Friday Free-for-all!
It’s that time of the week again! Lets do our regular friday news round up and open topic discussion thread for the weekend. Here are a few links to kick off the chat:
-Prediction: The Canadian Housing Market will Crash
-Household borrowing surge driven by most indebted
-Boomers ‘punch drunk’ on debt
-Canadian home prices fall for first time since fall, 2010
-Either Windsor or Edmonton has the most affordable market
-Canadas job market in bad shape
-Property taxes on the rise
-$100 hot dog, get it while it’s hot.
-US banks face margin pressure from fed rates
-US new home sales worst ever in fall 2011
-A real estate downturn down under?
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So what are you seeing out there? Post your news links, thoughts and anecdotes here and have an excellent weekend!
January 26th, 2012 at 4:38 pm 1
Just started a thread in the forum to help RE newbies (myself included) understand the linguistic intricacies in a typical MLS listing (especially for Vancouver). To start off:
“Handyman’s Special”: looks bad, smells bad, has at least one major system that doesn’t function
“Motivated”: seller gives the impression that he is under pressure to reach a quick deal
perhaps someone can continue on by defining “Vancouver’s Special”, etc.
feel free to add to an entry that was already defined
http://vancouvercondo.info/forum/topic/mls-lingo-…
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January 26th, 2012 at 5:24 pm 2
Current result from 2 polls, FWIW
1. "Will the housing market finally crash?" (from the first link)
Yes: 201 (78.5%)
No: 55 (21.5%)
2. "Is Greater Vancouver RE in a bubble?" (from Westca Chinese forum, poll started 1/26 @ 5pm）
Yes, big bubble, bursting soon: 16%
Yes, moderate bubble, not bursting in near future: 45%
Yes, just a small bubble: 11%
No, price is reasonable: 15%
Not at all, price will continue to increase: 11%
<a href="http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2 Fwww.westca.com%2FForums%2Fviewtopic%2Ft%3D423182%2Flang%3Dschinese.html&act=url” target=”_blank”>http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&…” target=”_blank”>Fwww.westca.com%2FForums%2Fviewtopic%2Ft%3D423182%2Flang%3Dschinese.html&act=url
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January 26th, 2012 at 6:36 pm 3
@VMD: http://approvedbuyer.com/real-estate/the-truth-be…
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January 26th, 2012 at 7:07 pm 4
Downturn down under? Please, house prices are set to soar:
"For most of this year Australians have had to read asinine media articles reporting purported experts predicting catastrophically large 20 per cent, 40 per cent and, last week, 60 per cent falls in domestic house prices."
http://www.businessspectator.com.au/bs.nsf/Articl…
Forget the fact that the Australian economy lost 30,000 jobs in December.
Who cares that the country actually lost jobs in 2011, the first time that this has happened since 1992?
Retail had an absolutely awful Christmas season and there are going to massive blue collar and white collar job cuts this year.
Europe is a basket case, the US is FUBAR, and can you really believe anything coming out of China?
All of this doesn't matter because interest rates are going down and house prices are going TO DA MOON!!!
Now forgive me, I'm off to cry into my Canadian Club and browse open house listings for tomorrow. If I don't buy now I'll be priced out forever.
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January 26th, 2012 at 7:37 pm 5
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/26/greathomesandde…
I found these parts interesting:
So Germany has no restrictions on foreign RE ownership, yet there was no bubble in the last decade because… you already read the reason.
And please don't try to compare this house to something in the Valley. Vancouver is no Frankfurt and Mission is no Wiesbaden.
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January 26th, 2012 at 10:43 pm 6
A "Vancouver Special" is one of those gently-pitched tar and gravel roofed, plain vanilla boxy type houses, usually of white stucco and brown wooden trim, built maostly during the 1960's-70's.
Sometimes the front facades were dressed up with faux stone, wooden siding and brick. The really adventurous added to the delight with cheap cement statuary and wrought iron (now aluminum)fencing for the front yard.
The houses often came with a "suite-able" basement AND a balcony for the sliding glass doors at the front living room of the house. No one ever sat out on them, though. They were mostly for "show". Built to maximum density, these houses tended to take up an entire city lot.
There are oodles of them on Vancouver's narrow lots…particularly abundant on the east side and stretching into Burnaby.
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January 26th, 2012 at 11:25 pm 7
$100 hot dog is just a stupid advertising gimmick. please stop helping him promote himself, he isn't giving anyone any value.
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January 26th, 2012 at 11:34 pm 8
First Time Buyer: someone with little knowledge of the real estate industry, it's players and (lack of) ethical conduct; someone inexperienced in buying real estate. A member of a socially vulnerable group including new immigrants or young people. A mark. A sucker.
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January 27th, 2012 at 12:21 am 9
@VMD, what is an executive house? Seriously.
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January 27th, 2012 at 12:51 am 10
@VMD: Maybe move on to Vansky.com. I think that's bigger than westca, at least by the number of people posting ads on their BB. I never visited their forums myself….Chinese skills not up to par anymore.
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January 27th, 2012 at 1:04 am 11
Here is a prime example of greed and disconnect.
I know someone who lives in the building.
Both suites are almost identical, one has lipstick the other not
http://tinyurl.com/829yrmf http://tinyurl.com/7r8tsc5
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January 27th, 2012 at 1:13 am 12
RE: Vancouver Specials: see also vancouverspecial.com
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January 27th, 2012 at 1:14 am 13
Shooting in Vancouver
Man shot in the leg, not cooperating with police
http://www.news1130.com/news/local/article/324369…
If you walk in Vancouver use the zig-zag and roll method so you can avoid the bullets.
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January 27th, 2012 at 1:19 am 14
Any ideas for shorting the impending Vancouver real estate crash?
I am unsure of the banks, they seem sheltered with most of the risk with the CMHC holding the bag. But they still should get hit with consumer credit, underwriting etc.
Any public construction companies in Canada focused heavily on residential construction Vancouver or Toronto?
Any public furniture companies?
Other ideas? And don't say REITs.
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January 27th, 2012 at 1:46 am 15
Young Families Pull Up Stakes For Better Life
http://www.theprovince.com/business/Young+familie…
I didn't have time to search if anyone put this up. My wife and I can relate to many of these stories and we too will be moving by mid 2013 if the stars don't align.
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January 27th, 2012 at 1:47 am 16
@14 WS: Austin on RET set up a fund (?) to short Genworth Financial Canada back in the 2008 glory daze but he's (?) been quiet on that front for a while.
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January 27th, 2012 at 1:54 am 17
@Dante:
When I read that headline I thought "Crap! The police are shooting people now for being uncooperative?"
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January 27th, 2012 at 1:56 am 18
@Vansanity:
The Vancouver bubble isn't the only reason, or the main one, but it is a significant reason why we have opted to move to Bali for a year. We would like to purchase again in Vancouver but since we can run our businesses remotely, and we are not keen to lose several hundred thousand on real estate in the next few years, we've decided on a little holiday until things return to normal.
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January 27th, 2012 at 1:58 am 19
@condo conundrum: There is a 6 sq.ft. difference between the two places. That's $148,000 more if you want the additional space, or $24K per sq.ft.
Or maybe this has to do with the fact that the more expensive one is more recent. Apparently, it was built in 1996, when the cheaper one was built in 1995
lol…
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January 27th, 2012 at 2:09 am 20
@chip:
You lucky dog, I wish I could do what you're doing.
You're going to love Bali, it actually could qualify as the best place on earth.
Awesome people, amazing scenery, beautiful houses, perfect weather, world class diving….just watch out for the monkeys, they're troublemakers.
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January 27th, 2012 at 2:16 am 21
"Awesome people, amazing scenery, beautiful houses, perfect weather, world class diving….just watch out for the monkeys, they’re troublemakers."
Cheap houses too. It is a wonder what terrorism and world wide travel advisories can do to real estate prices.
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January 27th, 2012 at 2:27 am 22
MSM media is sure changing its tune.
http://www2.macleans.ca/2012/01/26/what-happens-w…
Wow!
Also good luck Chip. You are lucky. I love monkey's btw.
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January 27th, 2012 at 2:28 am 23
@DEFAULT NAME:
>>>It is a wonder what terrorism and world wide travel advisories can do to real estate prices.<<<
Spoken like a true Vancouver cheerleader who's travel experiences have been limited to Bellis Fair and Disneyland.
You poor baby, are you afraid of terrorists everytime you leave Gangcouver?
Better stay away from the US and Europe too then, ok?
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January 27th, 2012 at 2:45 am 24
Debt collection agencies are the lowest of the low, but they do well in tough economic times:
http://www.businessweek.com/investor/content/apr2…
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January 27th, 2012 at 2:47 am 25
@Makaya:
Or you can rent a similar place in the same hood for $2100/month:
http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/van/apa/2774124…
As an investment those condos are only worth about $200K. Remember it's leasehold and the last owner has to give it back.
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January 27th, 2012 at 2:48 am 26
@ fixie guy
Perfect. Thanks. Genworth is the type of ideas worth researching further.
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January 27th, 2012 at 2:57 am 27
@patriotz: from the ad:
"$2,100/m including gas OBO. One year lease. Moving in anytime."
It looks like the place has been for rent for quite a long time now… The $2100 rent is overpriced. You can get much better than that for that price, or similar condos for much cheaper. Poor investment indeed!
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January 27th, 2012 at 2:59 am 28
Canadian agencies wary of calls for overseas buyer curbs
Nothing new here for seasoned VCI readers. Mark this: almost everyone is assuming that overseas demand is limitless:
A. Write down the number of people in the known temporal universe not living in Vancouver
B. Write down the number of years left before the earth crashes into the sun
C. Multiply A by B
D. Use result in C to show the future market size for Vancouver real estate.
Really the numbers are so huge it boggles the mind how Vancouver real estate remains relatively cheap.
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January 27th, 2012 at 3:39 am 29
@jesse:
>>>almost everyone is assuming that overseas demand is limitless<<<
No mention of Vancouver here.
http://www.propertywire.com/news/europe/global-ci…
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January 27th, 2012 at 3:41 am 30
@rp1:
Thanks, that's an interesting list of definitions!
@Tony
Vansky's forum seems to be an unorganized message board full of random posts.. gives me a headache just to look at it..
My main thread at Westca forum already has over 26k view count, I'm content with that.. for now : )
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January 27th, 2012 at 3:49 am 31
@Best place on meth: "You poor baby, are you afraid of terrorists everytime you leave Gangcouver? Better stay away from the US and Europe too then, ok?"
Relax buddy. Terrorism has been a problem in Bali and has impacted everything from the price of a hotel to buying a place. It went from cheap to dirt cheap. I got no problem with it. Just pointing it out.
Speaking of getting outside of Vancouver I am not the guy who spends his days, evenings and weekends on this forum. Ever been outside of your basement suite little lone Vancouver?
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January 27th, 2012 at 4:10 am 32
@jesse: From your article:
This is consistent with what I've been saying for quite some time. While not the main reason behind the current RE valuation, it is fairly clear that foreign ownership has had a huge impact on the Vancouver market, which would explain why we such extreme valuation compared to other Canadian cities.
The "funny" thing is, the solutions to the current problem are well-known, but nobody has the balls or interest to implement them. To have a fully functioning market, it would "only" take that:
- no more public mortgage insurance (get rid of CMHC)
- minimum of 10% downpayment (more would be even better, but that's a start)
- maximum 20 years of amortization period
- interest rates locked for the duration of the mortgage (no more reset every 5 years and no more variable rates)
- 100% tax on capital gains for RE held less than 3 (better 5) years
- 100% tax on capital gains for RE held by non local residents (i. e. the Canadian citizens, PR and other that live permanently where their property is)
- minimum of 30% (better if more) of downpayment for the purchase of a property besides the principal one.
And in an ideal world:
- normalized interest rates…
With all that in place, you have the fully functioning market. You can be sure that the bubble would pop pretty immediately. These measures should be put in place AFTER the bubble pops. Would any leading politician champion that? I doubt it…
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January 27th, 2012 at 4:42 am 33
@Makaya:
"- interest rates locked for the duration of the mortgage (no more reset every 5 years and no more variable rates)"
How? Decreed by the government? Would the government decree the rates too?
Just get the government out of the mortgage market.
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January 27th, 2012 at 5:01 am 34
@patriotz: "How? Decreed by the government? Would the government decree the rates too?"
Well, the same way it works in most of Europe (in France, for example, you can get a mortgage for 25 years with a fixed rate and the government has nothing to do with it). Banks can do it, the government would not be more involved than when they require a minimum of 10% or more downpayment.
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January 27th, 2012 at 5:07 am 35
Ha, the globe and mail changed their headline:
Was: "Boomers punch drunk on household debt"
Now is: "Older consumers pile on new debt"
They left the URL the same though so you can still capture the punch-drunk / kool-aid headline
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January 27th, 2012 at 5:07 am 36
@Makaya:
You seem to have missed my point. Anyone lender in Canada can make a mortgage loan with the interest rate locked in for any duration right now.
Why should lenders HAVE TO lock in rates for the whole duration of the mortgage?
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January 27th, 2012 at 5:11 am 37
hey,
go look for work. dont stay home and make your wife work. what the matter? cant find work in ottawa?
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January 27th, 2012 at 5:34 am 38
Is it just me, or does this editorial in the Globe and Mail lauding the virtues of debt servitude sound reminiscent of people who have just gotten in too deep on a house purchase and then come to comment threads trying to rationalize their mistake:
Globe editorial board is drinking something stronger than punch
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January 27th, 2012 at 5:52 am 39
@patriotz: Sorry, I didn't get your point. The reason is for certainty and stability, to avoid exactly what happened with the subprime mortgages.
A lot of the problems in Canada will occur when interest rates rise and mortgages reset. Lots of people that could service their mortgage at the initial rate will no longer be able to do so with a higher rate, maybe will be forced to sell (which will make the burst even worse) and some of them will be forced into bankruptcy.
You may point out the irresponsibility of the buyer and you would be right, but this will also have nasty consequences on the overall economy and everybody will be impacted, included both of us. I don't see any advantage of having rates to reset every five years.
Now, if you don't allow the mortgages to reset, the person may still be underwater with his/her house, but as long as he/she can service the mortgage and doesn't need to sell, there's no problem. That's why I think it is a sensible policy to have fixed rates for the term of the mortgage. It creates certainty and stability, which is always a good thing.
One measure I forgot to put in my list is to no longer allow HELOC. It doesn't exist in other countries and they're doing perfectly fine without it.
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January 27th, 2012 at 6:13 am 40
@Makaya:
The issue of buyers not being able to afford increased interest rates would be taken care of by the market if the government stopped guaranteeing mortgages. Lenders would make borrowers qualify on historically normal rates rather than temporarily low rates.
The other problem is that if the rate is locked in for, say, 25 years, that's an obligation by the borrower to the lender to pay those rates for 25 years which means the borrower would have to pay a penalty to prepay, refinance at a lower rates, or sell if it wasn't to the lender's benefit.
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January 27th, 2012 at 6:32 am 41
@patriotz:
"the borrower would have to pay a penalty to prepay"
There is no such things in the country I have in mind.
"refinance at a lower rates"
Again, in the european country I'm thinking of, when you refinance your mortgage, you usually transfer your mortgage (and all your other accounts) to another banks and you get the lower rate without penalties. (I know because that's what my brother did)
"or sell if it wasn’t to the lender’s benefit."
I don't see the point here. The lender can't force you to sell as long as you're servicing your mortgage.
"The issue of buyers not being able to afford increased interest rates would be taken care of by the market if the government stopped guaranteeing mortgages. "
In theory, I would agree with you, but in reality, that doesn't work. The market do have failures. I would favour a simple regulation that solve the problem once and for all rather than leave it to the market. This is just my personal opinion and I have no doubt you will disagree with it.
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January 27th, 2012 at 6:44 am 42
A smug Boomer newspaper columnist is suddenly concerned about housing affordability. Why?
"In fact, sky-high Vancouver housing prices were one of the reasons why my son, a young engineer, and his wife chose to move to Montreal, where they were able to buy a townhouse for half what they'd have to pay here.
They miss Vancouver terribly, and we miss them and our little granddaughter. But we realize the vast distance separating us is the penalty we pay for living in Lotusland, and my son pays for having a real job."
Read more: http://www.theprovince.com/business/need+look+gre…
He's only concerned now that it affects him personally.
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January 27th, 2012 at 6:47 am 43
http://opp.org.uk/news-article.php?id=6164
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January 27th, 2012 at 6:57 am 44
@Makaya:
"“the borrower would have to pay a penalty to prepay”
There is no such things in the country I have in mind."
Actually, there are some penalties if you prepay, but there are lots of rules and possibilities to get around them so in reality, only a minority would pay for them.
One of the problem in Canada is the lack of competition between the banks (same goes for mobile phone). I find the various banking fees and charges outrageous in Canada.
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January 27th, 2012 at 6:59 am 45
@Makaya: "Potentially all of them, depending on the rate offered. That’s the case of 75% of the mortgages issued in one European country I’m familiar with."
They used to do that here in the 60s. It transfers the risk of interest rates increasing from the home owner to the bank. When risk is transferred someone has to pay for it.
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January 27th, 2012 at 7:04 am 46
@Makaya:
Me: “or sell if it wasn’t to the lender’s benefit.”
"I don’t see the point here. The lender can’t force you to sell as long as you’re servicing your mortgage."
That's not what I'm talking about at all. What I've already said is that if you have a locked in rate for 25 years you have an obligation to pay that rate for 25 years and if you sell your house and want to pay off the mortgage the lender is going to want a penalty from you if receiving the prepay is not to their benefit.
That of course is exactly what we have right now in Canada for 1 year, 5 year, or any other terms.
So if you want the government to intervene to force 25 year mortgage terms how much more intervention do you want? Because the banks would not do the things you're talking about in your European example if the government didn't make them.
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January 27th, 2012 at 7:07 am 47
@DEFAULT NAME:
"They used to do that here in the 60s."
In the 60s, was the RE market in a bubble like today?
"It transfers the risk of interest rates increasing from the home owner to the bank. When risk is transferred someone has to pay for it."
True, let the market (and real competition between banks) decides what the true cost of that risk is. It's their job after all!
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January 27th, 2012 at 7:21 am 48
@patriotz: "So if you want the government to intervene to force 25 year mortgage terms how much more intervention do you want? Because the banks would not do the things you’re talking about in your European example if the government didn’t make them."
If it works in my example, why couldn't it work in Canada? My only point is to say that long term fixed mortgages is better for the average homeowners and the general economy, as it removes some potential instability that can be disruptive.
When you pay back a mortgages early in that country, you have to pay some fees (that are capped), and there are a whole bunch of exemptions (for example if your company relocated you to another city, etc.). But if you prefer, you can still take a variable mortgage (there are four different kinds), it's cheaper but you swallow the risk. 75% of the people take the fixed long term mortgage there. I'm pretty sure, if given the opportunity, Canadians would do the same. True fixed mortgages in Canada don't exist here.
True the banks that have to take on the risk and they have to price it somehow. But isn't it what banking business is (or should be).
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January 27th, 2012 at 7:30 am 49
Real estate insiders may like the idea of a stable market with slight decreases in prices, but I wouldn't want to be the one to tell the "average" Greater Vancouver home owner that they are about to lose $25k in equity.
People aren't buying with the idea of falling prices. Especially when costs of homeownership, like taxes and interest, are set to rise. That's why such "stable" conditions can't last. Either we are going up again or it will crash.
You can't have it both ways, BCREA.
http://www.bcrea.bc.ca/docs/economics-forecasts-a…
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January 27th, 2012 at 7:47 am 50
@Makaya:
"True fixed mortgages in Canada don’t exist here."
How so? You can get a open fixed mortgage. If you get a closed mortgage you'll get a discounted rate, on the basis that there will be penalties for early repayment.
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January 27th, 2012 at 7:54 am 51
@Patiently Waiting: Where is all the backup data/analysis behind all this garbage? seriously, this is comical.
The chart MLS residential sales: he took data from 2010 and 2011 ans draw a straight line into the future and there you go. Didn't he get the message that sales are down 30% from last year so far?
This whole report is a joke, the numbers just look that they were made up out of nowhere. Let's revisit these numbers next quarter and at the end of the year. We'll see how ridiculous the sales and price predictions were!
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January 27th, 2012 at 7:57 am 52
@DEFAULT NAMEe: does your open mortgage rate get reset at a new rate at anytime during the length of the mortgage (let say 25 years)?
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January 27th, 2012 at 8:02 am 53
@Patiently Waiting: to add to my rant, his prediction for Sunshine Coast is comical. 2012, price +2.2%. How is that possible when MOI is 40 over there?
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January 27th, 2012 at 8:34 am 54
@Makaya:
The reason why lenders don't offer 25 year fixed rate mortgages is that borrowers are not willing to pay the higher rates that would be required to offset the increased risk to the lender.
If lenders were required to offer fixed rate 25 year terms they would have to increase rates for all borrowers whether or not they wanted or needed longer terms. That would be fine for the bears as it would result in a big fall in prices, but it would result in more foreclosures than if the mortgage market were simply left alone.
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January 27th, 2012 at 8:37 am 55
Signs of desperation:
1) One of the most ridiculously overpriced home in Vancouver:
http://www.realtor.ca/propertyDetails.aspx?proper…
Compare to this one, further east and cheaper:
http://www.realtor.ca/propertyDetails.aspx?proper…
Well, of course, it is NOT selling. It is the only house for sale in the block, and a few blocks away from Cambie, but today the realtor posted a new sign saying: CAMBIE CORRIDOR ASSEMBLY!
Delusion…
2) A house with a sign in Chinese, written by hand, hung to the fence: For sale, call 604 xxx xx xx Pathetic
3) Today I wrote to the mayor to ask for a regulation of foreign ownership
4) Harper's talk about pensions: a clear sign to baby boomers that it is time to cash their RE before the collapse.
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January 27th, 2012 at 8:47 am 56
@patriotz: "The reason why lenders don’t offer 25 year fixed rate mortgages is that borrowers are not willing to pay the higher rates that would be required to offset the increased risk to the lender. It's in french, but living in a bilingual city, I'm sure you'll understand."
I'm not disagreeing with you, but look at the table called "barometre" on this link:
http://www.meilleurtaux.com/
In France, you can get a 30 fix mortgage for 4.45% if you have an excellent credit score and 4.90% if you have a good one. You'll see on the table that the variable ones are indeed cheaper (rev.), but the difference is not that crazy.
The ECB rate is at 1% right now, same as BoC. If you were offered a mortgage at 4.25% for the next 25 years, wouldn't you take it? Don't you think the majority would take it?
In Canada, we're being ripped off by the banks, but that's nothing new!
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January 27th, 2012 at 8:54 am 57
@Makaya: oups, a little problem with the copy/paste.
This is how it was supposed to be:
“The reason why lenders don’t offer 25 year fixed rate mortgages is that borrowers are not willing to pay the higher rates that would be required to offset the increased risk to the lender. ”
I’m not disagreeing with you, but look at the table called “barometre” on this link. It’s in french, but living in a bilingual city, I’m sure you’ll understand.
http://www.meilleurtaux.com/
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January 27th, 2012 at 9:24 am 58
Well – another dismal week. About 22% down over same year same week. This is somewhat the same pace as the past 3 weeks so the trend is the same. Listings slowed this week quite a bit and was below same week prior year.
One key stat which is interesting is on a Y/Y basis, the avg transaction price is down over 4% on attached. for Detached it would also be down 4% but the $20M sale this week made it down only 2%.
Well – we'll see how the REBGV spins it next week. MOI is about 6 based on this week's sales.
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January 27th, 2012 at 9:33 am 59
"Listings slowed this week quite a bit and was below same week prior year."
But last year the CNY was on February 3rd…
Price 4% down with an inflation at 3% … this is quite a haircut on a 1 million$ home. It takes me a while to save that amount of money.
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January 27th, 2012 at 10:24 am 60
Cameron Muir, BCREA's chief economist, predicts (ie. wishes) that BC's home prices will remain "unchanged" in the next 48 months. Good luck Cam.
"Home prices in most BC markets are forecast to experience little change over the next 24 months as the supply of homes for sale more closely matches consumer demand. The average MLS® residential price in the province is forecast to edge down 2.2 per cent to $548,500 this year and remain relatively unchanged in 2013, albeit increasing 0.8 per cent to $553,000."
http://www.bcrea.bc.ca/news-and-publications/news…
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January 27th, 2012 at 10:41 am 61
Larry's got 209 listings and 94 sales tonight in case anyone's wondering.
Almost the end of January and only 1 day with over 100 sales. That's just sad.
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January 27th, 2012 at 10:59 am 62
@VMD: Right Cam. We can always refer to historical price graphs where we will find protracted periods of nosebleed increases followed by sustained flat lines.
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January 27th, 2012 at 11:03 am 63
Oops, just saw full report. in fact Cameron Muir predicts Greater Vancouver Area to experience an average price drop of -3.3% in 2012 (while expecting it to gain back +1.1% in 2013).
That's worse than BC provincial average's drop of -2.2%.
Hard to believe that the okanagan area will fare better than GVA though, with a average price increase of +0.6% (okanagan mainline).
http://www.bcrea.bc.ca/docs/economics-forecasts-a…
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January 27th, 2012 at 11:17 am 64
Latest Canadian household credit statistics from the Bank of Canada (up to the end of Dec. 2011):
http://credit.bank-banque-canada.ca/householdcred…
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January 27th, 2012 at 11:17 am 65
"Hard to believe that the okanagan area will fare better than GVA though, with a average price increase of +0.6% (okanagan mainline)."
Well THANK GOD for that. I was starting to panic with prices down 25%+ and dropping 2% per month.
I feel a lot better. Thanks Cam!
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January 27th, 2012 at 11:33 am 66
Hey, did any of you real estate aficionados know that an east van basement suite can now command "from $3000 to $4500", that Nanaimo St. is "an excellent location" and that a $990,000 property is "great opportunity for the first time buyer"?
http://www.mls.ca/propertyDetails.aspx?propertyId…
Never mind banning mainland buyers, how about banning mainland realtors?
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January 27th, 2012 at 11:36 am 67
@BPOM
What? I thought Knight street was "most convinient location" and having "vibrant activity nearby" at all hours of the day. But Nanaimo street? Well – maybe now that the repaving has been done the whole street is "recently refurbished".
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January 27th, 2012 at 11:40 am 68
Cam Muir is what's called "sell side" economist. Here's a pretty good summation of what they do from one of IceCap's recent newsletters:
http://www.icecapassetmanagement.com/uploads/docu…
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January 27th, 2012 at 11:41 am 69
@Best place on meth:
Just looked at realtor Jane Guan's website, it states in Chinese
"Downstairs has 6 bedrooms and 3.5 washrooms; Upstairs has 3 bedrooms and 2 washrooms. Significant rental income of 3000-4500"
wow.. 6BR downstairs?
http://www.sweethomesvancouver.info/mylisting.asp…
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January 27th, 2012 at 11:49 am 70
@VMD:
"Jane Guan comes from Harbin China. With her double master degrees (MBA, MS) from America and bilingual (Mandarin and English) ability, Jane Guan can provide you prompt, professional service."
I have no doubt her double masters degree from America is legitimate.
The mainland Chinese never lie.
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January 27th, 2012 at 12:07 pm 71
New Listings 214
Price Changes 54
Sold Listings 94
TI:13291
http://www.laurenandpaul.ca
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January 27th, 2012 at 12:45 pm 72
Presented without comment.
http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/van/apa/2793267…
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January 27th, 2012 at 1:31 pm 73
Another reason realtors creep me out:
So I notice a friend of a friend on Facebook being congratulated for winnin a centurion award, I thought great, 100 shot in 100 minutes but no. So I didn't realize that firms hand out and realtors brag a out how much money they make:
http://www.century21.ca/Brokers/C21/en/Awards_Cri…
I really, no, really really look forward to seeing winners of these rewards having to change careers again when they can't sell anymore and have to revert to earning and living on a normal income. Realtors should not make this much money, the system is broken. So many seem to have achieved these awards I just wish I could find a list.
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January 27th, 2012 at 1:33 pm 74
@Best place on meth: Why did they mount the toilet on the wall?
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January 27th, 2012 at 1:37 pm 75
@McLovin:
Yea, wishful thinking, prices are going to go down a little in 2012 then promptly recover in 2013.
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January 27th, 2012 at 1:37 pm 76
"Presented without comment."
Needn't more be said.
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January 27th, 2012 at 2:20 pm 77
@VMD:
Well, sure. I live not far from there, closer to the shops and further from the traffic, and I rent a whole 5 bedroom house for $1600, so $4500 for a 6 bedroom basement suite seems totally reasonable, when you consider that they will have a much better view of the trucks on Nanaimo.
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January 27th, 2012 at 2:28 pm 78
are you stupid or what? what buyers would wanna lock in for 25 years? no wonder you cannot survive anywwhere.
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January 27th, 2012 at 2:46 pm 79
@DEFAULT NAME:
“what buyers would wanna lock in for 25 years?”
Potentially all of them, depending on the rate offered. That’s the case of 75% of the mortgages issued in one European country I’m familiar with. That may be a bit too complicated for you to understand, obviously, since you sound like you’re a proud millionaire homeowner.
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January 27th, 2012 at 7:36 pm 80
@Patiently Waiting:
Wow this piece will go down in history as a classic:
To put it bluntly, he's opposed to any policies that would lead to lower RE prices because that would take away the unearned gains of the greedbags of his generation.
He's perfectly described the fake economy based on debt and the driving away of real economic activity – personified by his own son – but thinks the solution is simply to carve out lower priced cubbyholes for the baristas in this teetering house of cards.
The problem is high prices and the solution is lower prices. Nothing else. And as we've seen, Mr. Market has his own agenda and doesn't care about what our columnist wants or what governments do.
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January 27th, 2012 at 8:28 pm 81
January 2012 data
Average Sales 71
Total Sales 1355
Average Listings 273
Total Listings 5192
Average sell/list 26%
Days in month 21
Days elapsed 19
% days elapsed 90%
Expected sales 1,498
Expected listings 5,739
Max daily sales 117
Min daily sales 30
Max daily listings 428
Min daily listings 176
January 2011 data at same point in month
Average Sales 92
Total Sales 1740
Average Listings 239
Total Listings 4547
Average sell/list 38%
Days in month 20
Days elapsed 19
% days elapsed 95%
Expected sales 1,832
Expected listings 4,786
Max daily sales 142
Min daily sales 40
Max daily listings 292
Min daily listings 165
January 2011 month end data
Average Sales 94
Total Sales 1,876
Average Listings 241
Total Listings 4,820
Average sell/list 39%
Days in month 20
Days elapsed 20
% days elapsed 100%
Expected sales 1,876
Expected listings 4,820
Max daily sales 142
Min daily sales 40
Max daily listings 292
Min daily listings 165
Previous sales volume
1999 953
2000 953
2001 1225
2002 2248
2003 1966
2004 1954
2005 1681
2006 1924
2007 1806
2008 1819
There was a definite rush to get listings up the first 3 weeks of the month, now there is a bit of a lull after the proverbial storm. This corresponded with the advent of CNY and it seems reasonable that sellers wanted to get listings online before the 2 (3?) week holiday.
I expect a more seasonal, though heightened, pattern of listings going forward. Sales will increase due to seasonality (January is always slow) but we're starting from a low base out of the gate. My guess is that there is going to be some additional reported sales activity in the next month.
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January 27th, 2012 at 10:24 pm 82
@80 patriotz: Vancouver, and Canada in general, wouldn't be attractive to foreign investment in the first place had the three federal stooges not implemented polcies guaranteed to start a real estate rush. Once the locals got the ball rolling the oipportunity was inevitably noticed abroad. That Moe Larry Curly proactively faclitiate both ends of this clusterf*ck says all that need be about their 'reign'.
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January 28th, 2012 at 12:04 am 83
@patriotz: Ferry is pathetic for wanting his real estate equity rather than have his grand-daughter be a regular part of his life. She'll be the better for it, get to grow-up in the most interesting city in Canada (IMHO) and maybe become fluently bilingual.
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January 28th, 2012 at 12:26 am 84
@Best place on meth: 9 bedrooms & 2000 square feet? Whats up with that?
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January 28th, 2012 at 1:09 am 85
@Best place on meth:
"“Jane Guan comes from Harbin China. With her double master degrees (MBA, MS) from America and bilingual (Mandarin and English) ability, Jane Guan can provide you prompt, professional service.”
I have no doubt her double masters degree from America is legitimate."
Because I'm a naturally curious fellow and had a few minutes on a Saturday morning, I did some googling. Her LinkedIn profile lists the university as Southeastern. This is a small "Christ-centered" college in Florida that only offers MBAs as an evening or online course.
I think it's safe to say we're talking about, about most, an online course here, with a large probability that Southeastern sounded wonderfully like Northeastern and no one really bothers to check anyway so let's just throw it out there.
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January 28th, 2012 at 1:37 am 86
The inventory build has been exciting but very localized IMO. The two markets that I monitor are downtown townhouses and SFH in a small area of North Vancouver. The 41 townhouses listed right now is right about the average number I have seen in the past year where the spike was in October when we hit 52. The SFH is a much smaller area and currently sits at 4, well down from the peak of 21 reached in October last year and the average of about 13. The few SFH's that are listed are all recent reno's or teardown/rebuilds.
It looks to me like the these townhouses are flippers that permanently list their condo's where in North Van, those that actually live in their homes are sitting on the sidelines to see what happens in the market. I expect we will see speculative areas and product like condo's and SFH westside/richmond really tanking before the outlying areas like North Van start their inevitable slide.
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January 28th, 2012 at 1:55 am 87
Re: "Foreign ownership helps drive dysfunctional housing market," Jan. 18.
Read more: http://www.vancourier.com/business/Letters+week/6…
Mark Hasiuk neglected to mention another downside to foreign ownership. Most of these buyers are really purchasing a lot. They typically engage in the unneighbourly and ungreen practice of demolishing the original house and razing the trees and gardens. As these original homes dating from the '20s, '30s and '40s go down, the character of our older neighbourhoods is effectively erased. This is an irretrievable loss to our city's heritage.
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January 28th, 2012 at 1:57 am 88
Many realtors, if they had the courage to speak out, could tell many stories about distasteful or cleverly improper dealings with the realities and practices associated with various aspects of the real estate market.
Read more: http://www.vancourier.com/business/Foreign+owners…
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January 28th, 2012 at 2:01 am 89
Deb Abbey is a real estate agent at Royal LePage City Centre in Vancouver.
Here is what she has to say !!!
"How will household debt affect the housing market? In B.C., we have big mortgages with high levels of credit card and credit-line debt piled on top. The appreciation in real estate prices has given homeowners a sense of invincibility based on their property assessments. But all that can come tumbling down, as it does from time to time."
Read more: http://www.vancourier.com/business/Ottawa+eyeing+…
Read more: http://www.vancourier.com/business/Ottawa+eyeing+…
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January 28th, 2012 at 2:15 am 90
CBC can also do good videos:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LzCASwjv2w
CBC News, Nov 17, 2011 – Foreign Ownership in the Vancouver Market
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January 28th, 2012 at 3:57 am 91
@jumpin in:
"This is an irretrievable loss to our city’s heritage."
Then why does the city issue the construction permits that allow it to take place?
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January 28th, 2012 at 3:59 am 92
"Downstairs has 6 bedrooms and 3.5 washrooms; Upstairs has 3 bedrooms and 2 washrooms. Significant rental income of 3000-4500″
WTF, 9 bedrooms and 5.5 washrooms in a 2000 square foot house? is this an illegal rooming house?
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January 28th, 2012 at 3:59 am 93
@Best place on meth:
"I have no doubt her double masters degree from America is legitimate. The mainland Chinese never lie."
And you guys wonder why the media has never contacted this blog!
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January 28th, 2012 at 4:43 am 94
"And you guys wonder why the media has never contacted this blog!"
I have never wondered that nor do I care. The media is not interested in the truth or the facts they are interested in selling newspapers or magazines.
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January 28th, 2012 at 4:52 am 95
@DEFAULT NAMEe:
"Then why does the city issue the construction permits that allow it to take place?"
Because the city is legally obliged to allow any construction which conforms to the zoning, of course.
The city has the legal power to introduce zoning which requires heritage preservation or design controls, but the only residential area which has them is Old Shaughnessy, as a result of an initiative by the homeowners themselves.
The reason why this has never been introduced elsewhere is simple – John Q. Homeowner does not want limits on his opportunities to sell his abode for a huge sum of money to someone who wants to tear it down.
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January 28th, 2012 at 4:56 am 96
@patriotz:
"The reason why this has never been introduced elsewhere is simple – John Q. Homeowner does not want limits on his opportunities to sell his abode for a huge sum of money to someone who wants to tear it down."
Any evidence to support such a claim?
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January 28th, 2012 at 5:06 am 97
@DEFAULT NAMEe:
"Any evidence to support such a claim?"
How about that column by Ferry for starters?
Asking for evidence that Vancouver is full of greedbag homeowners is like asking for evidence that it rains in the winter.
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January 28th, 2012 at 5:07 am 98
From: Vancouver Condo Report, Strategics
http://vancouvercondoreport.ca/MarketOverview.asp…
A downturn in the Chinese real estate market will have a negative wealth effect on Chinese real estate investors and will redirect their attention to the home front. The same thing happened when the Japanese real estate bubble burst in the early 90's, and after the Asian economic crises in 1997. The spill over from these crises for the Vancouver condo market resulted in reduced sales and prices. The same thing is likely to happen in response to the problems with the Chinese real estate market.
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January 28th, 2012 at 5:22 am 99
vancouver a green city?
GMAB…
http://www.bcbusinessonline.ca/2011/05/02/disposa…
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January 28th, 2012 at 5:36 am 100
why the media never contact this blog? why would they wanna waste their times with a bunch of whiners?
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January 28th, 2012 at 5:50 am 101
"why the media never contact this blog? why would they wanna waste their times with a bunch of whiners?"
why do you?……
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January 28th, 2012 at 5:57 am 102
@jumpin in: the thing is, crashing real estate in the US took banks down with the crash. Here in good 'ol Canada, we will still have a crash as any asset bubble inevitably crashes however I don't think banks will get taken down. I think a crash will improve our economy as we will need to print money to bail pit CMHC which will devalue the loonie and make Canadian manufacturers more competitive.
The key in my mind is not to have anything tied up in Canadian assets: houses, bonds, or equities.
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January 28th, 2012 at 6:25 am 103
@YLTN @ Work:
You've just said that a Canadian RE bust would make the non-RE and non-consumer sectors more competitive (which I agree with), so I don't see why that's a reason not to be in Canadian equities.
I'm a lot more concerned about the effect that the Chinese RE bust will (no longer may) have on Canadian exporters.
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January 28th, 2012 at 7:35 am 104
"Never imagined you'd be 35, married with two kids, and working a job you can't stand in a town you once vowed to leave? Then this 3-bedroom, 2.5-bath suburban monument to averageness is for you! Easy access to strip malls, chain restaurants, and charming walking trails for quiet sobbing." – Best, truthful ad around….
http://www.theonion.com/articles/the-art-of-compr…
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January 28th, 2012 at 10:08 am 105
@chip: "Because I’m a naturally curious fellow and had a few minutes on a Saturday morning, I did some googling. Her LinkedIn profile lists the university as Southeastern. This is a small “Christ-centered” college in Florida that only offers MBAs as an evening or online course."
Well done. I'd love to know what her "MS" is in, coming from a Christian college. I'll bet it's not biology.
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January 28th, 2012 at 10:23 am 106
@cgh:
I'm sure some seedy office in Beijing makes knockoffs of US college diplomas much like everything else that country copies, steals and fakes.
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January 28th, 2012 at 10:52 am 107
@cgh:
According to her biography, It's master of computer science..
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January 28th, 2012 at 10:54 am 108
@Best place on meth:
Another Saturday night spent alone in the basement throwing around the racist slurs. Same as Friday night. A sad life.
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January 28th, 2012 at 11:05 am 109
@Yalie:
"Debt collection agencies are the lowest of the low……………"
Unless, of course, you have been unjustifiably stiffed by a deadbeat. When I was self employed I used an agency a couple of times. It's amazing what they can do to legally collect a legitimate debt.
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January 28th, 2012 at 11:51 am 110
@Best place on meth:
"Hey, did any of you real estate aficionados know that an east van basement suite can now command “from $3000 to $4500″"
I'm in. As soon as I can cancel my lease on my riverview south van penthouse at a whopping $1000 a month I'm calling about that basement!!!!!!
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January 28th, 2012 at 11:52 am 111
Interesting, perhaps the gov't might tighten mortgage rules again soon this year. Possibly 30 to 25yrs, or increase DP from 5% to 7.5 or 10%. See here:
http://www.canadianmortgagetrends.com/canadian_mo…
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January 28th, 2012 at 12:31 pm 112
@DEFAULT NAME: …Another Saturday night spent alone in the basement throwing around the racist slurs. Same as Friday night. A sad life….
Yes, you should get out more. There's a whole world out there!
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January 28th, 2012 at 12:33 pm 113
@chilled: ..It’s amazing what they can do to legally collect a legitimate debt. ….
Yes, and it's amazing how you can totally ignore them and there's absolutely nothing they can do about it.
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January 28th, 2012 at 1:47 pm 114
A new round of mortgage rules from Ottawa could include tough new measures for calculating how the self-employed qualify for loans and tighten regulations for condominium buyers, according to two separate sources.
More mortgage rules planned if housing market gets too hot
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January 28th, 2012 at 4:48 pm 115
@chilled:
South van river view? Let me guess – your "penthouse" is on the 4th floor?
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January 28th, 2012 at 8:12 pm 116
@ReadyToPop:
"More mortgage rules planned if housing market gets too hot"
If?
“None of this is happening just yet. The housing market has slowed down and the government wants to see what will happen next,” said one source. “If the spring market picks up, then we will see more changes to the rules.”
And here's the real story. The Cons just want to keep the balls in the air. If Vancouver or Toronto appear to be peaking in the next few months, expect no changes. They want the decline to be a slow as possible.
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January 28th, 2012 at 9:12 pm 117
@chilled: "Hey, did any of you real estate aficionados know that an east van basement suite can now command “from $3000 to $4500″”
That fact is widely known at your local hydroponic supply store.
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January 28th, 2012 at 11:01 pm 118
@Some Guy:
Debt servitude is the new black.
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January 28th, 2012 at 11:44 pm 119
The heavily advertised "Lido" condo by Bosa is offering the following to the first 100 buyers
1. one free full-sized storage locker
2. 2 years worth of condo fees waived
3. one free Apple TV
http://www.vancouver-real-estate-direct.com/buzz/…
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January 28th, 2012 at 11:49 pm 120
@patriotz: Agreed, there are attempts to produce a "soft landing" nation-wide. Given the disparity in affordability that requires different rules for different regions, something they seem unwilling to entertain in public.
My guess is the DoF is under extreme pressure to do both more and less by competing lobbies. The words from the BoC signal heavily Flaherty is no longer cooperating like he did last year.
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January 29th, 2012 at 12:54 am 121
@VMD:
What an amusing picture from the LIDO in attempt to sell lifestyle.
http://www.vancouver-real-estate-direct.com/blog/…
Question: how many nights per year in Vancouver is it actually warm enough to sit by the pool after sunset?
A) 2
B) 3
C) 4
D) 5
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January 29th, 2012 at 2:41 am 122
@patriotz
No doubt about that. I wonder who the "sources" were?
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January 29th, 2012 at 2:46 am 123
@patriotz
No doubt about that. I wonder who the sources for the story were?
Def been no official announcements.
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January 29th, 2012 at 3:40 am 124
Another fine example of investor immigration:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/story/2012…
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January 29th, 2012 at 3:53 am 125
@ReadyToPop: From the article:
My favourite weasel word duo: investor and speculator.
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January 29th, 2012 at 4:24 am 126
@VMD:
I wonder how much each latte that the concierge makes actually ends up costing the owners?
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January 29th, 2012 at 4:32 am 127
@ LIDO, this offer doesn't include any flotation devices, sorry not interested!
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January 29th, 2012 at 5:52 am 128
"Another fine example of investor immigration:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/…..unday.html&quo…
This verdict sends a clear message about Canadian values.
Hopefully this will send a message to people who abuse their children and think it is accepted in Canada.
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January 29th, 2012 at 6:39 am 129
jumpin in Says: "This verdict sends a clear message about Canadian values."
Are part of Cnd values fascistic bombing of civilians by canadian pilots from the distance in Afghanistan and Middle east???? you are the taxpayer jumpin and you have BLOOD on your hands
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January 29th, 2012 at 6:58 am 130
@Best place on meth:
Question: how many nights per year does BPOM actually leave his basement suite?
A) 2
B) 3
C) 4
D) 5
The answer is none of the above. He never leaves!
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January 29th, 2012 at 7:09 am 131
Yes PQW, that is part of the Canadian values. Forget about it at government levels…focus on the individual… I would bet that, when asked, the majority of Canadians would say that when others are oppressed that there is an ethical duty to do what can be done to try to remedy the situation. What to do is the challenging part. Sometimes there does not seem to be any other option other than violence. As a Canadian I am quite happy with the blood that is on our hands from WW1, WW2, Korea, Afganistan, and Libya. At least we tried to make things better rather than some who sit on the sidelines spouting off fancy phrases and rhetorical garbage.
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January 29th, 2012 at 7:11 am 132
#131,
bpom never leaves the basement cuz he needs breastfed every other hour.
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January 29th, 2012 at 7:25 am 133
@Burbs Boy:
Actually read your history first. While I agree about the others, WW1 was a complete waste of lives.
It was an Imperial War between the Kaiser of Germany and the King of England. Ironically related (as they were to the Czar of Russia and most of the other Kings and Queens of Europe) Second and third cousins fighting each other.
It was a needless war that killed 9 Million mainly working class folk for no cause at all. i once heard Rex Murphy say that Canada came to age as a country due to their losses on the battlefields of WW1.
BS I would say. Farm boys dying by the thousands for the class system of mother England. Now the wars you mentioned have/had some apparent merit.
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January 29th, 2012 at 7:31 am 134
Don't forget to register for the "Is the Chinese Money Coming?" webinar this Tuesday.
http://coughlinteam.com/index.php?fuseaction=cPag…
This will be an excellent way to find out if the Chinese money is coming, when the Chinese money is coming and how much Chinese money is coming.
And if you "have inside information on the Chinese Money" please call 778-374-3744.
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January 29th, 2012 at 7:46 am 135
ok… getting drawn into non-RE stuff here so I will give it up after this. Certainly agree that WW1 was the least worthwhile however if you were in France or Belgium and the Germans came rolling in perhaps you might be thinking to yourself "I sure hope someone steps up to the plate here". Make no mistake that Germany could easily have taken France over the long term if not for British (and hence the joined at the hip Canadian) intervention. Certainly agree that it was without a doubt one of the largest wastes (on both sides really) in human history.
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January 29th, 2012 at 7:59 am 136
Richmond SFH already close to 1000.
http://vancouvermarketreports.com/intranetimages/…
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January 29th, 2012 at 9:26 am 137
RE Lido by Bosa… Free 2 yrs strata fees incls free coffee every morning lol, maybe they will offer a free happy meal a day next door at rottin ronnys too!
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January 29th, 2012 at 9:37 am 138
@DEFAULT NAME:
"Yes, and it’s amazing how you can totally ignore them and there’s absolutely nothing they can do about it."
Doesn't apply to me. I would have never done business with someone of this mindset to begin with.
I doubt you would understand.
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January 29th, 2012 at 10:21 am 139
@Burbs Boy:
If you want to learn more about WW1 go to Ken Follet website the author of "Fall of Giants"
There is a delightful version of WW1 in it
The one good thing that came out of WW1was a big change in the class system in Britain and probably the rest of western world for example the working class and women got the right to vote
The smarter working class guys saw the incompetence of the upper class in the war and demanded a right to have a voice so as not to be used as cannon fodder for idiots
Ww1 was stupid to begin with and how the generals and most of the officers were beyond inept perhaps there descendants are buying Vancouver real estate now
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January 29th, 2012 at 11:54 am 140
@patriotz: agree completely, I threw equities I the mix but my logic for them tanking is a resource crash from declining Asia demand as you point out. I’d keep away from any company that deals with rocks however oil still has a bright future IMO
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January 29th, 2012 at 1:15 pm 141
Mike Holmes quote is classic."In Canada the banks are more astute in that they don't lend more than the value of a home. That's what lead to the trouble in the U.S". That is exactly what the Canadian banks are doing lending way more than what the value of any home is worth. This fact will be proven.
This can be proven using the lowest level of homeownership. The trailer like the ones in mobile home parks scattered in the seedier neighbourhoods throughout the lower mainland. They CMV(current market value) is approximately $100k and for this you get to live in a parking lot paying $600/month and then one day you need to move the delapidated appendage.
The true market value of the mobile home if you look at a different location a little further south is $30,000.
Look at it yourself as the cost of everything is inflated from a tent in a parking lot to the palatial mansions in the British properties and everything in between.
This example should be a clear illustration even for the most simplistic bull.
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January 29th, 2012 at 1:30 pm 142
http://www.bloomberg.com/video/85104485/
Carney Says Volcker Rule Could Disrupt Bond Trading
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January 29th, 2012 at 1:37 pm 143
The RBC Cash Back Mortgage could be ideal if you are a first-time home buyer with a minimum down payment of 5%.
How Much Cash Can You Get?
The amount of money you receive is based on the size and term of your mortgage-up to 7% of its value up to a maximum of $20,000.
http://www.rbcroyalbank.com/mortgages/cash-back-m…
Interesting. 5% down….up to 7% cash back? Didn't know these were out there.
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January 29th, 2012 at 1:57 pm 144
@Disbelief: Mike Holmes knows as much about the housing market as I know about electrical panels (which is nothing, and which is an example of what he should stick to).
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January 29th, 2012 at 2:07 pm 145
@jumpin in: Carney said Basel 3 being implemented sooner in Canada than rest of world. Also stated that some reforms on "shadow" lending were pushed through last year.
The man's on a decade-long mission to reform the financial system.
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January 29th, 2012 at 2:22 pm 146
I have tired eyes, I read the link:
"Household borrowing surge driven by most indebted"
But my mind saw:
"Household borrowing surge driven by most inbred"
And I thought, "Dave?"
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January 29th, 2012 at 2:33 pm 147
From the trenches (no economics degree, but common sense)
About the paper media: I stopped buying The sun/province more than a decade ago, I get better deals on TP.
Sit by a pool after sunset? Oh my gawd..what rubbish. And you have to sit in a tight miniskirt, nylons, high hells on a hard wooden bench trying to read a toilet paper in the dark after a hard days work with an aching back/neck, growling stomach, full bladder (due to vancouver piss poor job market that does not allow for proper meal breaks or potty time).
It is more like: You get home, thank your gods you were not killed in a commuter accident. Take hot sweaty clothes off, shower to relief back aches/stress/bladder, then grab the micro heated food (cooked on your days off), stuff face from hunger.
Then the brain goes dead, does not want to think anymore, nor see any other human beings.
Oh, just a snap shot of a day in "wonderful" vancouver, of one reality.
And I am not buying anything except basic necessities, my stealth protest against the current state of affairs. House bubbles would not happen with this prudent mindset, but oh well, cant cure "stupid". Screw them.
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