FFFA! It’s Friday again!

Well well, look at that, you made it to the end of another work week.

This is Friday and that means it’s time for another Friday Free-for-all, our regular end of the week news round up and open topic discussion thread for the the weekend.

Here are a few recent links to kick of the chat:

Can the industry police itself?
Ultimate buy / rent calculator
Boom a bust for heritage buildings
Canada job market not quite best
Leaving the city for better economics
Tiny homes
Is the worst over for Looney?

So what are you seeing out there? Post your news links, thoughts and anecdotes here and have an excellent weekend!

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Oracle
Guest
Oracle

TFW in the lower mainland are the primary cause of high prices in Metro Vancouver.

Read the CD Howe report here http://www.cdhowe.org/pdf/commentary_407.pdf

Summary: Metro-Vancouver has about 40% of all the TFW’s in Canada. That is about 140,000. Add to that about 40,000 illegals who have over stayed their visa.

So 180,000 residents in Vancouver are Temps. ALMOST 10% OF THE POPULATION!

Do the Math yourself. Time to take back Canada from the ruling regime.

Demand an IMMEDIATE END to this program.

Cam Good
Guest
Cam Good

Yep, you can buy a lot of real estate working at Tim Horton’s. That must be it. No bubble. Donut fundamentals are there.

By now folks, before your roll up the rim and get priced out.

Bo Xilai
Member
Bo Xilai

Seems like Concord Pacific forgot the two official languages of Canada are French and English, not Chinese and English…

Article Titled “Does Chinese signage at Vancouver airport send the wrong message?”

http://www.scmp.com/comment/blogs/article/1494933/does-chinese-signage-vancouver-airport-send-wrong-message

patriotz
Member

@1: “TFW in the lower mainland are the primary cause of high prices in Metro Vancouver.”

So those people working for sub minimum wage (after kickbacks) are the ones paying +$1 million for houses? Or would it be the ones who have gone underground and are probably getting even less?

Gotcha.

TFW are responsible for depressing wages (which why the Cons have ramped up the program in the first place). Lower wages do not put upward pressure on RE prices.

patriotz
Member
McDonald’s Canada CEO calls foreign worker controversy ‘bullshit’ The CEO of McDonald’s Canada has branded recent criticism of its use of temporary foreign workers “bullshit” in a conference call to franchisees that was given to the CBC… In a recording of the call given to the CBC, McDonald’s Canada CEO John Betts discusses recent CBC stories on the company’s use of temporary foreign workers and his resulting meeting with federal Employment Minister Jason Kenney.​ “This has been an attack on our brand. This has been an attack on our system. This is an attack on our people. It’s bullshit OK! I used those words when I described my conversation with the minister last week. He gets it.” I guess Kenny “got it” until he decided (or Harper told him) to “do something”. See a pattern here? The Senate is a… Read more »
RFM
Guest
RFM

According to Reuters, the Chinese have become the biggest foreign buyers of apartments in Manhattan, real estate brokers estimate, taking the mantle from the Russians – whose activity has dropped off since the unrest in Ukraine and the imposition of sanctions against Russia by the United States.

Wealthy Chinese are pouring money into real estate in New York and some other major cities around the world, including London and Sydney, as they seek safe havens for their cash and also establish a base for their children to get an education in the West.

Article here: http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/04/25/us-realestate-china-manhattan-insight-idUSBREA3O0TL20140425

Many Franks
Member
Active Member

Stephen Poloz says low interest rates may be here to stay:

Canadians can expect to enjoy relatively cheap borrowing costs for some time to come — even after the economy returns to full capacity and the Bank of Canada starts hiking interest rates, bank governor Stephen Poloz said Thursday.

Reminds me of an economic scheme I floated when I was 5 years old: why not just sell new cars to everyone for a quarter each! Always suspected I had a future in economics.

But the central banker doesn’t think sending that message means people will go on spending sprees.

Why, no, that kind of innumerate behavior would be totally without precedent!

George
Guest
George

@Patriotz #4

Yes, TFWs don’t buy real estate because they can’t afford it. That means they rent. So not only do TFWs depress wages as you correctly point out, they also put upward pressure on rents. It’s a double whammy for working poor Canadians who have to keep with TFWs for minimum wage jobs AND low rental apartments.

Someone on the previous thread pointed out that if the TFWs were sent home, rents would fall in Vancouver and Toronto, and that may act as a catalyst for a real estate crash if overextended homeowners can’t afford their mortgage without renting out their basement for x dollars per month. So indirectly, by propping up rents/demand for rentals, TFWs may be helping to prop up the real estate market.

George
Guest
George
On the subject of sending TFWs home–I wonder if that will happen. Last night on one of the news programs (I can’t remember which one), Jim Sinclair of the Federation of Labour was railing against the TFW program. He made a lot of good points. I think his best line was when he said the fundamental problem with the program is that TFW should be turned to as a last resort, but employers were viewing TFWs as their first choice for an employee. But I didn’t like that Jim Sinclair is calling for all TFWs to be given permanent status in Canada and that their families overseas should be allowed to come here and join them. How many TFWs have been allowed in to Canada under this nefarious scheme? Now the voice of organized labour is saying they should be… Read more »
Johnny-boy
Guest
Johnny-boy

Lets not forget the hundreds of thousands of Canadian TFW (H1B Visa holders) who are working in the US. They are mostly educated and high earners but not all. Though not fast food workers.

patriotz
Member

@8: ” So not only do TFWs depress wages as you correctly point out, they also put upward pressure on rents. ”

Where is the evidence that rents are outpacing inflation in Vancouver or elsewhere in Canada?

Also your premise is flawed since it doesn’t take into account that TFW’s are taking jobs away from Canadians who otherwise would be paid more. That means lower overall wage income which if anything is negative for rents.

patriotz
Member

@10: “Lets not forget the hundreds of thousands of Canadian TFW (H1B Visa holders) who are working in the US. ”

Actually these days most Canadian professionals work in the US under the TN-1 NAFTA visa which is easier to get.

It’s also equally easy to get for US professionals who want to work in Canada, but a lot fewer of them do. I wonder why?

patriotz
Member

@9: “But I didn’t like that Jim Sinclair is calling for all TFWs to be given permanent status in Canada and that their families overseas should be allowed to come here and join them.”

Where did you get that from? Here is a very detailed recent article by Sinclair on the issue which Google turned up:

http://rabble.ca/news/2014/04/jim-sinclair-we-support-rights-migrant-workers-bc

I have to say that I agree with just about everything he says on the issue, and I’m not one to agree with him a lot.

George
Guest
George
@Patriotz #8 You said: “Also your premise is flawed since it doesn’t take into account that TFW’s are taking jobs away from Canadians who otherwise would be paid more. That means lower overall wage income which if anything is negative for rents.” TFWs in the fast food sector are not paid much less than Canadians. At the beginning of this year, the government removed the provision in the program that allowed employers to pay TFWs up to 15% less than prevailing rates. In the fast food industry, you can never pay someone less than minimum wage. It doesn’t matter if you are a TFW or Canadian citizen, if you are working in fast food you are making pretty close to minimum wage. I know people who have worked in fast food jobs for several years and they still only make… Read more »
George
Guest
George

@Patriotz #13

Patriotz, I am not hallucinating. I absolutely heard Jim Sinclair say on television last night that all TFWs should be allowed to stay in Canada and be reunited with their families. Now that I think about it, it was at a press conference aired on Global News. He clearly said that is one of his demands.

patriotz
Member

@14: “TFWs in the fast food sector are not paid much less than Canadians.”

Come on off it. That’s only on paper. The true wage costs of TFW’s are much less because of kickbacks to the employer, unpaid overtime, and other abuses which have been well documented.

Why do you think the employers are so eager to hire them in the first place?

Loon
Guest
Loon

I watched an interesting documentary the other night on netflix, ‘Red Obsession’.

It’s about the high end vineyards in southern france who have seen the prices of their products go parabolic since 2009. 2009 and 2010 were record years which they attributed to the Chinese buyers.

It’s fascinating to compare the obsessed buying mentality to what is going on over here in Van RE.

In 2011 the wine bubble broke and it catastrophically dropped in value, fascinating to see the buyers turn cold on an international product.

Brian Ripley
Guest
Brian Ripley

Oil Can Economics
Canadian Oil Production UP 12% Y/Y at Dec 2013 – 3,822,000 Barrels per day
U.S. Production (2x Canada) UP 13% Y/Y at Jan 2014 – 7,939,000 Barrels per day

As noted in the Oil Production chart, there is more than just housing cost disparity between the U.S. and Canada. Sunshine and employment opportunities are still a very large part of the Canadian emigration drive south.

Canadians buying real estate in the U.S.
+/- 98% of sales were median priced residential properties at $183,000
+/- 86% of sales were on an all-cash basis.
+/- 71% were in Florida, Arizona, and California in a suburban or resort area.
Charts and more at:
http://www.chpc.biz/2/post/2014/04/slippery-slope.html

Son of Ponzi
Guest
Son of Ponzi

431 Open Houses for Vancouver West as of today.
By tomorrow it could top 500 easily.

RealityCheck
Guest
RealityCheck

@Patriotz,

You are one clueless Caucasian.

Many of my extended relatives are here as TFW. They are asset rich with land back home and are income poor in Canada.

One has a net worth about $6 million but works at $10/hr. He says that when he gets PR, he will then sell a chunk of land overseas to buy a house.

You are indeed a would in sheep’s clothing and many posters here are blind to that.

TFW’s are NOT the poor coming here. Most have given huge amounts of $$$ to recruiters/business owners just for the opportunity to get here. When here, it is much easier to apply for PR.

Reality Check
Guest
Reality Check

@Patruotz

But someone like you would say “where is the stats in that”…

Laughable really.

Zero down forty
Guest
Zero down forty

Overnight the HAM truthers have switched to being TFW truthers. What’s next?

Aggregator
Guest
Aggregator
Not even twelve hours after Kenny pulls the plug, the restaurant industry comes firing back with threats and consequences of terminating their TFW program: Restaurants warn of closures in wake of temporary foreign workers ban Canada’s restaurant sector is warning of reduced hours and the possibility that some businesses may have to shut down in response to the federal government’s decision to to impose an immediate moratorium on allowing restaurants to hire temporary foreign workers. Joyce Reynolds, Executive Vice-President of Government Affairs for Restaurants Canada, said restaurant shut downs and long lineups were a reality in Alberta before Ottawa approved the program and those problems are now likely to return. That's what happens when companies get addicted to Canada's QI policy (Quantitative Immigration), and why the government should have never expanded or even started the program in the first place,… Read more »
Son of Ponzi
Guest
Son of Ponzi

#23
Let the greedy, exploitive operators close their greasy restaurants.
What we need is franchise owners who employ and develop local workers, who then in turn will contribute to the local community.

Zero Down Forty
Guest
Zero Down Forty

“Not even twelve hours after Kenny pulls the plug, the restaurant industry comes firing back with threats and consequences of terminating their TFW program”

I don’t see an impending real estate collapse on their list.

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