Where are the 3 bedroom condos?

M- and MarKoz brought up this topic – Vancouver seems to be seriously lacking in affordable family housing.

There are lots of 1 and 2 bedroom apartments, but not much available for 3-4 bedrooms until you go to houses.  M- suggest the city requires more large units to be built to provide future homes for Vancouver families:

CoV could require condo developers to include a much larger percentage of 2-bed and 3-bed units in the towers that they’re approving, and require some of those units to have a more family-sized square footage. Maybe in exchange for higher density, to make it less controversial.

It won’t help much of anything today, but it will prevent today’s towers from becoming tomorrow’s ghettos.

My wife and I used to have an 800 sq.ft condo. It was too small for the two of us. Then we got a 1000 sq.ft apartment, and it was enough space for the two of us (we would have liked more, but it was good enough).

Then we had a kid.

The 1000 sq.ft unit slowly became too small for our family, so we’ve upgraded to a house (rental, of course).

We keep an eye on the condo/house markets, and there’s not much selection of 3-bed units out there, until you get into houses.

MarKoz adds:

When I went condo hunting I could find nothing similar. You would have marginal master bedrooms and second bedrooms the size of a closet. The master bathroom was usually huge at the cost of a smaller living room etc. All had fireplaces – a waste of precious wall space in a small unit. Stainless and granite with barely enough counter space to lay a pizza box. Closets were minimal as was out of suite storage.

I moved on to townhouses. 1200 square feet spread over 3 floors is worse than 800 square feet on one floor. So much space given over to stairs and landings.

Who wants these places? Apparently everyone but me. They sure are selling. In the US they have plenty of 3 bedroom units but I guess those don’t attract specuvestors like 565 sq ft one bedrooms.

 

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Burnabonian
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Burnabonian

Because the 5,000 usable square feet per floor of a highrise will generate more revenue for a developer when it’s sold as 10 miserable, claustrophobic shoeboxes than as 3 or 4 livable family homes.

BWilson
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BWilson
Burnabonian is right, supply of new condos is driven by pre-sales which is typically an investor driven model (not end-users). In today’s market the only possible way to get close to a reasonable return on your purchase is to buy small. From a renter’s perspective once you are able to pay more than $2000/month in rent your options really open up because there aren’t that many people in Vancouver who can pay those kind of rents. (makes you wonder who is buying!) Back in 2011 I effectively doubled my square footage by increasing my monthly rent from $1760 to $2335 (moved a total of 3 blocks into a slightly newer building). When you’re buying on a flat $/sq ft basis between the two units that’s a huge loss of yield. Of course these investors buying small right now are still… Read more »
hello sailor
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hello sailor

3 bedrooms suggest ‘heterosexual’.. and vancouver? well.. c’mon.. it’s been ghey for a very long time…

patriotz
Member

My feeling is that if developers were required to build 3br condos many would likely be bought by groups of singles who would have higher incomes to qualify with than families. I also think that developers would design them so they could be de facto divided into smaller suites – we have see this already with 2 and even 1br units.

I think the only really effective way to get affordable housing for families in the core is though non-profits, which unfortunately governments aren’t big on supporting these days.

Heard Herd selling
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Heard Herd selling

Mega realtor Flyers lately, and a few cold calls, not to mention my old agent’s calling trying to get me to jumpbinto the market before the spring rush….LOL get a real job

paulb
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Active Member

New Listings 274
Price Changes 121
Sold Listings 145
TI:15407

http://www.paulboenisch.com

Son of Ponzi
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Son of Ponzi

#3
I’m tired of white, straight people complaining.
Move to the suburbs and leave us be.

Son of Ponzi
Guest
Son of Ponzi

The housing paradox in Vancouver.
Homeless people on the streets, and empty 10 room mansions.

victoria
Member
victoria

The argument I have been hearing the past few years is that in Europe they live in apartments. They sure do. Some are very small (usually young people starting out). Many of the apartments are large and comfortable for families.

I lived in Paris for 15 years. I have friends that have 4 kids in an apartment. However many apartments in the city and burbs are large and comfortable and could support a family of 2 kids or more.

They are so small in Vancouver.

Son of Ponzi
Guest
Son of Ponzi

Germans who have memories of 60% of houses destroyed during WWII, which they rebuild brick by brick are appalled by the wanton* destruction of perfectly good housing stock in Canada.
* see also Wonton as in Wonton soup.

Johnny-boy
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Johnny-boy

Realtor Wu bought a $6 Million house for a client. Realtor Liu a bought $2.9 Million dollar house for a client.

Son of Ponzi
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Son of Ponzi

# 9
They are so small in Vancouver.
You are right. Europeans are bigger than Asians.

Ample Josh
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Ample Josh

Lots of HAM on the west side of Vancouver this weekend. Saw many open houses with Asian buyers all over the place. They were speaking Chinese only and in their interactions with the two Caucasian realtors I noticed very limited English language skills.

Most of the large mansions in Shaugnessy now are almost 100% HAM. The few times I’ve seen people around the grounds it was HAM. It’s amazing how 5 years makes such a big difference, it went from WASP to HAM in no time!

I can’t see this market falling with the large amounts of foreign money I’ve seen still here……I don’t notice any of them being particularly desperate to sell either.

Son of Ponzi
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Son of Ponzi

# 13
very few Caucasian realtors in Vancouver West and Richmond Central.
Meet the new boys.
http://newcoast.ca/our-team

Son of Ponzi
Guest
Son of Ponzi

Talked to my Cardiac Surgeon today.
He’s stressed out.
Bought 2 apartments on Pre-sale 3 years ago, and now has to take delivery
Expected to make a fortune flipping.
But now he’s stuck.
Prices are down, and there is a glut of rentals.
So worried, he’s afraid he may botch a triple bypass surgery and be sued.

pricedoutfornow
Guest
pricedoutfornow
My spouse gets a lot of flack from coworkers who constantly jibe “Why don’t you BUY a place, why are you RENTING?” (like, ew!) And I constantly have our reply ready: We have two kids of different sexes and different age groups (toddler and pre-teen). We rent a 4 bedroom, 2 bathroom house in a good neighbourhood in the COV. Our rent ($2000 per month) is what we would pay for a 2 bedroom condo in the same neighbourhood. And we tried that before, when child #2 was an infant, we tried living in the 2 bedroom condo (also a rental) with all four of us. It was insane. The second bedroom had no room for a dresser, once the crib and bed were in place. We were constantly bumping into each as we passed in the hall. Two people… Read more »
mls watch
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mls watch

At some point I was thinking of buying a charming heritage house in Vancouver. Well, I am done with the idea. We started renting a SFH 2 years ago. For the past 12 months, the landlord has been bleeding money every month. It seems everything is reaching expiry date 🙂 We had 4 minor floods in 7 months !!! Boiler leaked, pressure controller broke, main sewer pipe clogged, pipes frozen by the cold. Not to mention changing the furnace electronics, plus $10 000 for major repairs on the deck and foundations. $5000 taxes per yr. There is newly built condo in the adjacent lot, and our house is now starting to sink, with major cracks appearing in the plaster. I will never, ever, buy an older home at Vancouver prices.

Heard Herd selling
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Heard Herd selling

@MLS watch… Wow if you think a old house requires constant work, try buying a new build that will last maybe 40 yrs, I won’t get started on condos. Developors build to profit over and over, build poorly, come back in 10-15 yrs and fix issuess = cha ching for developers, and debt for homeower

mac
Member
mac

Son of Ponzi is on fire 2nite. Thanks.

Heard Herd selling
Guest
Heard Herd selling

Looks like a townhouse I sold back in 2010, is now for sale at 15% less asking price, plus 2 others competing. :-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-):-) sore face from smiling, sore pockets from bulging cash wads. Time for me to go sleep very very well tonight

Heard Herd selling
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Heard Herd selling

Oh man, the wife just got home from the gym, her friend who she works out with, got a call at hw gym and it was brief, she started to tear up, turns out their 1st open house this past weekend turned up zero offers, I guess they were expecting a few over.t hey bought in 2008 and want out, they are slaves to the bank and have had lousy tenants in the basement suite. And she tells the wife to keep hush hush. Ok bye time for me sweet dreams in my rental:-):-)

King bob
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King bob

Anyone ever look at prelude city homes? New build condo going up with a laneway 3br townhouse for 1.1 mill, yes, this is a laneway home going for 1.1 mil facing someone’s ass.

RFM
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RFM
New York, March 25, 2014: Data through January 2014, released today by S&P Dow Jones Indices for its S&P/Case-Shiller1 Home Price Indices, the leading measure of U.S. home prices, showed that the 10-City and 20-City Composites rose 13.5% and 13.2% year-over-year. Twelve cities and the 20-City Composite saw their annual rates worsen. The 10-City Composite showed a slight uptick in its index level but remained relatively unchanged. The 20-City Composite, a broader measure of home prices, posted its third consecutive monthly decline of 0.1%. Twelve cities declined in January with Chicago decreasing 1.2%. Las Vegas led at +1.1% and posted its 22nd consecutive monthly gain. Despite recent advances, Las Vegas is still the farthest from its high set in August 2006 with a peak-to-current decline of 45%. Dallas and Denver are now less than 1% away from their recent all-time… Read more »
MarKoz
Member
Active Member

Off Topic – WTF Department

The Canada Pension Plan Investment Board is going to finance residential real estate construction in China in partnership with China Vanke, the country’s largest residential real estate developer.

They interviewed the president of China Vanke on “60 Minutes” last year and he said that China had a real estate bubble.

I know I am taking a simplistic blanket view here and that some markets in China may have more potential than others but I can’t help feeling this is a bad idea.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/international-business/asian-pacific-business/cppib-partners-with-chinese-residential-developer-in-250-million-deal/article17656231/#dashboard/follows/

patriotz
Member

@23:

Executive summary: the bounce is over.

“Dallas and Denver are now less than 1% away from their recent all-time index highs.”

Neither Dallas nor Denver saw significant increases during the bubble. In inflation adjusted terms prices in Dallas are the same today as they were in 2000.

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