Where Canadian house prices are up or down

The latest data from the Canadian Real Estate Association is now showing about half of the countries markets with rising and half with dropping prices.

Toronto and Vancouver are doing well so far with a year over year increase of 4.9% and 1.8% .

The big winner? That would be St. Catharines with a YOY increase of 16.1%.

The overall average house price grew 3.1 per cent in the year to January, to $401,143. That’s the smallest increase since April, 2013, but it’s largely a story of two still-hot housing markets: Toronto and Vancouver. Strip out those two cities and average house prices are down 0.3 per cent over the past year.

Home sales, meanwhile, are 2 per cent lower than they were a year ago, CREA numbers showed.

Major energy industry centres like Calgary, Edmonton, Saskatoon and Regina saw some of the sharpest declines in housing demand, TD economist Diana Petramala noted.

There is “a widening regional wedge” in Canada’s housing markets, Petramala wrote in a client note, as oil-importing cities’ housing markets benefit from lower oil prices while producer cities struggle.

Read the full article here.

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Son of Ponzi
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Son of Ponzi

Wealthy Chinese buyers come to Vancouver with nothing but suitcases.
Guess what’s in them?
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/home-and-garden/real-estate/in-vancouver-homes-sold—right-down-to-the-cutlery/article23045477/

ostritch
Member
ostritch
Patz says: There are plenty of posts on this forum telling you how much rent they are paying… Yes but the people on this forum are known for voting down posts that have facts in them. Watch. I’ll post this again. Coach house Mt. Pleasant just sold for $1171/sq. ft. And then I’m going to repost Space’s post from yesterday because it’s the truth. @patriotz – $1K for a tiny 1br/2br basement suite along Main street is not expensive relative to income? Geez… Anything decent for a family of 3 or 4 in Vancouver around Main St will cost you at least $2K and about half of the after tax income of an average family. I wouldn’t call that cheap or affordable. Renting here is not cheap at all, unless you are a VCI bear who can somehow score great… Read more »
space889
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space889
I guess bears on this blog just don’t like the truth when it doesn’t fit their meme….this is sad cuz it locks them into a tunnel vision. For the record, I’m not bullish nor bearish on Van RE market, especially SFH market now. I used to be bearish but I was wrong, wrong, wrong. And no, saying renting is cheaper than buying doesn’t really count cuz bearish means you expect price to fall in nominal terms and so far it hasn’t really happened. Yes I know about inflation but the average person don’t know what the current inflation rate is nor do they care. They only care about 2 things when it comes to housing: nominal price and monthly payments. If Van RE is a stock/ETF, I would buy a long dated straddle/strangle on it cuz I don’t know whether… Read more »
space889
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space889
@ostritch – hence why I’m so skeptical when people here claim that they are renting on Westside in a SFH no less and paying only $2.5K or $3K/month. That’s just too good to be true when I look at Craiglist prices, even with 25%/30% discount. The only ones close to that range are all rundown houses waiting for demolition, or basement/ground floors. Anything decent, never mind new/fancy are way more than that. I know people renting big houses in westside Richmond and their rate is $3K+/month. The only ones renting big houses on the cheap I know of are those that are housing sitting for their friends who don’t care about money. I have tried renting in the past, and for a family of 3, renting any decent sub-1000 sqft 2br condo/townhouse in Richmond will cost $1500 to $1700 minimum,… Read more »
patriotz
Member

@2: “I wouldn’t call that cheap or affordable”

I wouldn’t call it cheap either, nor did I call the metro Vancouver rental market in general cheap. It’s clearly affordable to someone, but it’s not affordable to the average family, just like other trendy central city neighbourhoods across Canada. Rents in these neighbourhoods are high because – surprise – people with high disposable incomes like to live there and can afford them. Result – average families can’t.

“Coach house Mt. Pleasant just sold for $1171/sq. ft.”

But thanks for pointing out once again how ridiculous the cost of buying in Vancouver is compared to renting.

space889
Guest
space889

btw, when I looked Langara Gardens about 2 years ago, their 2br condos starts at $1700/$1800 month and their 2br townhouse starts at maybe $2k/month? That is also a 40yr+ complex with no in-suite laundry and none of the stainless steel fancy appliances. Granted they do have 4 swimming pools.

This is a professionally managed rental only business so I would take their pricing as fairly accurate market pricing. Their location while good is not that convenient since the 57th Ave Canada Line station was not built and 15 Cambie bus has reduced service.

space889
Guest
space889

@patriotz – I think you made a few typos in your response so I took the liberty of fixing it for you. Corrections in ALL CAPS.

—————-
I wouldn’t call it cheap either, nor did I call the metro Vancouver HOUSING market in general cheap. It’s clearly affordable to someone, but it’s not affordable to the average family, just like other trendy central city neighbourhoods across Canada. HOUSING PRICES in these neighbourhoods are high because – surprise – people with high disposable incomes/WEALTH like to live there and can afford them. Result – average families can’t.

“Coach house Mt. Pleasant just sold for $1171/sq. ft.”

But thanks for pointing out once again how ridiculous CHEAP the cost of buying in Vancouver is compared to BUYING IN HK/DUBAI/NY/LONDON/PARIS/TOKYO/BEIJING/SHANG HAI.

Oracle
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Oracle

Guys, it doesn’t matter about the downvotes. Here’s what I go by ;

1) All political parties have said they will keep immigration at or above current levels.

2) municipal officials expect 1 Million more people in Vancouver over the next 20 years.

3) Single Family Detached Lots are not being created. Almost all household formation will be townhouse or condo.

4) most of the 1 million new residents have quite a bit of assets in the homelands.

Now, why wouldn’t detached houses become more expensive and have nothing to do with local incomes. ?

I’m betting on higher values going forward. $1 Million will be the entry point for SFD in metro soon whether I like it or not. !!!!

PopularDelusions
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PopularDelusions

@Oracle

But isn’t the new version of the immigrant investor program failing to meet quota now, due to its requirement to speak English or French, and (shudder) undergo a financial audit?

crikey
Guest
crikey
#61 in previous thread said, “Here is a recent study just done by Credit Suisse and posted b the BBC on the top 1% in the world.” You are completely changing what it is we are measuring. In post #31 in previous thread you said, “There are less millionaires in China than in Canada” I corrected you by pointing to a WSJ news report on how China has more millionaires than anywhere but the U.S.A. Then, you countered by showing a link regarding wealthiest 1% in the world. That is comparing apples and oranges! Top 1% wealth does not equal number of millionaires. I hope that, like me, you are interested in truth, and not just in winning an argument by changing goalposts. You still haven’t countered my source that shows China has more millionaires than China (and China quickly… Read more »
crikey
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crikey

Correction to post #10: “You still haven’t countered my source that shows China has more millionaires than CANADA (and China quickly gaining more)”

space889
Guest
space889

@PopularDelusions – Cuz it is easier to buy entry visa elsewhere in warmer places like Spain, Portugal and Cyrus which would also give you automatic entry to anywhere in EU without a visa! USA is also loosening up their wealthy immigrants program.

For the ones that can’t qualify for those programs but still have enough assets like $100K to $500K CAD, they tend to apply using other programs.

Even without wealthy immigrants, the fact that we are admitting 100K+/yr immigrants means there is upward push on housing prices – since we have to build more units on pretty much the same amount of land. Vancouver West isn’t going to get any bigger in the next 20 years but we will have more people.

Bull! Bull! Bull!
Guest
Bull! Bull! Bull!

Vancouver Mayor Gregor Robertson dating singer Wanting Qu
Rumours were confirmed on Valentine’s Day when Robertson posted a selfie of himself and Qu.

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2015/02/18/vancouver-mayor-gregor-robertson-dating-singer-wanting-qu.html

Bull! Bull! Bull!
Guest
Bull! Bull! Bull!

Are Asian families in southwest Vancouver being targeted for break-ins?

“None of the homes ransacked had residents currently living in them.”

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/are-asian-families-in-southwest-vancouver-being-targeted-for-break-ins-1.2961024

space889
Guest
space889

@crikey – I find that the truth, especially inconvenient truth, are not welcome here….

space889
Guest
space889

@Bull! Bull! Bull! – I guess that busts the gay theories that some posters on this blog like to perpetuate….

He looks happy, but I’m not sure about his claim that his family is happy too….I doubt his ex-wife and kids are too happy about him hanging out with someone who is around same age as his oldest kid….

ostritch
Member
ostritch

Thank you Space. Beautifully executed.

Was next two three guys in a cafe yesterday. One, a local white RE agent. Two, Mainlander, Three, Mainlander’s translator. Guess what the topic of conversation and the paperwork was about.? So no English language skills good enough to immigrate with, the guy was obviously wealthy, and they were talking about job applications. Possibly skilled worker. Who knows, maybe there is a loophole there if you pay someone else to take your job, work in it for a few years, then get processed another way. If you have enough money, nothing stops you.

ostritch
Member
ostritch

Crikey,

Also to note, you don’t have to be a millionaire to buy foreign property. Many family members come together to buy property(its).

patriotz
Member

@12: “the fact that we are admitting 100K+/yr immigrants means there is upward push on housing prices”

Nonsense. Have you seen that chart showing that real US house prices haven’t gone up in 100 years? Don’t you think that a few immigrants have arrived in that time? Not to mention that before birth control the population was increasing by birthrate alone?

Likewise Vancouver or any other Canadian city before the bubble era.

Why is that you think? Well the supply of housing has increased a lot in the last 100 years along with the population. Haven’t noticed?

Bull! Bull! Bull!
Guest
Bull! Bull! Bull!

we’re at the point where petty criminals understand how transnational elites impact on vancouver ( and how to exploit it ).

yet some of the supposed sophisticated operators on this blog are still out to lunch on the subject.

Son of Ponzi
Guest
Son of Ponzi

As this article states, many new expensive homes are now being bought with all the expensive furniture and fixtures included.
If left unoccupied, they could be an easy target for thieves.
Add cost of a security guard to the cost of housing in Vancouver.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/home-and-garden/real-estate/in-vancouver-homes-sold—right-down-to-the-cutlery/article23045477/

Transnational Elite
Guest
Transnational Elite

@Son of Ponzi

Transnational Elites who buy fully furnished homes and let them sit empty are just subsidizing transnational elites like my self, who rent full furnished homes and let them sit empty.

Given the price to rent ration in Vancouver, it makes much more sense to rent a house and let it sit empty than it does to buy it and let it sit empty.

I’m not concerned with what prices do in the future because I am making the correct decision right now.

Bear Vancouverite
Guest
Bear Vancouverite
Since the topic of rents being affordable or not affordable came up, I thought I’d compile a list of actual rents that people I have spoken to pay. I read a lot of people here on VCI that say renting an entire house is cheap, yet I personally have not met anyone who can bring fact to that claim. If you are one such person, please post your rent, housing type, square footage, generla quality, and approximate area and I will add it to a master list I will repost later. I hope that vangrrl and others can participate because I believe or remember they pay low rents (perhaps $2400-2800) for an entire house in Vancouver. So here it is. These are actual rents paid, info as of the past 12-18months: Richmond: $1980/mo 2BR+Den 1100sq ft in 20yr old highrise,… Read more »
Canis
Guest
Canis

Bear Vancouverite and Space889: I think you and your friends could get more for your money in stodgy Kerrisdale.

http://vancouver.craigslist.ca/search/apa?query=kerrisdale&srchType=A

I’ve rented an entire westside SFH for $3000 since 2011. Old house (1923) but decent sized (2500 sq. ft., including fully finished downstairs) and well maintained (new drainage, gutters, fridge, washing machine, some bathroom fixtures). Biggest drawbacks are unusable garage, and trouble it takes to find someone to live in the house when I regularly travel for several months at a time on proceeds from 2011 sale of our westside SFH. (If you can call the latter a problem.)

patriotz
Member

@23: “$700/mo basement unit, East Vancouver (landlord kicked this tenant out recently to sell the house)”

Landlord cannot legally do this (not saying it didn’t happen).

“$1900 for 3BR main floor of East Vancouver home (PNE area). Basement lived in by landlord.”

HAHAHAHA. The joy of ownership.

NB every one of the properties you noted is in the core. Not saying you’re biased, people tend to know people who live nearby.

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