Friday Free-for-all

Yessiree, it’s the end of another week. Let’s do our regular weekend news round up and open topic discussion thread! Here are a few stories to kick off the chat:

Dramatic drop in Richmond new condo sales
No post-Olympic tourist bump for BC
58% of BC not saving for a rainy day
Nearly half of Flagship for sale?
Teranet index shows big bump for prices last August
Revised real estate chart book
Some appraisers grumble about Zoocasa estimates
More protests over Chinese developer price drops
US economy expanded at fastest pace in a year

So what are you seeing out there? Post you news links, thoughts and anecdotes here and have an excellent weekend!

Sort by:   newest | oldest | most voted
Inventory
Guest
Inventory

Richmond Condo sales (October) new & resales

1994 = 54

1995 = 57

1996 = 74 / 734

1997 = 82 / 722

1998 = 50 / 658

1999 = 40 / 545

2000 = 61 / 480

2001 = 95 / 388

2002 = 120 / 411

2003 = 145 / 383

2004 = 161 / 665

2005 = 175 / 457

2006 = 119 / 680

2007 = 175 / 579

2008 = 91 /1001

2009 = 222 / 645

2010 = 133 / 736 (Listings)

2011 = 88 (-33%) ***Oct 28 (888 Active listings)

CanuckDownUnder
Member
CanuckDownUnder

Not only am I willing to pay the owner of my property an 8% gross return per annum, but I should have to.

It's too bad for him that the rent is set by the market. I love being a renter.

patriotz
Member

You've already heard this story, but as usual Mish tells it best:

Shanghai Homeowners Smash Showroom in Protest of Falling Prices; Developer Warns on Price Drops; "Twilight Zone" of Phony Accounting and Shadow Money

And note the last sentence:

"No city will be immune and commodity prices will be smashed in the downturn."

And that, folks, is why the coming Chinese RE bust will matter for Canada, big time.

registered
Member
registered

1 Inventory Says:

2008 = 91 /1001

….

2011 = 88 Oct 28

2008 levels? Yikes.

Oilman
Guest
Oilman

Was up in Squamish yesterday and I there is a pile of homes for sale. The interesting thing is you have townhouses selling for more than houses in the same areas. And, they all seem horribly overpriced, even the belly-up units are selling for way too much: 370k for a 3 bed unit at Aqua. I think Squamish is in for a world of hurt.

space889
Member
space889

With regard to software engineer pay rates in Vancouver compared to other places, just curious why is it so damn low here? I mean if the other places can pay 25% to 50% more for senior people and still make a profit, why can't they do it in Vancouver? Are the non-labour cost that much higher than Toronto?

Ok, I know the argument why pay more if you can get them for cheap for the weather and lifestyle Vancouver offers. However if people aren't willing to make the sacrifice anymore then you can't really get away with paying less? I imagine making less profit is still better than losing projects and closing shop??

Anonymous
Guest
Anonymous

"Nearly half of Flagship for sale?"

No, that is not correct. The link lists the units for sale in 4 Concord buildings in the area not just Flagship. Flagship is 8 Smith and has only 9 units for sale out of 115. Not quite headline news.

Anonymous
Guest
Anonymous

"However if people aren’t willing to make the sacrifice anymore then you can’t really get away with paying less?"

Obviously what is posted here is not always 100% true. If people wouldn't accept the current wage then the companies would have to pay more. People are accepting the wages.

BTW in any industry the workers always "get paid way more" somewhere else (according to the workers).

4444 4444 4444 4444
Guest
4444 4444 4444 4444

Hello boys and girls.

Happy Friday

How is the curse I placed on Richmond going?

Should we now put a curse a la forte on the westside or Burnaby.

Please advise

patriotz
Member

@Oilman:

"Was up in Squamish yesterday and I there is a pile of homes for sale. The interesting thing is you have townhouses selling for more than houses in the same areas."

I think you mean "asking", not "selling".

🙂

patriotz
Member

@Anonymous:

"People are accepting the wages."

Yes but which people? As has been pointed out, it's the low-value ones, i.e. new grads and immigrants. It's the high-value employees that the companies cannot pay enough to get and still remain competitive.

cgh
Guest
cgh
@space889: "With regard to software engineer pay rates in Vancouver compared to other places, just curious why is it so damn low here?" Well, this is really the question, isn't it. I think one reason is that a lot of managers (MBAs, not technical people) think of programmers as essentially technicians with roughly equivalent skill levels, given a certain number of years of experience. So programmers are "pluggable" resources, like line workers in a factory. This isn't a Vancouver phenomenon; it happens everywhere. Of course that isn't the case, and really successful companies (Google, Apple, etc.) understand this. One of the major themes of the book The Mythical Man-Month was that a good programmer is roughly five to ten times more effective than a mediocre one. Apparently most of the companies in Vancouver never got this memo. That's not to… Read more »
cgh
Guest
cgh

@Anonymous: "People are accepting the wages."

By and large, the people they are targeting are not accepting the wages. That's why I get daily calls from recruiters who gleaned my phone number from some long-lost resume I posted years ago on a job site somewhere.

Alum
Guest
Alum

Don't worry guys. It will all be OK.

You will not buy when prices are coming down, anyway.

So go away and enjoy the weekend ! LOOOL

cgh
Guest
cgh

@Oilman: "I think Squamish is in for a world of hurt."

Me too. We have been looking at buying a summer condo there for a while and we couldn't believe the prices and the shoddy build quality. $450,000 for a three bedroom townhouse that rents for $1500 with gaps under the doors so big I could slip my entire hand through? Come on.

Sorry about the multiple posts – plenty of interesting comments today, I guess.

Oilman
Guest
Oilman

@patriotz: Yes, 'asking' was what I meant!

Anonymouse
Guest
Anonymouse

@cgh:

Underfunding? What happened to making profits?

Best place on meth
Member
Best place on meth

China property developer warns on price falls

http://us.ft.com/ftgateway/superpage.ft?news_id=f

Oilman
Guest
Oilman

@cgh: Here are two examples from the MLS: 1)House in Garibaldi Highlands 612k, http://www.realtor.ca/propertyDetails.aspx?proper… and 2)This townhouse in the Garibaldi Highlands 567k, http://www.realtor.ca/propertyDetails.aspx?proper

Not a huge price differential, but one is a poorly built townhouse (I viewed it yesterday) and the other is a solid single family home (which I also viewed).

space889
Member
space889

@cgh: that does make sense, I know my old company has some of that mentality too. In fact I heard the big owner was complaining why the IT department are so lazy and aren't working 50 to 60hrs/week like other IT companies? Especially when they keep selling the "Work Hard, Play Hard" and "Work Life Balance, no mandatory OT" company culture to all the new hires.

I would have thought most startup/game companies here were started and headed by IT rather than MBAs but I could be very wrong.

If Canadian VCs are mostly like Kevin O'Leary, it's no surprise that they are cheap and can't see anyone but themselves are being non-assembly pluggable parts.

Anonymous
Guest
Anonymous

@space889: …..regard to software engineer pay rates in Vancouver compared to other places,….

There's no such thing as a 'software engineer'!

registered
Member
registered

8 Anonymous Says: "BTW in any industry the workers always “get paid way more” somewhere else (according to the workers)."

My employer agrees. HR sets Vancouver as a Tier 2 wage market and Toronto a Tier 1. Guess which sees higher pay.

cgh
Guest
cgh

@Anonymouse: "Underfunding? What happened to making profits?"

I guess you aren't familiar with what it takes to start a company.

Google got US$100,000 in cash in 1998, pre-incorporation. Their 2010 profits were US$8.505 billion.

As with all forms of investment, if you don't put anything in, you won't get anything back.

jesse
Member

@space889: "why pay more"

Many can't because their business cases wouldn't work otherwise.

Patiently Waiting
Member
Patiently Waiting

Once again, when a Joe Sixpack investor takes a risk and it doesn't work out, he is a "victim" of a "scam". This is an early glimpse at what we'll see when Vancouver real estate crashes.

http://www.ctvbc.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/

wpDiscuz