are) our natives were not the first and they were anything but gentle souls wandering around with Bambi and Dumbo. There was a long history of natives , murdering, enslaving and consuming one another, stripping a micro system and moving on after an enviornment had been stripped. No one disputes this anymore….so what are you on??????? Stop drinking the kool aid…its not looking good for you.
The fact that these groups were displaced by the tide of history resembles every human migration on whichever continent you choose to examine. Europeans came to N Am the same as Africans migrated to Europe and Chinese to N America. Welcome to planet Earth.
The native populations were treated humanely according to the moral sensibilities of the time. There were no Indian wars in Canada.
Japanese immigrants had the opportunity to repatriate to Japan…only those who chose to stay were incarcerated. No one had a gun to their heads when they boarded the resettlement transports…..sorry but as much as the PC cunts would say otherwise…those are the facts.
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August 14th, 2010 at 7:18 am 115
#112 A,, yeah the whole 'taking them to hospital by ambulance' thing turned out to be a huge over reaction according to the hospital and the people on the ground….didn't you read the article or did your knee jerk up into your face so fast that you spilled the kool aid in your lap????
The Sun article says that 100% of the passengers were in fine health.
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August 14th, 2010 at 7:20 am 116
@realpaul:
It is the law of the land that we except them. Obviously, they are not wanted by most people and our government, but we follow the law here. As a society we believe in law and order, and we have to abide by it whether we like it or not. The media has to spin something, otherwise lunatics like you might lose their minds. If it keeps a couple of crazed haters like you at bay, it's worth it. The more situations like this, the sooner our laws will change. Ranting on a real estate forum doesn't do anything.
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August 14th, 2010 at 7:28 am 117
If anyone thinks discussing refugees is a waste of this REAL ESTATE blog's readers' time, mod up this comment and mod down the rest.
realpaul et al, now I'm pleading with you. Shut up on the refugee thing. Please.
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August 14th, 2010 at 7:35 am 118
@realpaul:
You have the strongest convictions and feel that you can do no wrong, but ironically, this is why you fail. You are obviously divorced, balding, and the kids hate you. I hope that you can find some happiness and love in your life.
Yours Truly,
PC Cunt
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August 14th, 2010 at 7:42 am 119
Yes – enough on the refugee talk.
We need to focus this thread back on law-abiding professionals, that serve our country, by work in real estate.
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August 14th, 2010 at 7:45 am 120
" I hope that you can find some happiness and love in your life."
See, i'm not feeling that at all. Based on your other mean words, I feel like you may have already detracted from his happiness. If you want to try rewriting your post, you know, no harm, no foul.
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August 14th, 2010 at 8:00 am 121
metro Vancouver market uP UP UP
http://tinyurl.com/3x92kk4
buye now
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August 14th, 2010 at 8:30 am 122
@bridgeman:
I was actually going to write some pretty harsh stuff, but scaled it back. I really do hope he can find some happiness and love. He has to be able to accept different opinions. His wife and kids must have been miserable.
He is a smart guy, but being smart doesn't bring you love and happiness. These things come with compassion, understanding and forgiveness. I said some mean things, but sometimes the truth hurts.
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August 14th, 2010 at 8:38 am 123
don't know if canadian business is a lib or con mag, but its current issue's cover is "canada's housing bubble".
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August 14th, 2010 at 8:45 am 124
Yup, outing the whiners and pissing on the established mores of the kool aid drinkers is always fun……..why??????? for the same reasons we out assholes like Rennie, Jurock, Good, Muir. What is promoted as 'fact' by the PC cunts is pretty much always bullshit….spun to sway opinion towards some benefit for themselves. I hear my opinions touted as alternatives….obviously many people are uncomfortable with the bullshit and enjoy having a clean look at 'established facts' from the kool aid drinking douchebags.
How does 'outing the cunts' affect the RE market…obviously the media is a farce…the facts are skewed towards supporting the parties that pay for these nutjobs to advertise things like 'real estate goes up forever'. The more people that realise that the media is manipulated ( and sadly many are only finding out when they read blogs like this) the fewer opps the bullshitters have at accessing the publics support.
Why am I so down on bullshit??????? because I don't the idea of paying for some socialist asshole who thinks he can create a great job for himself by pimping bullshit to the public. I say, lift the blanket…let the stench out….clear the air….out the bullshitters and special intrests….this will cause our taxes to ease.
I mean does anyone really think that we should pay for public daycare because others have found their mortgage debt to be unsustainable? If taxpayers subsidize these things it means that these PC cunts have hundreds of dollars a month more in mortgage payments to free up and that can only exacerbate the already bubbleicious market ( bet you PC no minds don't consider these things do you?) it would effectively underpin a market which should fail but has been consistentley held up by phony government interventionism.
Does anyone think that teachers should be making four times what their counterparts in the US do?
And…….if the PC cunts don't like it…..fuck 'em. I'm tired of the 'official party line'mentality of the PC cunts and other lice that fall in line every time the noose is jerked………..some of us can think for ourselves thank you.
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August 14th, 2010 at 8:56 am 125
BTW , I'm not alone it seems.
http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2010/08/14/ke…
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August 14th, 2010 at 9:38 am 126
@realpaul: "obviously the media is a farce"
… then the very next post you cite an MSM article that "agrees" with you. Dude, do you even think about what you write?
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August 14th, 2010 at 10:28 am 127
The Importance of Buying at Vaguely the Right Time
http://wp.me/pcq1o-1cH
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August 14th, 2010 at 10:30 am 128
@gonzonista:
gonzonista Says:
@chilled #103,
Now, now. Let’s not get into any name calling. I’m not calling you an ignorant isolationist just because you don’t agree with the present policy. The government here has lots of things I don’t like, and lots that I do. It is not perfect, but no system is. You do your best to change the things that you feel need fixing and if you don’t, you can always go somewhere else. In my experience, for all the flaws, Canada is about as good as it gets.
The very fact that we can discuss our differing viewpoints without fear of reprisal is what makes this country worth living in. So, once again, if you’ve talked with your MP and nothing is getting done, maybe you aren’t communicating well with your MP. Or, maybe there are other justifications that outweigh your concerns. If you don’t like it, there are other countries that you could go to that might fit you better.
Now, can we get back to waiting for the real estate market to crash? T
+++++++++++++"
I never called you names, no need to, it is quite obvious you are a dimwit. How can anyone debate an issue with a simpleton who suggests; "The very fact that we can discuss our differing viewpoints without fear of reprisal is what makes this country worth living in." Then states; "If you don’t like it, there are other countries that you could go to that might fit you better."
Talk about being an ignorant isolationist!! LOL!! You just about have all the bases covered. Except one. Its called critical thinking.
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August 14th, 2010 at 11:37 am 129
@patriotz and jesse
Good point about Lereah. I hadn't considered the possibility seriously enough that he was simply the mouthpiece. Makes sense in retrospect. I guess I must be a Nuremburgian at heart, because I've never been one to buy, "I was just following orders."
As for Muir, clearly the guy's not an idiot. I wonder if he's given his CV a shave and a haircut. He'd better. As Mr. Lahey might say, if he were head of the BCRA, "Randy, get the shitgun, because the shitstorm is coming, and we're going hunting for some shitrats."
@ A#, do you really find this to be a slow crash? Slow compared to stock markets, sure, but it seems like house prices are just 'a tumblin' to me. 2%+ per month is kinda bonkers. I wonder if we'll see the Feds follow the US lead and try to prop up demand with buyers' incentives, etc. I hope not.
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August 14th, 2010 at 11:39 am 130
Oh oh..seems like 'the real one' has been right all along…..GOC and CTV confirm two additional human smuggling ships enroute to Canada.
Yes I know, the liars , deniers and all the fucked up Liberal shit for brains apologists hate when I reduce the news to the truth without any of the PC dick sucking that goes along with being a PC dipshit.
Cry me a river…….starting ……….now !!!!!!!
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August 14th, 2010 at 11:43 am 131
Jesse , look up what a 'farce' is. Because a statement is farcical it doesn't mean it isn't….. too deep????? Go to the big box on your desk and GOOGLE ….ENGLISH WORDS AND THEIR MEANING. It should help. Otherwise WAAAAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA.
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August 14th, 2010 at 11:54 am 132
Famous quotes
http://www.cjseymour.plus.com/finan/prognost.htm
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August 14th, 2010 at 12:06 pm 133
#112 A, because I know you don't want to go through life as a deluded dickhead.
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2010/08/14/tamils-…
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August 14th, 2010 at 12:39 pm 134
Headline of article linked by asshat -> "Tamil migrants in good shape: RCMP"
RealHypocrite: "RCMP is a bunch of lazy tax-wasting murdering coverup ___expletive ad nauseum" (paraphrase)
Hypocrisy knows no bounds
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August 14th, 2010 at 1:02 pm 135
This forum is really going down hill. Sorry I can't be more constructive.
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August 14th, 2010 at 1:05 pm 136
jesse Says:
August 14th, 2010 at 3:28 pm
If anyone thinks discussing refugees is a waste of this REAL ESTATE blog’s readers’ time, mod up this comment and mod down the rest.
=========================================
Sorry Jesse, you got this all wrong. The Tamil people came here to buy real estate. They have already been provided with lawyers, real estate agents and mortgage application forms as required by Canada's constitution.
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August 14th, 2010 at 1:49 pm 137
"If anyone thinks discussing refugees is a waste of this REAL ESTATE blog’s readers’ time, mod up this comment and mod down the rest."
Seriously, folks. I saw this happen on two Calgary real estate blogs, neither of which still exist. Much of the dialog that's happening here is off-topic, and in other cases the trolls are feasting. This is not good, and it seems to be happening with increasing frequency. I'm worried that the outcome is predictable.
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August 14th, 2010 at 2:54 pm 138
Yep, Pope is cranking out the daily posts but making no effort to fix the comment issue. I agree its days are numbered without changes.
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August 14th, 2010 at 2:59 pm 139
realpaul, it's time you either take your medication or go away. Your language is pretty disgusting to boot.
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August 14th, 2010 at 3:32 pm 140
@Superfly:
OK, lets ensure the blog is preserved. Lets repeat the same mantra, incessantly, over and over again, stare at the same statistics, refute the same trolls. Again and fucking again.
Certainly the refugee thing is off topic, but for christs sakes, it hardly distracts from what is nothing more than a broken record.
Blame what you may on the death of this or similar blogs, but if anything it will be redundancy.
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August 14th, 2010 at 3:57 pm 141
@jesse: RealPaul has something to say, at least he's not a Patriotz ripoff.
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August 14th, 2010 at 4:11 pm 142
I've noticed oddly enough that the quality of posts here correlate with market direction. When the market's shooting up the comments are generally informative – nobody else can be bothered to post? When things go sideways the blathering starts.
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August 14th, 2010 at 4:26 pm 143
@rp1: Smart bear offended by this. My posts have been both informative and unique.
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August 14th, 2010 at 11:34 pm 144
@Meat Robot: @ A#, do you really find this to be a slow crash? Slow compared to stock markets, sure, but it seems like house prices are just ‘a tumblin’ to me. 2%+ per month is kinda bonkers. I wonder if we’ll see the Feds follow the US lead and try to prop up demand with buyers’ incentives, etc. I hope not."
That's exactly what I am saying. For a RE correction, 2% IS VERY FAST. 1% is probably closer to normal, and 4% (like in 2008) was completely insane. As you mentioned, this aint no stock market.
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August 15th, 2010 at 12:01 am 145
@chilled: broken record implies the only people reading here have been doing so for a long time. I don't think that's the case. You'd be surprised the motivations of many long term commenters here.
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August 15th, 2010 at 12:20 am 146
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/2…
The story talks about empty social housing units but it also said "Many of the 475 market rental units now have residents…"
Are they bullshitting? The anecdotal posts that I read here suggest the place is a ghost-town.
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August 15th, 2010 at 12:33 am 147
I took a stroll by the OV and it is as dead as Gregor's popularity.
Does anyone know why London Drugs and Urban Fare have not opened yet? Were they sus. to be open by now or are they holding off because its a ghost town?
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August 15th, 2010 at 12:35 am 148
RE: Automoderating – Maybe Pope has to bring back the feature that kills the post when it gets a certain number of down votes?
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August 15th, 2010 at 12:56 am 149
@ specialfx3000
Three counts as many. People really should take a stroll through the development to see what civic-planned real estate looks like. The Soviets did much better. I'm not sure I'ld stay in one of the inner suites if it was free. Dark, concrete, and depressing well past anything red knobs and granite counter tops can balance.
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August 15th, 2010 at 1:13 am 150
@fixie guy:
False Creek West (south shore of False Creek between Cambie and Granville) was civic planned too. Bet you didn't know that. I mean, it's far too nice.
So was Champlain Heights.
Don't use the outcome of one megaevent, one city council, and one development to attack the whole concept. It's obvious what was wrong with the OV, starting with the "O" part.
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August 15th, 2010 at 1:16 am 151
Back to real estate,
Our favorite lesbian couple, Jan and Steve still have not sold their house that was featured in the Sun June 03.
The "character" home at 431 E. 37th Ave. and listed for $899K was dropped to $859K a short time later but no luck. It's now an over 90.
I'm sure you all remember these folks and their story. There's even a funny quote from them where they confidently say "we'll get it sold, they're not making any more land".
http://www.vancouversun.com/business/Forecast+coo…
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August 15th, 2010 at 1:33 am 152
Mw wife walked through the Olympic Village during the Walk for Woman's Cancers yesterday. She said it was almost eerie at how dead it was. She said aside from the display suites she saw no signs of life there at all.
I wonder if it will turn out to be Vancouver's version of Montreal's Olympic stadium?
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August 15th, 2010 at 1:34 am 153
Fed rates a dangerous gamble – MSNBC
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/38695101/ns/business-…
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August 15th, 2010 at 1:35 am 154
@Best place on meth:
I wonder what people are thinking when after 90 days it's not sold and you refuse to lower your price!?!?? They waiting for the one magic rich asian to come along? Just lower the damn price if you want it sold.
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August 15th, 2010 at 1:43 am 155
@DaMann:
Not really. That turkey cost a billion 1976 dollars, plus hundreds of millions more to finish the roof later. That's truly world class, right up there with Ceasescu's palace in Bucharest or that nutty hotel in Pyongyang.
And it's practically worthless, as there's little demand to use it. People will live in the OV, it's just a matter of how much they're willing to pay.
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August 15th, 2010 at 1:48 am 156
specialfx says: The story talks about empty social housing units but it also said “Many of the 475 market rental units now have residents…”
i anticipate the city didn't want any social housing residents in until more units had sold, basically spring the riff raff on the buyers after it's too late. i doubt anything is selling there, the city will give up on its original plan soon. i predict that virtually the entire complex will become market rentals.
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August 15th, 2010 at 2:03 am 157
@DaMann:
I agree, we went to that area for gelato a few days ago. I can't believe how quiet it is. Where are all the people? We did see a couple who looked like they were out with a realtor, and the realtor was trying to talk them into buying one of those condos-he used the gelato place as a selling point "Look! You can have gelato up until 11pm every night!" Um…ya…I'm sure this 50 year old couple was really interested in eating gelato every evening, it makes perfect sense to spend $500k on a studio suite for that privilege (they didn't look too impressed).
Anyone know why the OV is so dead? Lack of retail? Yes, when are the retail spaces opening?
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August 15th, 2010 at 2:04 am 158
Can someone explain this leasehold thing to me:
http://tiny.cc/izhof
If the (overinflated) prices in Vancouver reflect mainly land value, how come this guy wants half a million for a pile of plywood and logs, on a piece of land he does not own? Leashold is not an ownership, right?
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August 15th, 2010 at 2:10 am 159
@stagnate:
That wouldn't make sense even if the city could only sell them for 1/2 of what they're now asking. And the bond markets would not approve.
It will take years before renting out any property in Vancouver will make more sense than selling. The city will unload this place all right. IMHO they just don't want to take the lead in cutting prices and take the blame for the upcoming bust.
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August 15th, 2010 at 2:21 am 160
@Teddybear:
Well Hong Kong is entirely leasehold. So is Mainland China for that matter. Maybe he expects a "rich Asian" to buy the place.
However this is a non-prepaid lease so essentially it's just renting the land. Pretty much the same as buying a mobile home, except you can't move it.
If you want to know what it's really worth, the land rent + taxes are about $1000/month. Say the house could be rented for $3000/month, that's a net of $2000/month. So I'd say maybe $2000*12/.08 = $300,000. Really not as overpriced as the fee simple properties nearby. Reason – you can't buy it with borrowed money.
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August 15th, 2010 at 2:28 am 161
patriotz says: That wouldn’t make sense even if the city could only sell them for 1/2 of what they’re now asking. And the bond markets would not approve. It will take years before renting out any property in Vancouver will make more sense than selling. The city will unload this place all right.
well, you're certain the market will crash (i'll give you a mulligan on your 2008 posts), so indeed if a 50% crash is coming then maybe they'll sell into the crash after the potential political damage has subsided. i'm not sure on the details of their financing but i think they will rent them out and then sell them into the next boom (whenever that is).
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August 15th, 2010 at 2:38 am 162
V803039
I now read agent's write-ups for entertainment.
"New condo developments nearby are selling like hotcakes . .Fraser is the new Main! "
That's a new one, I guess I missed the memo.
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August 15th, 2010 at 2:38 am 163
@stagnate:
Since the units at the OV are not selling at pre-sale prices, the crash is already under way. Do I think units at the OV will eventually sell for 50% off pre-sale? Yes I do. And "eventually" may be a lot sooner than we think.
And I really think the last thing this or any future city council wants is to retain ownership and rent it out.
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August 15th, 2010 at 2:41 am 164
@stagnate: I agree that they will rent it out. The political cost to realizing a loss is huge. Remember the political reaction to selling the fast ferries? Some people were like "you sold them for less than they were 'worth'!" Many people cannot distinguish between cost and worth. It doesn't matter how much they cost to build; all that matters is what someone is willing to pay.
And the political lesson is that you always want to maintain the fiction that they are truly still worth what was paid. For the oly village, the way to do that is to rent them forever.
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August 15th, 2010 at 2:48 am 165
@patriotz: I totally disagree patriotz. Will they maximize their return if they sell for current prices? Definitely. But that will not maximize their political return.
If they sell at a loss they will wear it. If they hold on to them they can hold on to the fiction that there is no loss.
Look at all the banks in the US holding onto their foreclosures instead of realizing losses, so that they can maintain the fiction that the banks are solvent.
The CoV will do the same thing.
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August 15th, 2010 at 2:53 am 166
Think of all the land that could be opened up ( free crown land for development) for seniors housing, low income and rent controlled housing up Burrard Inlet etc., if the Vision Vanc douchebags could ever get theri heads out of their asses and think bigger than chickens, bycicles and cigarettes. I have been in many cities around the world where quick and easy commuting is done by water taxi …..private enterprise. For profit and union scum woul;d be kept out of the process so that costs could be kept down………the expansion of the usage of water access property for other things besides this petulant scope of ' luxury home sites' would be a real winner. In a city that has been so fucked up by incredibly poor design and planning the opportunity to 'fix' seniors housinh, low income and rent controled issues is straing these NO VISION douchebags right in the face.
http://www.vancouversun.com/commute+water+Metro+V…
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August 15th, 2010 at 2:55 am 167
i think the civic politicians (current and future) will get some mileage out of having a stock of rental units, indeed i agree the issue of whether it would make more sense to liquidate them will be moot. i see this as a bit opposite of the fast ferry situation, where the libs got a political lift by dumping them at any cost. the ferries could have been fixed/modified and kept in service for thirty years, but then the liberals would have lost their political ace of the day.
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August 15th, 2010 at 2:55 am 168
When's the next city election?
Change in government is a convenient time to change past mistakes, it was someone else's fault for the original planning/decision. They'll get sold after the key players have been voted out.
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August 15th, 2010 at 2:55 am 169
@McLovin: "Does anyone know why London Drugs and Urban Fare have not opened yet? " How about you read the first part of your post–it is dead there. Why would you open retail to service zero customers, unless you like to burn money. The new community centre is open and apparently very empty. But they don't care about profit, so they're happy to burn up tax dollars with that.
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August 15th, 2010 at 3:05 am 170
@Jonathon: yeah, that makes sense and squares with stagnate: The vision guys will cling to the dream, just like the NDP did with the fast ferries. If the NPA wins, they will sell them off (like the liberals did with the ferries) so they can pin the loss on their predecessors in future elections.
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August 15th, 2010 at 3:13 am 171
Its nice to see that realpauls opinions are clearly supported by the majority of Canadians.
http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2010/08/15/pa…
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August 15th, 2010 at 3:35 am 172
@4SlicesofCheese:
"Fraser is the new Main! ”
Stupid agent, that's so last year.
We've now moved on to "Knight is the new Fraser".
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August 15th, 2010 at 3:39 am 173
@realpaul:
Wow, great idea!
I'm going to take it one further by moving to Sechelt and commuting to UBC by ultralight aircraft.
Should only take me about 20 minutes, I hope it's not too windy.
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August 15th, 2010 at 4:36 am 174
#173 BPOM , Sechelt is just another 'Surrey by the Sea'…what a shithole. Places like Gibsons etc ( and don't get me started on the 'islands') are so jampacked with fuck ups, rejects and savagery that certain parts are like micro-asylums. Keep the ultra lite on a blowsy hill top for a fast escape.
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August 15th, 2010 at 4:36 am 175
@VHB:
You're not disagreeing with me at all. The economically correct thing to do is to unload them all NOW. The political downside is that homeowners and developers would blame this for bringing on the bust. So the council being timid will try to sell them off slowly enough that they're not seen to be responsible for falling prices.
But if I think the council had any real balls they'd just unload them anyway and pin the blame on Sam Sullivan, just like Gordo unloaded the fast ferries and blamed Glen Clark. It just might work.
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August 15th, 2010 at 4:53 am 176
But don't the retailers already have signed deals to open in the OV? They can't just look out the window one day and say "Oh, there are no people here, let's not move in." Hasn't this deal been in the works for years, and it's always been said that these retailers would open "after the Olympics." I know someone who has a condo for sale at the OV, and is hoping that it will actually sell once the retailers move in (imagine that).
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August 15th, 2010 at 4:53 am 177
@Jonathon:
The key players – Sam Sullivan and his NPA council – were voted out in 2008. Robertson wasn't even on council when the OV was decided upon.
You see, that's why I think the current council simply should have bitten the bullet and pulled a fast ferry style auction. People are already starting to believe that they were responsible for OV, not the NPA. This tar baby is sticking to them.
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August 15th, 2010 at 4:57 am 178
@patriotz: "they’d just unload them anyway and pin the blame on Sam Sullivan"
And why aren't they? Well many of the current councilors slinking around when any OV issue come up to vote will be skinned alive. Going through the voting history, both Vision and NPA have political baggage.
Agree the BEST they could do for the city is sell these units fast at a hefty discount to market rates. Rennie's job should be to make it look like the sellers are desperate. But will they? I put that chance at about 0.1%. All councilors from what I can see are still in denial phase about Vancouver's prices (i.e. they haven't even been handed the Big Book yet let alone opened it up) and that means OV goes down with the rest of them.
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August 15th, 2010 at 5:13 am 179
@jesse:
Because Vision is just as beholden to the RE industry as the NPA, and they don't want to upset their backers.
The voters blamed the NPA for the OV fiasco in 2008, and they will probably blame Vision in 2011. But it's not the politicians who are really responsible.
It's the voters themselves.
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August 15th, 2010 at 5:40 am 180
@patriotz:
There's a sign at Revolution Books in NYC…
"If voting could really change things,
It would be illegal."
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August 15th, 2010 at 6:20 am 181
Problem is they won't be able to rent out the OV unless they are under market rent. Nobody is renting the units that are available right now (hence ghost town)because the units are small and the rent expensive compared to rest of the city. They want almost $3000/mnth for a 2br 900sq ft.
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August 15th, 2010 at 6:22 am 182
Our local pusher has learned a new phrase:
“black swan event”
yes folks, that is what it would take to crash the Vancouver RE market according to this highly trained thinker who will not disclose his qualifications.
He is good though; a black swan event meaning something rare, or unlikely, an aberration of a sort.
How about people coming to their senses after a cold splash of reality as with all previous awakenings from other manias?
Bubbles are caused mainly by the human condition and naiveté. Logic and reason leaves us for a while, and that explains why seemingly intelligent people bother to debate the pusher.
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August 15th, 2010 at 6:45 am 183
Speaking of a "Black Swan", check out this NYT article on the spectacularly defaulting HELOCS south of the border (courtesy of Mish):
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/12/business/12debt…
HELOCs are the secret time bomb of Vancouver's upcoming housing crash… look around yourself at all the BMW-driving, sushi-eating, jet-setting Vancouverites and ask yourself where they got all that money in a city with no real economy.
And if you think the article paints a bleak picture in the US, just wait until the HELOCs start defaulting here. Because unlike the US, our "second mortgages" are backed by CMHC, which means responsible renters will be paying for all those BMWs, lattes, and trips to Mexico that your home-debtor neighbors have been taking.
Here's the best part of the article:
At least they Americans have can claim they never saw it coming, unlike us. Black swan indeed.
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August 15th, 2010 at 6:55 am 184
@renter:
Any property can be rented out at market rent, by definition.
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August 15th, 2010 at 7:56 am 185
This house was put up for sale in early 2008, remained on the market for well over a year and didn't sell. Without all of the problems from the credit crunch this house is also on a corner lot with about 10ft of depth to the back yard and is on a busy street (not exactly sought after).
MLS# F1021202
When it didn't sell the owner put foreign students in the home and rented it out for the past year (the home is being staged, it is not occupied). Now they are trying to cash out again for a mere $738k! I thought they would have learned their lesson last time but I guess not.
The reason I bring this up is a place 4 houses up the street was listed since the spring and didn't sell either. The listing expired and the owner had trades people parked out front for a month renovating the place. Now it's been relisted again after renovations for $550k. I believe that is the same price as before the listing expired a couple months ago.
MLS F1021323
Location is very comparable, but the homes are a 6B/4Ba vs. a 4B/3Ba. The smaller home is on an almost 9000sqft lot while the larger home is on about 6000sqft. The smaller home also has a very large set of hedges in front for extra privacy from the street noise. For me there's no contest here which I'd choose, and a difference of $200k just makes it even more ridiculous.
The other thing that is happening in this example is that rather than list at a lower price, owners are trying to put the best lipstick on their pig (renos, staging etc.). So as sales drop off, buyers are only interested in the best properties since there is no urgency to purchase due to high listings/low sales. The result is that although prices aren't really moving lower right now, sellers have to spend more to maintain the same listing price (god forbid they lower their price instead). I suspect that's what the agents are telling their clients these days, that they need to make their home stand out and dazzle potential buyers to make the sale happen. The price may not change (yet) but the features do.
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August 15th, 2010 at 8:10 am 186
"just wait until the HELOCs start defaulting here. Because unlike the US, our “second mortgages” are backed by CMHC"
Are people taking out real mortgages? Are HELOCs (home equity lines of credit) real mortgages? I thought they were different, and believed it would be only the bank that suffered, and the defaulting borrowers credit rating. Are second mortgages guaranteed by CMHC? Again, I thought not. In sincerity, I don't understand much about mortgages. Can someone enlighten me?
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August 15th, 2010 at 8:12 am 187
True story:
We just came from an open house in Port Moody(1082 GATENSBURY RD).The house is listed at 725000, empty, probably somebody bought it to flip it. Before leaving the realtor told us"I know is listed at $725000, but the new price is actually $625000, we just dropped $100000" !?!?
We may buy a house in the future,but for now we are patiently waiting…no rush:)
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August 15th, 2010 at 8:30 am 188
Our local pusher has learned a new phrase:
“black swan event”
Somewhat obvious who the pumper is, but I had a chuckle the other day, when he was trying to imply that some of the North Van working stiffs would sell and use the profits to buy in the Valley a house for themselves and a down payment for each of the kids.
New twist to the old pumpers’ version of the 100 year mortgage- intergenerational deal.
Man some of the pumpers have no shame.
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August 15th, 2010 at 8:56 am 189
@Dan:
HELOCs and mortgages are different from each other in name only. They are both loans made with real estate as collateral, and so are essentially the same thing. When someone buys a house for the first time, they usually call it a "mortgage". When they withdraw equity against a house they already own, it's a HELOC or "second mortgage" or "refinancing". Same thing.
And, yes, the CMHC does insure HELOCs. The only change they've made recently is to limit the amount of refinancing to 90% of the current value, down from 95%.
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August 15th, 2010 at 8:59 am 190
@patriotz: yet not all homes can be sold at current market rate. There is a giant game of reverse musical chairs going on.
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August 15th, 2010 at 9:26 am 191
@Dan in Calgary: helocs in ab are recourse I think. Cmhc insures many of them with similar reqts to conventional mortgages. Otherwise banks or whomever else takes the hit.
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August 15th, 2010 at 9:37 am 192
@anonymous123:
"But don’t the retailers already have signed deals to open in the OV? They can’t just look out the window one day and say “Oh, there are no people here, let’s not move in.”
Why can't they? Who would stop them, and how?
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August 15th, 2010 at 9:45 am 193
Nope and ….HELOCS are not second mortgages they are secured lines of credit. A HELOC is repayable @ 3% monthly on the outstanding balance. They are 'recourse' in the same sense as your Visa account is recourse…..except unlike your mortgage it is not confined to real estate. The CMHC does not insure a HELOC or any part of it. The HELOC is a side door 'loan' to bridge a real estate purchase with zero down…the Bank Act does not allow a Chartered bank to loan without equity…hence 'presto' the HELOC becomes that satisfying equity.
Many budding real estate flippers don't take the HELOC into full appreciation, thinking its part of the mortgage amortization…..wrongo……Lets take a HELOC of 5% on a $500,000 purchase……$25,000 right …. repayable at 3% per month equals $750 right…thats on top of the mortgage etc etc etc etc etc etc. This does not form part of the P.I.T on the first mort…so the vig you pay does nothing to pay down the mortgage.
In the event of a meltdown of 20% the re fi would have to include a second mortgage to qualify again for the first…thats where the payments ( and the payments) goes ballistic. Don't think of being underwater by one or two hundred grand on zero equity and think that the same bank is going to give you a HELOC for that amount.
Geez guys, we've been through this so many times that half this board could teach a class on the subject.
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August 15th, 2010 at 9:55 am 194
Toronto condo market hits the ‘down’ button: Though prices remain firm, sales have slowed and supply is surging in Canada’s condo capital
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August 15th, 2010 at 9:55 am 195
@Jenny the Troll: "black swan event" is brilliant. It is like jumping off a cliff and thinking "Hey no problem. Hitting the ground would be a black swan event."
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August 15th, 2010 at 10:01 am 196
@anonymous123:
What "deals" could they possibly have? They probably have leases on the space, and figure it is cheaper to pay the rent (if they lease is already in effect) than pay they rent, and also pay for operations and inventory.
If you're ever in the area, give it a visit, and see for yourself. It is truly eerie. Cold, dark, and empty. The place being an island unto itself doesn't help either.
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August 15th, 2010 at 10:23 am 197
@The other Garth:
Not correct. A black swan event is one with extremely low probability of occurring. In the case you cite, the law of gravity means that the person will hit the ground with absolute certainty. It would be a black swan event if you didn't hit the ground.
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August 15th, 2010 at 10:34 am 198
@oneangryslav2: The point of Taleb's book is that these "Black Swan" events are much more common than we think and the models all underestimate(d) the probability of such events occurring. There is a perfect storm brewing. Not all the elements are in place yet, but the clouds are forming.
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August 15th, 2010 at 10:35 am 199
@realpaul: welcome back
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August 15th, 2010 at 10:50 am 200
@realpaul:
I didn't realize HELOCs were treated differently from refinancing by CMHC. I thought they were the same since they're both loans backed by real estate. I should check my facts before spouting off next time… my bad.
But anyway that doesn't change my main point, which is that Vancouver homeowners have been treating their houses like ATMs, just like they were south of the border, and with exactly the same consequences to come.
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August 15th, 2010 at 10:58 am 201
A real Black Swan event would be Chipman actually selling a property or doing something that is even remotely productive instead of just yapping at people on his website.
I just noticed he's got a service called the "hands-on-package".
That might explain what he's been doing with his time.
http://www.robchipman.net/services/listing-servic…
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August 15th, 2010 at 11:39 am 202
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business…
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August 15th, 2010 at 12:13 pm 203
@VHB #164…
They will be just like the fast ferries…bet you that as soon as it is politically advantageous to do so, the OV will be sold for a hugely discounted price to an insider who will sell them for a huge return…just like the ferries. And once again, the taxpayers get screwed!
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August 15th, 2010 at 12:18 pm 204
"A lot of people are very upset they didn't sell six months ago."
Read more: http://www.cbc.ca/canada/toronto/story/2010/08/15…
Nice to see this blog on-topic.
— NLL
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August 15th, 2010 at 12:24 pm 205
@Bizznitch: A quote from that Globe and Mail article:
What an understatement:
My brother rents a relatively new (4 years old or so) place on Queen's Quay for about $2.50/sq ft. a month, which is $30/sq ft a year. Given that the owner purchased it at least 4 years ago (maybe even longer if it was a pre-sale), the owner may be making positive cash flow. Of course, I haven't included condo fees, which are pretty high as there is a 24-hour security guard on site and some pretty decent amenities.
I posted a few weeks back (based on the "dark windows" hypothesis) that Toronto's condo market was even more specutastic than Vancouver's. This article provides some evidence ("investors" account for at least 40% of condo sales) in support of my view.
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August 15th, 2010 at 12:37 pm 206
@Devore:
By "deals", I meant hadn't they signed with the developer (or whoever) an agreement to operate a business in these new buildings? And by not doing so are they not violating some agreement? But you're right, I haven't actually got a clue how it's all supposed to work out. Maybe they are just paying the rent on these empty spaces, scratching their heads about WTF to do next. Are there no signs of life in the retail locations, ie "coming soon" signs, or "now hiring, apply at this website"? We drove by there last week…ya it's got to be the quietest place in Vancouver.
On another note, another retail/residential flop seems to be the King Edward Village (though they do have Save On Foods). The rest of the place is "For Lease". Surprised a Starbucks hasn't moved in since there isn't any one for miles.
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August 15th, 2010 at 12:47 pm 207
On people starting to regret not selling..etc…
A friend of mine listed his house and got an offer that was 10% off asking. He was whining about how insulting it was, said he told the buyers to stuff it. I told him that he should have taken it…he bought years ago and even at 10% off would be getting a winfall…he gave me that lecture on not selling for less than it's worth, and RE only goes up.
Two weeks later he is talking to one of our other friends about how he thinks he should have taken the offer…I hate to say I told him so!
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August 15th, 2010 at 1:07 pm 208
@VHB: Urban Fare and London Drugs have never planned to open in the OV in 2010, perhaps because they anticipated this debacle or perhaps because even the most optimistic projections suggested the area wouldn't have the needed density for some time. In any event they will both open while it is still "dead" there (just as London Drugs has already done in the DTES) on the theory that it is necessary to establish a presence in a supposedly up-and-coming area before others do. I don't subscribe to that theory myself, but London Drugs apparently feels burned by not having moved into Yaletown early, before Shoppers established itself. It has a particular sensitivity about this issue.
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August 15th, 2010 at 1:31 pm 209
@anon:
I hope your friend never gets another offer.
Truly, I do.
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August 15th, 2010 at 1:33 pm 210
The Froogle Scott Chronicles: Mortgaging Our Souls In Paradise –
Part 8: Renovation Nervosa Finale
http://wp.me/pcq1o-1cw
A fascinatingly methodical account of the final phases of this Vancouver renovation, with details regarding pitfalls, emotions, and expenses.
"After fifteen months, our renovation has evolved from a start-and-stop, homeowner-managed undertaking into a bigger, more complex, increasingly expensive project run by a general contractor. We’re learning about renovation and construction the hard way, and even harder lessons are still to come." – Froogle Scott
"Brace yourself. On first reading Froogle’s latest episode, I found myself on more than one occasion spontaneously exclaiming out loud, or grimacing & ducking, or writhing in vicariously experienced psychic pain." -vreaa
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August 15th, 2010 at 1:36 pm 211
One of the doors to the Olympic Village London Drugs space was open today and some kind of construction is going on inside. Currently looked like an empty shell with some metal studs, so a long way from opening.
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August 15th, 2010 at 1:37 pm 212
type "millenium" into craigslist and giggle at all the rentals available there.
interesting to watch the prices drop
ghost town
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August 15th, 2010 at 1:53 pm 213
anon 207
Greed and stupidity is a recipe for disaster. Speculation= Greed + Stupidity
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August 15th, 2010 at 1:54 pm 214
Ha ha, too funny, or maybe too sad.
Used to be “buy now or be priced out for ever” it looks like it’s going the other way; sell now or be forever priced in.
“Now with fat mortgages at low rates, no wonder sellers are sticking with high prices, mooning reality. They’re trapped.”
http://www.greaterfool.ca/
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August 15th, 2010 at 1:58 pm 215
@realpaul:
I can't lie, I totally LOL'ed at this.
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August 15th, 2010 at 2:38 pm 216
@Best place on meth:
Actually, I hope that one day his friend receives an offer for what it is [actually] worth.
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August 15th, 2010 at 2:52 pm 217
@ patriotz
"False Creek West (south shore of False Creek between Cambie and Granville) was civic planned too. "
You have got to be shitting me. You see no difference in the sense of the word 'planned' between all of WFC, an area in which I've worked for 10 years, and the Soviet housing blok at OV?
West False Creek was not 'planned' in the same sense as the OV. The City obviously had much greater control of the latter.
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August 15th, 2010 at 2:58 pm 218
@Hovering:
"type “millenium” into craigslist and giggle at all the rentals available there."
How can there be so many rentals if few of the units have sold?
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August 15th, 2010 at 3:04 pm 219
@Anonymous: Good question! But I did as Hovering suggests and indeed there are a lot of listings for decent prices. Here's an example:
http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/van/apa/1885770…
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August 15th, 2010 at 7:30 pm 220
@fixie guy:
You don't know what the hell you are talking about.
West False Creek was planned literally from the ground up by the CoV.
Check your facts before you come out sounding like an ignoramus.
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August 16th, 2010 at 1:10 am 221
Just thought I could share this one:
http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/van/apa/1901046…
The suite was on MLS for months to no avail (almost half a million), and has been up for rent, for a couple of months too. The owner first asked $1900 p/m and now it is somewhat better – $1695 p/m.
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August 16th, 2010 at 1:32 am 222
@Best place on meth:
“Fraser is the new Main! ”
Stupid agent, that’s so last year.
We’ve now moved on to “Knight is the new Fraser”.
Wake me when we're at "Renfrew is the new Nanaimo".
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