Houses selling at a loss

The great real estate market pause of 2016 seems to be creating some losses out there. Southseacompany pointed out this article that finds 3 homes selling for less than they were purchased for:

Vancouver real estate often gets hailed for excellent returns, but this one has us scratching our head. Three single family detached homes have listed for less than the owners paid for them. The kicker? They were all purchased less than 8 months ago. Is this the beginning of the end for Vancouver’s market or are we just insanely good at finding deals? Check out the listings and you can decide.

The rough estimated losses on those properties range from $73k to $125k if they sell for asking. View all three listings over at BetterDwelling.

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Madashell
Guest
Madashell

Worth repeating: 13 billion in Vanre purchases by Chinese in 2015 (a third of all home sales by volume) reported by Douglas Todd, Vancouver Sun over the weekend. Also in his earlier piece, more than $12 million was donated to the B.C. Liberals by the real estate sector. Way to go Krusty!
http://vancouversun.com/opinion/columnists/douglas-todd-australias-foreign-political-donations-storm-cautionary-for-b-c

Peter
Guest
Peter

But Garth said it is a myth. Can he be sued for giving deceiving investment advice if my portfolio with him goes down? Seems like i would have made more money in Van housing.

patriotz
Member

I will have to side with Garth with this one. It’s a conclusion made without evidence. What is “Chinese” supposed to mean exactly by the way?

Diadora
Guest
Diadora

Evidence: China’s capital outflows, with the estimated 2015 total reaching $1 trillion.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-01-25/china-capital-outflows-climb-to-estimated-1-trillion-in-2015

patriotz
Member

Oh please. That is not evidence of a single house purchase in Vancouver. Even the local RE industry has done better than that.

southseacompany
Member
southseacompany

I believe that 1/3 claim was refuted here on this blog back many months ago, as per the linked article below. National Bank came up with that 1/3 estimate by taking US data based on 77 investors and applied it to Vancouver.

“To arrive at their figures the analysts broke down foreign ownership numbers in the United States from the National Association of Realtors and then cross-referenced those with a survey of 77 wealthy Chinese investors conducted by the Financial Times.”

““The estimated share of purchase volume seems high and we stress this methodology is truly a back-of-the-envelope attempt”

http://bc.ctvnews.ca/one-third-of-metro-van-real-estate-investment-from-offshore-report-1.2831308

dyugle
Guest
dyugle

35% drop in sales after the tax was introduced. That is a couple % over 1/3 but close enough to be one hell of a coincidence. But this can’t be true cause people illegally taking their money out of China report where they got the money from to the Canadian government cause our stats are beyond reproach. If you believe that and you qualify as an election pollster.

patriotz
Member

It’s no coincidence of course. But you are ignoring the knockoff effect on local buyers in a market that was already seeing declining sales for months beforehand.

Just me
Guest
Just me

Even if the true figure is less than 1/3, the problem remains. For example, assuming that Chinese investors hold on to their homes for the long term and are less likely to sell, even a 10% share of purchases would result in a significant increase of the stock of housing held by chinese investors. In fact, given enough time, even lower shares of purchases by Chinese will result in them owning much of the stock, as long as they sell at a lower rate than the locals.
In practice, there are both inflows and outflows. I suspect that the outflows (liquidation) out of Vancouver RE by chinese investors is close to zero!

Bear Vancouverite
Member
Bear Vancouverite

I completely agree. This is why even if foreign purchases are very low I’d like to see more taxation on foreign ownership and owner purchases to discourage the total number of dwellings purchased and then held by foreigners.

patriotz
Member

The real solution is more taxation of houses owned by those not paying local incomes taxes whether they are foreign or residents. If this sounds like a plug for the NDP that’s because it is.

YVR
Guest
YVR

Lets see if that is part of the NDP election platform. All we have heard so far is subsidized goverment child care coming from the NDP.

chilled
Member
chilled

If elected, the BC NDP’s first act will be forming a committee of lesbian, transgendered, gravity challenged mal-contents with the express intent of ending female circumcision in TogoLand, or something as equally stupid. Next year my intention is to do something I have NEVER done before – vote BC Liberal. The BC NDP has had years now, to purge the party of the nutcases and social justice warriors and return to the party representing the working class. They have chosen not to and Dave Eby doesn’t quite cut it.

patriotz
Member

“Next year my intention is to do something I have NEVER done before – vote BC Liberal”

But that will really hurt the Christian Heritage Party’s total in your constituency.

patriotz
Member

Nonsense. First of all the actual election platform won’t be released until next years (nor will Christy’s). Why not take a look at their home page to see what they are talking about.

http://www.bcndp.ca/

Portlander
Guest
Portlander

Once a foreign buyer sells, is it easy for them to then keep the money in Canada? In a Canadian bank? If so, then they may not care so much about losing some money if they can successfully launder the rest and leave it outside of China.

history
Guest
history

President-elect Donald Trump has said his first 100 days will be dedicated to restoring “honesty, accountability and change to Washington” through the following seven steps:

1. A Constitutional Amendment to impose term limits on all members of Congress
2. A hiring freeze on all federal employees to reduce federal workforce through attrition (exempting military, public safety, and public health)
3. A requirement that for every new federal regulation, two existing regulations must be eliminated
4.. A five year ban on White House and Congressional officials becoming lobbyists after they leave government service
5. A lifetime ban on the White House officials lobbying on behalf of a foreign government
6. A complete ban on foreign lobbyists raising money for American elections
7. Cancel billions in payments to U.N. climate change programs and use the money to fix America’s water and environmental infrastructure

patriotz
Member

1. Presidents play no role in amending the Constitution. 2. This would gut the remaining Federal workforce in areas such as consumer safety, and workplace and environmental protection. 4. This would require legislation. 5. Ditto. 6. At least would require legislation and might require the Supreme Court to overturn Citizens United decision.

YLTNboomerang
Member

1. Yup
2. EPA –> done!
3. EPA –> done!
4, 5, 6. Legislation is no big deal and normally with house and senate under GOP control this could get pushed through but something tells me the GOP would only let 5 and 6 pass.
6. This will happen, it is a keystone of Trump’s and the GOP’s.

Trump wants to put the US on the same competitive footing as China through a combination of deregulation in the US and CVD’s on Chinese imports. Enviro BS is an easy one – I’m not a climate change denier I am just questioning our direct impact and ability to connect carbon with climate change as 100% responsible. Until the climatologists can mathematically predict the weather next month I will ignore their million year models.

CanNeverThinkOfAGoodName
Member
CanNeverThinkOfAGoodName

“Until the climatologists can mathematically predict the weather next month I will ignore …”

They will never predict weather next month. Not through ignorance but due to the nature of the phenomena.

Tac
Guest
Tac

You can deny it if you want. But you are not an authority to make any recommendation

YLTNboomerang
Member

I’m not denying, I am categorically saying the science has too many variables and cannot be proven yet. There is just as much chance that changes are part of a natural cycle as they are manmade. As for authority, I appreciate the anonymity of the internet so will not disclose my identity but I spent 10 years as an engineer in the field. I argued the global warming by CO2 side as it supported my employment all the time knowing that the data can easily be manipulated to argue any point you want.

Tac
Guest
Tac

Again you can’t say what you are saying scientifically because it is not science. Whether you have doubts and do not believe in scientific information on this topic is not relevant.

CanNeverThinkOfAGoodName
Member
CanNeverThinkOfAGoodName

@YLTN
(1)That’s not the case. On the contrary, it is very well established — no longer an open question. http://www.nasa.gov/press-release/nasa-releases-detailed-global-climate-change-projections

(2) Engineers are not generally scientists; they are engineers. Arguing the claims your company pays you to argue is not science and not research. What gives you away is that you say “the science … cannot be proven yet”. No scientist talks this way about any part of science.

different this time
Guest
different this time

Trump is an A-hole who stiffed small businesses, treats women like whores, was a shyster who is being sued for his ‘university’ and evaded all taxes for the last 8 years.

For f’s sake pull your heads out of you asses and stop treating him like the second coming of Christ.

Best place on meth
Guest
Best place on meth

What stage are you at right now, denial or anger?

Just kidding, I don’t give a fuck.

Tac
Guest
Tac

You sound like campaign. He is not prime minister of Canada. If you like him so much, get a green card and leave..

CanNeverThinkOfAGoodName
Member
CanNeverThinkOfAGoodName

He and his trumpettes are likely to inflict much damage on Canada.

chilled
Member
chilled

His father was Christ you nimrod, try to keep up.

Portlander
Guest
Portlander

None of this answered my question in any way.

southseacompany
Member
southseacompany

“Bond Markets’ $1-Trillion ‘Trumpflation’ Wipeout A Bad Sign For Canadian Housing” < Huffington Post

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2016/11/14/bond-markets-lose-1-trillion-canada-real-estate_n_12962374.html

"Canada’s housing market could soon be suffering from a new condition, one that a TD Bank economist is calling “Trumpflation.” But "Trumpflation" wouldn't mean rising house prices — it would mean higher mortgage rates, leading to worse times for the housing market."

"Still, the same “Trumpflation” phenomenon that’s brutalizing the bond markets could also hit Canada’s housing markets, because some mortgages in Canada are linked to U.S. bond yields, and because changes in Canadian bond yields tend to follow trends in the U.S."

southseacompany
Member
southseacompany

“Get ready for higher interest rates under Trump, says RBC, as it downgrades REIT sector”, Financial Post

http://business.financialpost.com/investing/get-ready-for-higher-interest-rates-under-trump-says-rbc-as-it-downgrades-reit-sector

“A surge in interest rates under Donald Trump could spell bad news for Canada’s real estate investment trusts, says a new report from RBC Capital Markets. “

southseacompany
Member
southseacompany

“Zillow: Mortgage interest rates skyrocket after Trump victory”, Housing Wire

http://www.housingwire.com/articles/38520-zillow-mortgage-interest-rates-skyrocket-after-trump-victory

“According to data provided by Zillow, the 30-year fixed mortgage interest rate spiked in the aftermath of Trump’s election, rising from 3.38% on Tuesday to 3.8% on Monday morning.”

paulb
Member
Active Member

New
187
Price Change
64
Sold
118

TI:9487

http://www.paulboenisch.com

Bear Vancouverite
Member
Bear Vancouverite

Thanks Paul.

Inventory still hovering at or below 9500, and sales to list doesn’t look that bad atm.

Hyper-mega-Bull
Member
Hyper-mega-Bull

Don’t forget, Mexicans no longer need visas to visit Canada and Vancouver has direct flights.to Mexico city.

Best place on meth
Guest
Best place on meth

So how do we play that if we want to profit?

Open a taco stand?

Tac
Guest
Tac

You seem to be big on meth. Meth stand, for you.

notlaughing
Guest
notlaughing

if you’re going to spar with the class clown, try and bring some game fuckwit.

Combat roach
Guest
Combat roach

The same goes for the whole European Union and there are plenty of direct flights from there. What’s your point?

Oracle
Guest
Oracle

Oh please, European union has a higher quality of life. Barely any immigration from there.

Canada way better than Mexico.

However, these will be poor migrants. So renters.

Combat roach
Guest
Combat roach

How they will afford $4K for the 1BR, assuming rents will skyrocket as you keep saying!

Oracle
Guest
Oracle

Lol. Live 5 per room. Declare refugee status.

You guys are so naive.

Stratahacker
Guest
Stratahacker

In LA they live five per room in places that go for $700 per month not $4k

Oracle
Guest
Oracle

Word is they are going to come by foot as flights require an eTA now.

I seriously expect about 500,000 to cross into Vancouver within 12 months. Would if i was going to be deported back to Mexico.

Rents are going to be fucked. As soon as i see a trickle coming in, I’m buying anything i can get my hands on.

Newcomer
Member
Newcomer

You are so cute. I’m glad somebody is willing to rent to Mexican refugees even though they won’t have any money. You are a kind hearted woman.

Bear Vancouverite
Member
Bear Vancouverite

If 500,000 Mexicans earning low wages come to Vancouver I don’t see how they will add any pressure to rents. How many of those low wage earners can pay $2-4k rent?

You always talk about 6 low wage earners banding together to rent a place, how many landlords want 6 tenants in a 1BR 1BA income unit?

bullwhip29
Guest
bullwhip29

the vacancy tax is a game changer though. landlords will have to lower the bar significantly now or implement tedious and convoluted schemes to make it look like someone is living there for at least 1/2 the year.

Stratahacker
Guest
Stratahacker

Apparently you don’t understand that just because they don’t need a visa does NOT mean they get automatic entry. If you are relying on Mexican migrants to save vanre you are more grossly deluded than I ever imagined.

Just me
Guest
Just me
Best place on meth
Guest
Best place on meth

Seems like we’re scraping the bottom of the barrel of poorer chinese buyers if they’re looking at $350K places in Houston and Malaysia to get their money out.

“Sydney, Vancouver, Hong Kong, London and a handful of other cities have long been popular destinations for Chinese buyers.

The difference now is that those traditional hotspots are starting to lose their appeal, due to soaring prices and new measures to deter an influx of overseas money.”

Tac
Guest
Tac

Maybe you should put your money where you mouth is, Go ahead. While at it, get your Green Card and join your hero Trump and admire him, day in and day out.

ostritch
Member
ostritch

Tried to tell this blog Texas was hot but Patriotz said no.

patriotz
Member

Got a quote for that?

ostritch
Member
ostritch

Yup. End of August. It’s there.

YLTNboomerang
Member

That would suck, I’m heading down there for an interview at the end of the month. The irony if I moved to TX only to buy into a Chinese fuelled bubble only to leave a crashing Vancouver behind!

Combat roach
Guest
Combat roach

They are like worst pandemic disease. Until proper prevention, protection and treatment are in place, they will continue to devastate the life of the rest of humans across the world. We already know it very well…

Best place on meth
Guest
Best place on meth

Not just humans, every species is at risk to the rapacious locusts.

Stratahacker
Guest
Stratahacker

Besides eating dogs, just look at what they did to that poor polar bear in the mall. One wants to resist being judgmental, but with these people being nonjudgmental means siding with evil.

Shut It Down Already
Guest
Shut It Down Already

Shut up you racist.

Bren
Guest
Bren

For what’s it worth : 2 empty homes on my street. One has trades people working on the inside recently. The other had a crudely written ‘For Rent’ sign on the front lawn.

Conicidence ? Maybe. But a few more neighrbours would be nice

ostritch
Member
ostritch

How empty is your street? Which hood?

No Money Down
Member
No Money Down

I also noticed a house a couple of blocks south-east of King Ed and Cambie. Total HAM zombie neighborhood. It sold in the summer for $3.8M (I believe). Basically a tear-down on a 50ft corner lot.

Currently undergoing a superficial interior update (dry wall/painting). Looks like it’s getting ready to rent out.

Whistler or Bust?
Guest
Whistler or Bust?

I rent in Kerrisdale near the ice rink. I figure on my block there are 4-6 empty houses out of maybe 20-25.

southseacompany
Member
southseacompany

“Trump’s win is a game-changer for mortgage strategies in Canada”, Globe & Mail

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/personal-finance/genymoney/amid-rate-market-uncertainty-nows-the-time-to-strategize-on-housing/article32844796/

“If you’re buying a house or you already own one, it’s time to strategize. We don’t know how much rates will rise or for how long. Mr. Trump has yet to fully announce his economic policies, much less get them implemented. But what’s already clear is that the housing outlook is more uncertain today than it has been since the financial crisis in 2008-09.”

southseacompany
Member
southseacompany

“Trump dump: Bond prices lose $1T as investors fear higher debt and inflation”, CBC News
http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/donald-trump-bond-market-impact-1.3850307

“”Consider this,” Bank of Montreal economist Benjamin Reitzes said Monday: “The price on 30-year Treasury bonds fell nearly five per cent on Wednesday, erasing two full years of coupon payments.” The 30-year has since lost another 10 basis points since Reitzes said that.”

“And Canada isn’t immune. The Canadian government’s 10-year bond saw its yield surge by 27 basis points to 1.43 per cent, Reitzes noted. On the Friday before the election, that bond was priced at 103.10. On Monday, it had slumped to 99.60.”

Oracle
Guest
Oracle

I’m thinking prices are going to go up after this brief correction. A tier 2 city in Northern India (Chandigarh) has an average wage of about $10/day.

But detached homes on decent lots are going for $8 Million (40 Crore Rs). TALK ABOUT BEING PRICED OUT!!

And a tier 2 city? WTF! Who knows where the top is in Vancouver.

http://www.99acres.com/4-bhk-bedroom-independent-house-villa-for-sale-in-sector-4-chandigarh-5500-sq-ft-spid-N27553201?pos=SEARCH&sid=UiB8IFFTIHwgUyB8IzMxIyAgfCAyIHwgNzMgfCM1IyAgfCAyICM0MCN8ICA=

Combat roach
Guest
Combat roach

Are you giving up on Chinese and shifting bets on Indians? Keep us posted so we can beat the market.

Oracle
Guest
Oracle

Just pointing out that prices have no relation to income a when population is growing rapidly/population pressures.

Newcomer
Member
Newcomer

Nonsense. Population growth in India is much lower than it was in the past, but prices are going up much faster. The two are essentially uncorrelated.

Newcomer
Member
Newcomer

This is amazing, Oracle is right about something!

Yup, Indian prices are through the roof. Chinese prices are through the roof. The madness has spread all over the globe, with the exception of the US, Japan and Germany and possibly some other continental European countries.

Either this will end badly for the rich countries, who will have much less money than the people in the smaller, poorer countries, or the people in the smaller, poorer countries will be completely screwed when the whole thing corrects to the advantage of the rich. Hmmm. Which is more likely….

southseacompany
Member
southseacompany

“How Donald Trump blew up the bond market and changed everyone’s view of interest rates”, BNN Video

http://www.cnbc.com/2016/11/14/donald-trump-blew-up-the-bond-market-and-changed-everyones-view-of-interest-rates.html

” In a flash, the world has changed for bond investors, savers and borrowers.”

bullwhip29
Guest
bullwhip29

imho at the end of the day Trump will wind up being all talk and no action. investors making bold bets on sweeping changes and the resulting market will get torched for the umpteenth time since 2008

Stratahacker
Guest
Stratahacker

With all due respect, the bond market is always right.

Oracle
Guest
Oracle

Inventory at 9400 Level.

Look like we are going to have an 8K party on Dec 2.

YVR
Guest
YVR

I guess the empty home tax penalty of $10K per day caught Air bnb’s attention. Air bnb’s are automatically classified as empty homes and subject to the penalty if not declared as an empty home by the owner.

Airbnb removes 130 Vancouver listings
the company believed the listings to be “commercials operators”

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/airbnb-removes-130-vancouver-listings-1.3213200

Sellnoworbepricedin4evah
Guest
Sellnoworbepricedin4evah

Obviously a lot of these jumped to Craigslist. Check out sublets section. A whole bunch listed by someone called Polina

Sellnoworbepricedin4evah
Guest
Sellnoworbepricedin4evah

Whack a mole!

Sellnoworbepricedin4evah
Guest
Sellnoworbepricedin4evah

And why ate all the bumped to cl ex Airbnb listings all only avail until April 30 2017?
What’s changing on the rules on that date?

YVR
Guest
YVR

I guess they expect to have them all sold by April 30th.

Sellnoworbepricedin4evah
Guest
Sellnoworbepricedin4evah

My guess they sublet them in regular rental stock until spring. Then sneak them back on Airbnb for high paying summer months.

YVR
Guest
YVR

Just in time for the new rules which would make everyone one of those illegal and subject to a $10k per day fine.

Newcomer
Member
Newcomer

For heaven’s sake, read the bylaw or an article about it or something. You have completely misunderstood when the 10K fine applies.

bullwhip29
Guest
bullwhip29

he is referring to the fines for evading the vacancy tax (not the tax itself)

Newcomer
Member
Newcomer

Not even close. Tax is not until next year. It’s 1% per year, unless you lie about it. And AirBNB doesn’t give a damn about taxes or fines that its users might end up paying, so that certainly would not motivate them to pull the ads.

YVR
Guest
YVR

Air bnb gives a damn that the new city rules will shutdown most of their rentals.

1% a year extra tax probably makes Air bnb unviable. There are 4 prime rental months and that is $2500 per month off the top line on a $1 Million condo. Even worse for those that rent for a few weeks a year and will have to declare as an empty home the full year or be subject to $10K per day fine. With air bnb it basically advertises the empty homes for the city to cross reference with those declared. Shooting fish in a barrel.

Bear Vancouverite
Member
Bear Vancouverite

I disagree this would make Airbnb unviable. I use Airbnb heavily as a guest and on average my willingness to pay is strong enough that the 1% might result in some listings going up but it won’t massively reduce the demand. There’s simply no comparison between a quality Airbnb host vs a local hotel even if you factor in the small 1% tax.

What we need is the 1% tax + more taxes to make it “less viable” for smaller operators who aren’t serious, and to make hotels more competitive against Airbnb.

bullwhip29
Guest
bullwhip29

Many operators who own multiple properties in Gr Vanc will be effectively put out of business as a result of the new rules and the steep fines that will go along with this sort of activity. The city is far less concerned about someone renting out a room in their principal residence vs all the secondary properties being advertised and run like hotel rooms.

Newcomer
Member
Newcomer

Correct.

bullwhip29
Guest
bullwhip29

not to mention owners of homes w/ laneway house, duplex, 3-plex etc will have to adopt totally new business plan if they are currently advertising the extra space on airbnb

bullwhip29
Guest
bullwhip29

exactly. an airbnb ad with no license posted will be deemed to be an illegal rental

Newcomer
Member
Newcomer

Yes, but that is no skin off AirBNB’s nose. And particularly not now, as the rule is not in effect. AirBNB is taodying up to city cousel. But you have completely misunderstood the rules.

bullwhip29
Guest
bullwhip29

actually i think you are misunderstanding things. perhaps not now, but they will be put under microscope once the new regs kick in. city will make airbnb (and other online rental sites) remove listings that do not include business license # unless property is located outside of gr vanc and once a business license is granted to a particular individual the city will not issue you another one. the vacancy tax is targeted at empty secondary properties that you wont be able to list on airbnb going forward (regardless if you pay the tax)

Newcomer
Member
Newcomer

Yes, I understand all that but YVR seems to think that AirBNB can be fined for things other than posting without a license and, in particular, he thinks AirBNB removed these listing because they thought they might be fined for them. That is obviously impossible as the regs aren’t even in effect yet.

I agree that the new regs will take a big bite out of the AirBNB business, but let’s remember what the rules are and not get them all mixed up.

YVR
Guest
YVR

Newcomer please don’t tell me what I think. Air bnb will not be fined. It is the property owners that will be fined. This will result in much less business for Air bnb which is why they are concerned and making changes to try to get the city to change its mind. Get it?

YVR
Guest
YVR

You have no clue what you are talking about. The new rules will make any illegal air bnb taxable and fineable as an empty home. The new rules also restrict air bnb to spare rooms as part of a principal residense and all must be licensed with the license referenced in the air bnb ad. Further stratas must give written permission even for spare rooms. No stratas allow air bnb. Air bnb will be all but shutdown in Vancouver.

Patiently Waiting
Member
Patiently Waiting

Yeah, I guess this is going to force even the most apathetic and incompetent stratas to deal with the issue. Once they are aware, they have to say “no” on advice of their lawyers, insurers and bankers.

Newcomer
Member
Newcomer

Yup.

Newcomer
Member
Newcomer

No, you are mistaken. The new rules mean AirBNB would pay a fine if they posted a listing without a corresponding business license number, but AirBNB is not responsible for empty house taxes or fines. Those would be paid by the owner of the property. Law is hard, and it helps if you read about it before you start posting.

bullwhip29
Guest
bullwhip29

YVR is right. the important point is that this means significantly less business for airbnb, no ifs, ands or buts about it.

Newcomer
Member
Newcomer

Well, sure, if that is what YVR said. But it isn’t. YVR said AirBNB pulled listings because of the potential for a 10K/day fine. But that is not true.

You let yourself get too excited, bullwhip29. Keep clam and pay attention.

Sellnoworbepricedin4evah
Guest
Sellnoworbepricedin4evah
Oracle
Guest
Oracle

And the idiot T2 is off to sign another trade deal with a third world country.

HAMster
Guest
HAMster

Royal Bank raises mortgage interest rates:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/royal-bank-mortgage-rates-1.3851423

Effective immediately, for a three-year fixed rate mortage, borrowers with amortizations of under 25 years will pay 2.69 per cent —an increase of 25 basis points.
The four-year rate has jumped to 2.79 per cent, up 30 points, and the five-year is now 2.94 per cent — also up 30 points.
Rates for homeowners who want to take 25 years or more to pay down their mortgage have jumped by even more: The three-year rate is now 2.79, the four-year is 2.89 and the five-year is 3.04 per cent — increases of 35, 40 and 40 points, respectively.

YVR
Guest
YVR

Last month you could get a 5 year 30 year amortization for 2.19. This accounted for most mortgages. Now it is 3.04. That is almost a 40% increase in interest over night. Waite till the Fed raises in Dec and the new bond rates kick in. We could be at 4% soon.

Oracle
Guest
Oracle

But thats not what drives the market here in Vancouver. Its foreign money….cash.

space889
Member
space889

Good! Makes all the condo & TH cheaper! Make all the local owners sweat and worry and go bankrupt! I take 3 distress sales, my friend take 3 distress sales, kick stupid owner in groin, make them pay high rent, make us richer!

southseacompany
Member
southseacompany

“Stalled Vancouver housing market drags down stats for all of British Columbia”, Financial Post

http://business.financialpost.com/personal-finance/mortgages-real-estate/stalled-vancouver-housing-market-drags-down-stats-for-all-of-british-columbia

“British Columbia home prices continued to drop sharply last month but the declines are being driven by the Vancouver market where sales continue to slump, say realtors in the province.’

Newcomer
Member
Newcomer

Or, stated another way, idiots in the last-to-get-the-memo places are dragging up stats for all of BC.

bullwhip29
Guest
bullwhip29

moron, money is simply being plunked down in tax free jurisdictions not just in BC but across Cda. how else do you explain the activity on the island, ok, sunshine coast and fraser valley OR the commercial staking rush for commercial lots in richmond?

ostritch
Member
ostritch

Agree.

Newcomer
Member
Newcomer

My, you have a friendly way about you! Go check activity on the island against the date when the tax was announced. The Internet is so handly.

southseacompany
Member
southseacompany

“Condos follow Vancouver’s detached home slump”, Metro News

http://www.metronews.ca/news/vancouver/2016/11/15/condos-follow-vancouvers-detached-home-slump.html

“Statistics published by REBGV show that prices have fallen for most property types in many neighbourhoods between September and October. MLS statistics show the benchmark price for a condo on Vancouver’s Westside fell 2.5 per cent between July and October.”

bullwhip29
Guest
bullwhip29

the is just the beginning of greater divergence between condo/apt and detached. with all the new measures in place (or soon to be) the condo as an investment will be the worst place to put your money. top shelf view or well located detached will always attract a buyer at some price. owners of pre-sale or recently built condos in some “concept” neighborhoods will wind up finding zero interest if they intend on flipping and getting out of the market. owners of these will have no choice but to add to quickly expanding rental pool and pray they can find someone both willing to pay their mortgage for them and responsible enough to not completely destroy their property in 3 months flat

Newcomer
Member
Newcomer

It better be a pretty good prayer as we have repeatedly shown that rent on a new condo in the Vancouver area will not cover mortgage unless the owner supplements it by at least the monthly pay-down amount.

bullwhip29
Guest
bullwhip29

my bad…i meant “help pay their mortgage”

space889
Member
space889

Maybe because principle repayment isn’t really part of the cost of operation? But rather financing decision?

southseacompany
Member
southseacompany

‘RBC hikes some fixed mortgage rates as bond yields spike”, Globe & Mail

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/personal-finance/household-finances/rbc-hikes-some-fixed-mortgage-rates-as-bond-yields-spike/article32847841/

“Royal Bank of Canada is boosting its five-year mortgage rate, a move that follows rival Toronto-Dominion Bank and responds to spiking bond yields as well as Ottawa’s tighter mortgage rules.”

southseacompany
Member
southseacompany

“Vancouver home prices dip for first time in almost 2 years, Ontario prices rise”, BNN

http://www.bnn.ca/vancouver-home-prices-dip-for-first-time-in-almost-2-years-ontario-prices-rise-1.608362

“Canadian home prices rose in October as continued strength in Ontario, the most populous province, offset the first decline in Vancouver in almost two years, the Teranet-National Bank Composite House Price Index showed on Tuesday.”

patriotz
Member

As others have already pointed out, Vancouver falling with Toronto continuing to rise is the worst case scenario for the former.

bullwhip29
Guest
bullwhip29

Vancouver’s last Inner Harbour marina space goes on market
http://vancouversun.com/business/local-business/vancouvers-last-inner-harbour-marina-space-goes-on-market

>>> imho this wont be the last. eventually much of port of vanc current operations will be relocated after cooler heads (and greased palms) prevail. the new massey bridge is key a piece of the puzzle.

space889
Member
space889

Political contribution & lobbying are the best investment you can make by a HUGEEEE margin.

southseacompany
Member
southseacompany

“Strong U.S. retail sales reinforce December interest rate hike”, Globe & Mail

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/international-business/us-business/us-october-retail-sales-beat-expectations-prior-month-revised-up/article32847749/

“U.S. retail sales rose more than expected in October as households bought motor vehicles and a range of other goods, pointing to sustained economic strength that could allow the Federal Reserve to raise interest rates next month.”

ostritch
Member
ostritch

Last time NAFTA was negotiated hard to get water rights in Canada. That was Clinton vs Mulroney. This time it’ll be Trump vs Trudeau. Who do you think will win?

space889
Member
space889

Nestle already owns water rights in this country. Pumping fresh water out of BC at rate of $2.25 per million liters. It also recently outbid 2 Ontario towns for exclusive rights on 2 water wells.

ostritch
Member
ostritch

Was that part of a trade deal or a private sale?

space889
Member
space889

I think they are water permits / license. But I’m not surprised if water rights were in the latest free trade deals. Nestle do push for that since they don’t believe in water is a fundamental human rights and should be privately owned and priced.

space889
Member
space889

Funny reading all the bear comments. Love it! Almost as good and hilarious as those Clinton supporters who are crying and rioting right now in US.

I’m sure all the new measures make housing less appealing will increase supply, drop prices, and make every bear happy owners of SFH in nice little hoods like West Van / Van West, and other choice spots they so deserve to live in.

wpDiscuz